Upcoming Wildlife Commission Meeting: 1/7/2021 - NE Whitetail Rules

[andersonjk4]

In light of the recent discussions (on here and even on the Meateater podcast) about lack of hunter participation in the WDFW and Commission meetings I have been trying to make a concerted effort to identify upcoming meetings. As I come across upcoming meetings I will try to post them up here.

That said, the next Wildlife Commission meeting is January 7th. The agenda:
• NE WA white-tailed deer hunting rule options for the 3-year packet CR-102
• General discussion – current events

https://wdfw.wa.gov/sites/default/files/2020-12/special_meeting_notice__january_7_wildlife_committee_web_conference.pdf

[cem3434]

Tag

[hunter399]

Now these new zoom meetings are we just allowed to listen.Or is there time set aside for public comment.
I know old meetings they would allow the public an hour or so to add comments.

[hunter399]

Thanks for link will be definitely listen to this meeting.

[Ghost Hunter]

Tagging

[bearpaw]

Hunting season setting and rulemaking
https://wdfw.wa.gov/hunting/regulations/season-setting#

amazingly, I see some good things in some of the proposals...

Its very important to express your thoughts on proposals!

[bearpaw]

Deer Proposals

https://wdfw.wa.gov/sites/default/files/2020-08/deerproposals_public.pdf

[ThurstonCokid]

I have yet to pay close attention to these but i intend to start. I’d love to see the use of dogs be legal to blood track. I see that’s on there!


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[greenhead_killer]

tagging

[KFhunter]

I don't mind a temporary antler point restriction in the 100 series GMU's,  but my issues are that:

1) people accidently shoot and waste bucks that aren't legal 
2) promotes genetics of bucks that tend to not grow many points very early

on the flip it does put more 4pt or larger bucks in play and does improve trophy opportunities. 


I'd like to see this discontinued after two 3 year cycles, or at least reevaluated so we don't get a bunch culls breeding does. 

One thing I'd like to add
1) Youth any buck

[Russ McDonald]

I can say that most things that are at these meetings going forward are what the WDFW is proposing to the commision and most will pass.  There has been proposals that have been pulled from discussion and won't be recommended.

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[hunter399]

I can say that most things that are at these meetings going forward are what the WDFW is proposing to the commision and most will pass.  There has been proposals that have been pulled from discussion and won't be recommended.

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Can you say what deer proposal won't be discussion or recommended.

[hunter399]

I don't mind a temporary antler point restriction in the 100 series GMU's,  but my issues are that:

1) people accidently shoot and waste bucks that aren't legal 
2) promotes genetics of bucks that tend to not grow many points very early

on the flip it does put more 4pt or larger bucks in play and does improve trophy opportunities. 


I'd like to see this discontinued after two 3 year cycles, or at least reevaluated so we don't get a bunch culls breeding does. 

One thing I'd like to add
1) Youth any buck

I think youth,senior,disabled, would be exempt from an APR ,I will screen shot it .There are three different options ,and youth,disabled,senior will be exempt.

[buckcanyonlodge]

They did not list over population of predators as a part of the decline in deer populations. How about adding limited hound cougar hunting in units that have an at-risk population?? Or upping the quota number for cats harvested before closing the season.

[Tbar]

I can say that most things that are at these meetings going forward are what the WDFW is proposing to the commision and most will pass.  There has been proposals that have been pulled from discussion and won't be recommended.

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Although I do not completely disagree, comments like this really hurt when posted. When change does happen its usually because one side or another show up in numbers. Unfortunately it always seems to be the non consumptive, pro predator crowds that mobilize. The only organized effort from hunters seems to be waterfowl groups. Weather you agree or not I would encourage involvement at the commission level. Hunters voices are nearly silent at the majority of the meetings. 

[ThurstonCokid]

They did not list over population of predators as a part of the decline in deer populations. How about adding limited hound cougar hunting in units that have an at-risk population?? Or upping the quota number for cats harvested before closing the season.

Don’t use logic! But seriously. That’d be nice we can dream.


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[JL]

I previously compared the 2019 to 2015 deer harvest data for District 1 (Northeast) based on WDFW’s published data. Only compared these two years but the trend was similar to 124 (consistent year over year reduction). WDFW just labels as “Deer” so I’m assuming this is a combination of WT and MD:

REDUCTION

Antlerless Harvest 100%
Antlered Harvest 34%
Total Harvest 50%
1 Point 32%
2 Point 10%
3 Point 24%
4 Point 43%
5+ Point 45%
ALL 45%

[Russ McDonald]

I can say that most things that are at these meetings going forward are what the WDFW is proposing to the commision and most will pass.  There has been proposals that have been pulled from discussion and won't be recommended.

Sent from my SM-N976V using Tapatalk

Can you say what deer proposal won't be discussion or recommended.

I can not tell you about deer.  I just know what they told us is a turkey meeting with WDFW.  Example is there was a proposal for using dogs during fall turkey season.  That did not move forward and is no longer in any commision discussions.

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[10thmountainarcher]

I don't mind a temporary antler point restriction in the 100 series GMU's,  but my issues are that:

1) people accidently shoot and waste bucks that aren't legal 
2) promotes genetics of bucks that tend to not grow many points very early

on the flip it does put more 4pt or larger bucks in play and does improve trophy opportunities. 


I'd like to see this discontinued after two 3 year cycles, or at least reevaluated so we don't get a bunch culls breeding does. 

One thing I'd like to add
1) Youth any buck

This is exactly my thoughts! The youth any buck during the early season in place of what used to be the doe season.

[ne kid]

Hopefully we get antlerless wolf season. Sure wish we could get hounds back on a 20 year study.

[10thmountainarcher]

Hopefully we get antlerless wolf season. Sure wish we could get hounds back on a 20 year study.

  Hounds and an antler less wolf season would for sure help the herd!

[Mtnwalker]

Great reminder, I am setting an alert on my phone so I don’t forget. Hunter turnout is and has been abysmal at these commission meetings and we are being heavily out-participated by the anti’s. I’m going to do my best to sit in on as many as possible, whether the topic is relevant to me or not.

[Wsucoug]

Hunting season setting and rulemaking
https://wdfw.wa.gov/hunting/regulations/season-setting#

amazingly, I see some good things in some of the proposals...

Its very important to express your thoughts on proposals!

Do you know the best place to submit comments?  Seems this is just a listen in.

[Russ McDonald]

Hunting season setting and rulemaking
https://wdfw.wa.gov/hunting/regulations/season-setting#

amazingly, I see some good things in some of the proposals...

Its very important to express your thoughts on proposals!

Do you know the best place to submit comments?  Seems this is just a listen in.

https://wdfw.wa.gov/about/commission/contact



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[Wsucoug]

I don't mind a temporary antler point restriction in the 100 series GMU's,  but my issues are that:

1) people accidently shoot and waste bucks that aren't legal 
2) promotes genetics of bucks that tend to not grow many points very early

on the flip it does put more 4pt or larger bucks in play and does improve trophy opportunities. 


I'd like to see this discontinued after two 3 year cycles, or at least reevaluated so we don't get a bunch culls breeding does. 

One thing I'd like to add
1) Youth any buck

With respect to point 2, I have yet to see any data that supports this information, in an area such as the Northwest. Everything I have seen is from the Midwest and South where the growing season is significantly longer and the deer get a steady diet of Ag crops (think Soy beans and Corn).  I would like to see some actual data on this, in our area. If it does become a problem, maybe do a draw for some spike/2pt tags. Without some solid evidence, I would prefer not to cycle out, as its not easy to get these rules into place in the first place.

[Skyvalhunter]

Listening to their you tube questions and answers session I got the feeling most people that called in were WT hunters.as a majority of the questions were about WT. I don't believe most deer hunters are WT hunters specifically. It seems alot hunt WT late because they weren't successful during the regular season. I don't believe WDFW is concerned enough about Mule deer populations.

[KFhunter]

I don't mind a temporary antler point restriction in the 100 series GMU's,  but my issues are that:

1) people accidently shoot and waste bucks that aren't legal 
2) promotes genetics of bucks that tend to not grow many points very early

on the flip it does put more 4pt or larger bucks in play and does improve trophy opportunities. 


I'd like to see this discontinued after two 3 year cycles, or at least reevaluated so we don't get a bunch culls breeding does. 

One thing I'd like to add
1) Youth any buck

With respect to point 2, I have yet to see any data that supports this information, in an area such as the Northwest. Everything I have seen is from the Midwest and South where the growing season is significantly longer and the deer get a steady diet of Ag crops (think Soy beans and Corn).  I would like to see some actual data on this, in our area. If it does become a problem, maybe do a draw for some spike/2pt tags. Without some solid evidence, I would prefer not to cycle out, as its not easy to get these rules into place in the first place.

Mississippi state did a study on it,  I can't get the study to pull up on the weblink, but here's an article which talks about it.
maybe it'll work on your computer? http://msudeerlab.com/management.asp
I thought this was pretty well settled science?   

However, researchers from Mississippi State University documented an undesirable side effect. Over time, the average antler size of bucks in the 2.5 and 3.5-year age classes declined by an average of 10 inches. The four-point rule resulted in what’s known as “high-grading,” where bucks with the greatest genetic potential for big antlers are harvested at a younger age, leaving only bucks with poorer quality antlers to mature into older age classes. And the effect was greatest in areas of high-quality soils, where yearling bucks have a higher potential of sporting legal racks at a younger age. As a result, the State placed large areas of state-managed lands in the Delta region under more stringent regulations, which include a 15-inch minimum inside spread and a tightly controlled lottery on a limited number of permits for taking bucks with fewer than four points.

These results point out several things. One is the importance of long-term monitoring. It took several years before researchers identified the high-grading. It also shows that things are seldom as simple and clear-cut as we might like them to be. It’s not just a matter of protecting younger bucks to produce older ones. When managing wildlife populations you need to consider numerous variables like habitat, hunting pressure and annual weather and climate variation, to name a few.

https://www.mossyoak.com/our-obsession/blogs/deer/antler-restrictions-good-or-bad

[Wsucoug]

I have read that article. The issue is the soil and the growing seasons. If you feed a deer a high protein diet for a longer season  ( south temperatures with mississippi delta soil growing ag crops) then yeah a deer will express more antler potential. Thats a far cry from our hills in the 100 gmus. Sticks for food with the growing season on the north slopes not even starting till May.

I just don't think you can extrapolate the data.

Additionally my current understanding is age then nutrition then generics is the order of importance for antler size. I think we have a long road currently with age before we need to tackle genetics.

[KFhunter]

Well I think we see it quicker in mule deer with the big forkies, and slower in WT deer. 

but antler quality isn't the goal here, it is reductions of harvest, the sales pitch is higher quality bucks on the landscape. 

[hunter399]

I can say that most things that are at these meetings going forward are what the WDFW is proposing to the commision and most will pass.  There has been proposals that have been pulled from discussion and won't be recommended.

Sent from my SM-N976V using Tapatalk

Can you say what deer proposal won't be discussion or recommended.

I can not tell you about deer.  I just know what they told us is a turkey meeting with WDFW.  Example is there was a proposal for using dogs during fall turkey season.  That did not move forward and is no longer in any commision discussions.

Sent from my SM-N976V using Tapatalk

Ohh ya there's a proposal for tracking dog to be used Durring deer and elk season also .On a leash of course.But we all know somebody's dog will get free ,then some other hunter will shoot it thinking it's a wild dog .But that's a different story ,from Turkey hunting.

[hunter399]

I've been pushing the APR down there throats for years.
Youth,senior,disabled, would stay any buck.
I've also been pushing a youth antlerless hunt-permit only so that Doe permits can stay highly regulated in amounts/with any kind of antlerless permits going towards youth first.
Basically quality of hunt/with opportunity for different user groups/sustainability in our deer herds would be the goals.

[JL]

IMO, District 1 decline is 100% predator for WT & MD.

[hunter399]

IMO, District 1 decline is 100% predator for WT & MD.

Your right 100% I won't debate that.
Majority of locals/hunters that come to district 1 come here to deer hunt,then don't come back till next year.Which leaves a huge predator pit.
So this is the option to keep sustainable deer ,hunters are not killing enough predators.

[JL]

Yup. Can't shoot wolves, no hounds for cats, and no bait for bears. Definitely the hunters' fault. Being facetious, of course.

[hunter399]

Yup. Can't shoot wolves, no hounds for cats, and no bait for bears. Definitely the hunters' fault. Being facetious, of course.

Wolves,hounds,bait for bears,is something we can't change though. We can change regulations to try and keep sustainable deer population for future hunters.