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Author Topic: Hb2238 ammo tax  (Read 3943 times)

Offline bullcanyon

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Hb2238 ammo tax
« on: January 10, 2024, 08:01:08 PM »
https://legiscan.com/WA/bill/HB2238/2023
Anyone have the skinny on this new attempt to tax us more?

Offline KNOPHISH

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Re: Hb2238 ammo tax
« Reply #1 on: January 10, 2024, 08:29:29 PM »
Strongly oppose.
I have Man Chit to do

Offline 10mmg

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Re: Hb2238 ammo tax
« Reply #2 on: January 10, 2024, 08:42:57 PM »
11% additional tax for the “privilege” of using ammunition. Their words.

Offline wadu1

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Re: Hb2238 ammo tax
« Reply #3 on: January 10, 2024, 09:11:11 PM »
It's already posted in the Political section,
https://hunting-washington.com/smf/index.php/topic,284040.0.html
"a fronte praecipitium a tergo lupi"

Offline hunter399

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Re: Hb2238 ammo tax
« Reply #4 on: January 11, 2024, 12:25:13 AM »
Where did you guys think they got the money to give WDFW for biodiversity or whatever it is.
I can't remember 21 million or something.
Thought it was said to come from some tax on "recreational" sporting goods.
Well there you go,you got the skinny.
Then our commission promotes these animal/conservation places.
"Return of the carnivore"
Which brings there groups more donations.
Fills CEO pockets full .
It's all a pyramid scam ,that's all legal till it's not.
All the recent changes have been "carnivore".
I'm about to ask them when there gonna return our mountain caribou to NE Washington.
Wheres that biodiversity?
Sorry for the rant,that post was late at night.
You'd have to fact check my post,I was on one when I posted.
« Last Edit: January 11, 2024, 09:35:20 AM by hunter399 »

Offline Sneaky

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Re: Hb2238 ammo tax
« Reply #5 on: January 11, 2024, 07:24:10 AM »
adding a public comment is easy. Be sure to point out that Seattle has had a 4x increase in fatal shootings since 2016 when it imposed a similar tax.

Offline pianoman9701

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Re: Hb2238 ammo tax
« Reply #6 on: January 11, 2024, 07:41:45 AM »
My comment to my legislators: "Any tax above sales tax on ammunition will make it harder for lower income citizens to exercise their rights under the Washington and U.S. Constitutions, and the ability to protect themselves and their loved ones from criminal harm. It seems clear that sponsors of this bill wish to discriminate against those in our society who likely most need these rights and the protections they provide to all citizens. We know statistically that the rising violent crime in this state most often negatively affects people earning lower income and our citizens of color. Therefore, this bill should not be considered. We are all supposed to have equal rights under the law. This bill would make those rights inaccessible to those who are most vulnerable in our society. It is shocking that this bill has been introduced. I request that my comments be read into the record."
"Restricting the rights of law-abiding citizens based on the actions of criminals and madmen will have no positive effect on the future acts of criminals and madmen. It will only serve to reduce individual rights and the very security of our republic." - Pianoman https://linktr.ee/johnlwallace https://valoaneducator.tv/johnwallace-2014743

Offline boneaddict

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Re: Hb2238 ammo tax
« Reply #7 on: January 11, 2024, 07:56:25 AM »
Damn you are good

Offline birddogdad

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Re: Hb2238 ammo tax
« Reply #8 on: January 11, 2024, 08:20:41 AM »
anything for the grabbers to hinder us and making money off it us bonus.... :bash:
USN retired
1981-2011

Offline GWP

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Re: Hb2238 ammo tax
« Reply #9 on: January 11, 2024, 10:59:47 AM »
I think you mistakenly put 'hinder'. I am guessing you meant 'eliminate'.
Cuterebra are NOT cute!

Offline timberfaller

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Re: Hb2238 ammo tax
« Reply #10 on: January 11, 2024, 11:07:04 AM »
 :bash: :bash:  Time to put a limit on the time our un-representitives are allow to spend in Olympia!!  Two days is to long!!
The only good tree, is a stump!

Offline Fidelk

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Re: Hb2238 ammo tax
« Reply #11 on: January 11, 2024, 12:45:43 PM »
Pman........100% agree. The only addition I can think of is to point out that ammo, firearms and hunting/fishing licenses have additional embedded taxes that fund most if not all wildlife programs. As opposed to taxes NOT being contributed to such programs by the anti-gun, anti-hunting, anti-meat eating "communities".

Offline Shrimper

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Re: Hb2238 ammo tax
« Reply #12 on: January 11, 2024, 02:09:34 PM »
Already got a response from one of my representatives in agreement for opposing HB2238.

Quote
RE: Comment RR: HB 2238 Ammunition tax (AGAINST)

Low, Rep. Sam
 
From: sam.low@leg.wa.gov
To:

Thu, Jan 11 at 12:29 PM

Brent

I agree with you! Thank you for taking the time to write,

Sam Low

WA State House of Representatives – 39th Legislative District
430 John L. O'Brien Building
PO Box 40600
Olympia, WA 98504
Sam.Low@leg.wa.gov
(360) 786-7967
"Whenever you are asked if you can do a job, tell ’em, ’Certainly I can!’ Then get busy and find out how to do it."

Online Bob33

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Re: Hb2238 ammo tax
« Reply #13 on: January 11, 2024, 02:18:11 PM »
Pman........100% agree. The only addition I can think of is to point out that ammo, firearms and hunting/fishing licenses have additional embedded taxes that fund most if not all wildlife programs. As opposed to taxes NOT being contributed to such programs by the anti-gun, anti-hunting, anti-meat eating "communities".
That is correct. The Pittman-Robertson act includes an 11% excise tax paid on the wholesale cost of ammunition. If ammunition sales are diminished, PR funding for conservation will be diminished.
Nature. It's cheaper than therapy.

Offline GOcougsHunter

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Re: Hb2238 ammo tax
« Reply #14 on: January 11, 2024, 02:20:33 PM »
For those of us residing in Seattle, this appears to be a duplication of the current Seattle ammo tax.  That ammo tax pushed all but 1 retailer out of the city.   https://www.nraila.org/articles/20230327/seattles-gun-tax-a-textbook-case-on-the-law-of-inverse-consequences

The businesses who left Seattle also took their B&O and sales tax revenue away from Seattle.  This "golden bullet" to fund anti violence programs ended up falling on its face.  How many businesses will leave the state?  just ignorant and shortsighted.
Introduce someone new to hunting this year.

Offline timberfaller

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Re: Hb2238 ammo tax
« Reply #15 on: January 11, 2024, 02:42:12 PM »
 R reps will say NO to it,

D reps will vote YES,

Who has the most votes in Olympia???

Start calling the D's.

Better yet, vote them out of office!  Most problems will be solved then! :tup:
The only good tree, is a stump!

Online bigmacc

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Re: Hb2238 ammo tax
« Reply #16 on: January 11, 2024, 04:21:18 PM »
R reps will say NO to it,

D reps will vote YES,

Who has the most votes in Olympia???

Start calling the D's.

Better yet, vote them out of office!  Most problems will be solved then! :tup:
Well, in a nutshell, you’re spot on.

Offline Sneaky

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Re: Hb2238 ammo tax
« Reply #17 on: January 12, 2024, 08:40:13 PM »
Hello and thank you for your audience in receiving this message. I strongly oppose the idea of imposing a new tax on the sale or transfer of ammunition as it is unfair, lacks specificity in the use of the funding it would generate, and fails to consider taxes that are already levied on ammunition. Additionally, similar municipal taxes have completely failed to curb gun violence and mental health issues. While not inclusive of all negative aspects of this idea, my main thoughts are as follows:

1. A tax on ammunition unfairly places burden and blame on lawful gun owners for gun violence and mental health issues. Statistically, the vast majority (75%) of gun violence that occurs in Washington is attributed to suicide (Alliance for Gun Responsibility). Suicide is a mental health issue that should be of utmost concern to ALL citizens of Washington. The burden of funding government programs aimed at reducing gun violence and suicide should not fall solely on one user group. The effort to reduce problems that exist in society as a whole should be funded by all participants of society.

 2. In the text of the bill, there is a glaring lack of specificity as to how these funds would be used if taken. The text reads that the new tax would go "to programs that aim to prevent suicide and to reduce firearm-related domestic violence". What does that actually mean? Do these programs currently exist? If so, they have already shown to not be effective. Are these programs government programs? Non-profits? Are there measures in place to monitor that the funds are being used effectively? Are there statistical goals or milestones that the funds aim to meet? There are simply too many questions to ensure that the money taken from hard-working Washingtonians by way of a new tax would be used fairly, properly, and effectively.

3. Extra taxes that support mental health, the core problem in all gun related violence, are already being levied from ammunition sales nationwide. In case you were unaware, The Pittman-Robertson act of 1937 already imposes an 11% tax on ammunition. This excise tax generates hundreds of millions of dollars annually and has very specific parameters on how the money is used, unlike this proposed legislation. The funding from this tax has been used extensively to promote firearm safety and restore America's wildlife and natural spaces. PR money has been used to fund hunter-education programs which teach firearm safety, a critical missing component in our education system. Further, PR money provides for preservation and improved access to open spaces where people can enjoy the outdoors. Research has shown that time spent outside and physical excercise are some of the most important and effective ways to maintain your physical and mental health. Imposing yet another tax on ammunition would reduce PR dollars by reducing the amount of ammunition and other taxed products that lawful firearm owners can purchase.

4. In 2016, a similar tax was imposed in the city of Seattle with the aim of reducing gun violence. Again, the tax lacked specificity in how the funds would be spent. The text of the ordinance reads that he city would "use that revenue to provide broad-based public benefits for residents of Seattle related to gun violence by funding programs that promote public safety, prevent gun violence and address in part the cost of gun violence in the City." Again, this ordinance was used to fund phantom "programs", which likely meant that there was no solid plan for how to use hard-working peoples money after they collected it. Furthermore, since 2016, gun violence in Seattle has increased dramatically, demonstrating that the tax was completely without effect and only served to hurt local business and lawful gun owners. According to the city of Seattle Crime Dashboard, in 2016 there were 250 reports of shots fired, 10 fatal shootings, and 57 non-fatal injury shootings. In 2023, there were 487 reports of shots fired, 42 fatal shootings, and 149 non-fatal injury shootings. I can't picture a better demonstration of failure. There were literally four times the amount of fatal shootings after imposing a gun violence reduction tax. I think this should tell us that taking someone elses money and giving it to "programs" is not the answer. Thank you for your time in reading this and I ask that you please vote no on this bill as it is fundamentally flawed.

Offline TommyH

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Re: Hb2238 ammo tax
« Reply #18 on: January 13, 2024, 08:24:14 AM »
Hello and thank you for your audience in receiving this message. I strongly oppose the idea of imposing a new tax on the sale or transfer of ammunition as it is unfair, lacks specificity in the use of the funding it would generate, and fails to consider taxes that are already levied on ammunition. Additionally, similar municipal taxes have completely failed to curb gun violence and mental health issues. While not inclusive of all negative aspects of this idea, my main thoughts are as follows:

1. A tax on ammunition unfairly places burden and blame on lawful gun owners for gun violence and mental health issues. Statistically, the vast majority (75%) of gun violence that occurs in Washington is attributed to suicide (Alliance for Gun Responsibility). Suicide is a mental health issue that should be of utmost concern to ALL citizens of Washington. The burden of funding government programs aimed at reducing gun violence and suicide should not fall solely on one user group. The effort to reduce problems that exist in society as a whole should be funded by all participants of society.

 2. In the text of the bill, there is a glaring lack of specificity as to how these funds would be used if taken. The text reads that the new tax would go "to programs that aim to prevent suicide and to reduce firearm-related domestic violence". What does that actually mean? Do these programs currently exist? If so, they have already shown to not be effective. Are these programs government programs? Non-profits? Are there measures in place to monitor that the funds are being used effectively? Are there statistical goals or milestones that the funds aim to meet? There are simply too many questions to ensure that the money taken from hard-working Washingtonians by way of a new tax would be used fairly, properly, and effectively.

3. Extra taxes that support mental health, the core problem in all gun related violence, are already being levied from ammunition sales nationwide. In case you were unaware, The Pittman-Robertson act of 1937 already imposes an 11% tax on ammunition. This excise tax generates hundreds of millions of dollars annually and has very specific parameters on how the money is used, unlike this proposed legislation. The funding from this tax has been used extensively to promote firearm safety and restore America's wildlife and natural spaces. PR money has been used to fund hunter-education programs which teach firearm safety, a critical missing component in our education system. Further, PR money provides for preservation and improved access to open spaces where people can enjoy the outdoors. Research has shown that time spent outside and physical excercise are some of the most important and effective ways to maintain your physical and mental health. Imposing yet another tax on ammunition would reduce PR dollars by reducing the amount of ammunition and other taxed products that lawful firearm owners can purchase.

4. In 2016, a similar tax was imposed in the city of Seattle with the aim of reducing gun violence. Again, the tax lacked specificity in how the funds would be spent. The text of the ordinance reads that he city would "use that revenue to provide broad-based public benefits for residents of Seattle related to gun violence by funding programs that promote public safety, prevent gun violence and address in part the cost of gun violence in the City." Again, this ordinance was used to fund phantom "programs", which likely meant that there was no solid plan for how to use hard-working peoples money after they collected it. Furthermore, since 2016, gun violence in Seattle has increased dramatically, demonstrating that the tax was completely without effect and only served to hurt local business and lawful gun owners. According to the city of Seattle Crime Dashboard, in 2016 there were 250 reports of shots fired, 10 fatal shootings, and 57 non-fatal injury shootings. In 2023, there were 487 reports of shots fired, 42 fatal shootings, and 149 non-fatal injury shootings. I can't picture a better demonstration of failure. There were literally four times the amount of fatal shootings after imposing a gun violence reduction tax. I think this should tell us that taking someone elses money and giving it to "programs" is not the answer. Thank you for your time in reading this and I ask that you please vote no on this bill as it is fundamentally flawed.

 :yeah:  :yeah:

 


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