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Poll

If WA went from statewide deer tags to an east/west split like elk is structured now, what would you choose?

Westside
93 (29.9%)
Eastside
218 (70.1%)

Total Members Voted: 311

Author Topic: EAST/WEST DEER TAG SPLIT POLL  (Read 16927 times)

Offline hughjorgan

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Re: EAST/WEST DEER TAG SPLIT POLL
« Reply #90 on: March 09, 2024, 05:54:06 PM »
This is the departments take on the petition…

This petition asks the Fish and Wildlife Commission to initiate rulemaking to implement an area-specific deer tag that requires deer hunters to choose either an east or west hunt area, like the system currently used for elk. The petitioner asserts that the proposed system will increase deer abundance by reducing harvest, with a specific focus on northeast Washington white-tailed deer populations.
The Department has used area-specific elk tags to manage elk hunter densities since 1979. Though the east-west elk tag system has implications for elk harvest, the system was primarily implemented to resolve hunter crowding issues. Initially this system included multiple tag areas corresponding to individual or aggregated elk populations that ultimately transitioned to the east-west system in use today. Hunter crowding has higher potential during elk than deer seasons for a few reasons, namely that the number of hunters per elk is consistently higher than those per deer (currently about ~1:1 vs. 1:3, respectively) resulting in greater competition for elk than deer. Elk populations are also relatively more discrete than deer, which concentrates hunters and compounds the potential for hunter crowding. Historically this resulted in unacceptably high elk hunter densities in areas where hunters perceived a high potential for success, such as in the comparatively large and easily accessible populations of central and southeastern Washington. Elk general season timing was also more discrete (i.e., no overlap) than deer seasons between east and western Washington, as is the case today for modern firearm seasons. This provided some advantage to westside resident hunters that could hunt the earlier eastern season and, if unsuccessful, hunt again in a local western season, which created concerns about equitable opportunity.
An area-specific elk tag resolved crowding and equity issues in general seasons by distributing elk hunters and effort more uniformly. This system is also important for managing opportunity in the current special permit draw system. All elk special permit applications specify a tag type (i.e., east or west) and special permit applicants cannot change the tag type regardless of the draw outcome. Without this system we would expect more applicants from western Washington for the highly valued special permits in eastern Washington because, if unsuccessful in the draw, the applicant would likely hunt nearby in a general season (i.e., there is no tradeoff in their application choices). This would ultimately lead to reduced special permit draw odds and raise hunter concerns about equity and fairness.
 
Deer population abundance is partly a function of how many animals survive and therefore Department staff acknowledge that hunting has the potential to influence both mule and white-tailed deer population dynamics (i.e., how a population changes through time). However, deer population trajectory is predominantly due to variation in adult female survival. For that reason, the Department restricts most deer hunting to antlered male (i.e., “buck”) only opportunities to maximize female deer survival and ultimately promote population stability or growth. The Department restricts antlerless harvest opportunities, where available, as a function of population monitoring results. For example, if a population is trending downward contrary to management objectives the Department responds by proposing limitations on general season or special permit antlerless opportunities. Specific to the northeast part of the state (i.e., District 1, GMUs 101-121), the Department has restricted white- tailed deer harvest to antlered male only since 2019 and further restrictions to buck harvest opportunities are unlikely to change the population’s trajectory.
Further, a recent study (2017-2020) of white-tailed deer in northeast Washington did not identify harvest as a limiting factor to growth, though this study did identify a stable to slightly declining population suggesting that there are limitations to growth. Many independent and interactive non-hunting factors, such as outbreaks of hemorrhagic disease (in 2015 and 2021), changing land use practices, human encroachment, non-human predation, or changing climatic conditions (e.g., more frequent drought), are likely acting on Washington white- tailed deer and influencing their population dynamics.
For the above reasons, an east-west tag structure is unlikely to influence population trajectory, though it has the potential to reduce the harvest of east-side deer taken by western Washington hunters. From 2018-2022, about 49% of deer hunters with western Washington addresses consistently hunt only in western Washington, 27% consistently hunt only in eastern Washington, and 24% hunt some mixture of east and west. Western Washington residents account for approximately 32% of all eastern Washington deer harvest and approximately 25% of all white-tailed deer harvest. The Department expects that an east-west tag structure would result in some proportion of the “mixed-side” hunters choosing to hunt western Washington, but the reduction in harvest of eastern Washington deer may be nominal (i.e., single digit percentage decrease) and the reduced harvest by westside hunters may be nullified by increased success (i.e., harvest) of those hunters choosing an east-side tag.
The implementation of an east-west deer tag is a significant restrictive change to hunting opportunity and may be contrary to the preferred structure of most deer hunters. As such, the Department must conduct formal public scoping to understand and evaluate the implications of an area-specific deer tag on hunter participation and its potential consequences to deer harvest, which is not feasible prior to the current three-year package rulemaking process.
Staff recommendation:
Department staff recommend denying this petition because a) the requested rule change is unlikely to result in increased white-tailed deer populations, and b) the requested rule change has statewide implications and therefore requires extensive public scoping to evaluate its acceptability to all deer hunters

https://wdfw.wa.gov/sites/default/files/2024-03/9-summary-sheet-petition-deer-tags.pdf

Offline JakeLand

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Re: EAST/WEST DEER TAG SPLIT POLL
« Reply #91 on: March 09, 2024, 06:33:06 PM »
Seems to me most hunters like and or want the idea of east/west tags

Offline kentrek

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Re: EAST/WEST DEER TAG SPLIT POLL
« Reply #92 on: March 09, 2024, 07:29:00 PM »
Seems to me most hunters like and or want the idea of east/west tags

Hunters are typically always for more restrictions to give them a perceived advantage to the next guy

Offline highside74

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Re: EAST/WEST DEER TAG SPLIT POLL
« Reply #93 on: March 09, 2024, 08:48:17 PM »
All I'm saying is I'm all for 70% of the deer hunters going East as this poll would suggest.  :tup: :IBCOOL:

Offline elksnout

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Re: EAST/WEST DEER TAG SPLIT POLL
« Reply #94 on: March 09, 2024, 08:54:09 PM »
I voted west side simply because I live here hunting black ghosts and have never hunted central or east side in fifty three hunting seasons. All of my mule deer hunting is in Oregon, Colorado and recently Montana. With all of the negative news I read on here I have zero interest in ever hunting mulies here given the current state of the herd. In fact I find it interesting that guys bitch about the lack of deer and or bucks yet continue to shoot spindly horned dinks just to post that they “got it done” on social forums. But thats my take and my opinion and I’ll own that. So take it at that.

I do not believe that I’d support another of the thousand cuts to reduce hunter opportunities in this state unless there was a dedicated plan to help boost the overall health of our combined deer herds by science driven data. Yes. I’m pissing in the wind.


elksnout
Can't we all just get along?

Offline JakeLand

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Re: EAST/WEST DEER TAG SPLIT POLL
« Reply #95 on: March 10, 2024, 11:31:50 AM »
All I'm saying is I'm all for 70% of the deer hunters going East as this poll would suggest.  :tup: :IBCOOL:
exactly !

Offline hughjorgan

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Re: EAST/WEST DEER TAG SPLIT POLL
« Reply #96 on: March 10, 2024, 12:09:52 PM »
All I'm saying is I'm all for 70% of the deer hunters going East as this poll would suggest.  :tup: :IBCOOL:
exactly !

Based off the WDFW numbers this poll is not remotely accurate…

 about 49% of deer hunters with western Washington addresses consistently hunt only in western Washington, 27% consistently hunt only in eastern Washington, and 24% hunt some mixture of east and west. Western Washington residents account for approximately 32% of all eastern Washington deer harvest and approximately 25% of all white-tailed deer harvest.

Offline Jonathan_S

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Re: EAST/WEST DEER TAG SPLIT POLL
« Reply #97 on: March 10, 2024, 12:54:35 PM »
All I'm saying is I'm all for 70% of the deer hunters going East as this poll would suggest.  :tup: :IBCOOL:
exactly !

Based off the WDFW numbers this poll is not remotely accurate…

 about 49% of deer hunters with western Washington addresses consistently hunt only in western Washington, 27% consistently hunt only in eastern Washington, and 24% hunt some mixture of east and west. Western Washington residents account for approximately 32% of all eastern Washington deer harvest and approximately 25% of all white-tailed deer harvest.

Guessing there is an over sampling on HuntWa of those Westsiders who choose Eastside as their primary deer hunt.
Kindly do not attempt to cloud the issue with too many facts.

Offline hughjorgan

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Re: EAST/WEST DEER TAG SPLIT POLL
« Reply #98 on: March 10, 2024, 02:04:54 PM »
It would appear that way.

Offline Karl Blanchard

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Re: EAST/WEST DEER TAG SPLIT POLL
« Reply #99 on: March 11, 2024, 08:58:07 AM »
All I'm saying is I'm all for 70% of the deer hunters going East as this poll would suggest.  :tup: :IBCOOL:
exactly !

Based off the WDFW numbers this poll is not remotely accurate…

 about 49% of deer hunters with western Washington addresses consistently hunt only in western Washington, 27% consistently hunt only in eastern Washington, and 24% hunt some mixture of east and west. Western Washington residents account for approximately 32% of all eastern Washington deer harvest and approximately 25% of all white-tailed deer harvest.

Guessing there is an over sampling on HuntWa of those Westsiders who choose Eastside as their primary deer hunt.
those numbers also don't account for the amount of west side guys that would choose east side simply due to applying for east side special permits.
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Offline highcountry_hunter

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Re: EAST/WEST DEER TAG SPLIT POLL
« Reply #100 on: March 11, 2024, 09:00:57 AM »
I didn’t read through all the comments…but would residents of each side have a preference similar to residents vs NR’s?


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Offline duckmen1

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Re: EAST/WEST DEER TAG SPLIT POLL
« Reply #101 on: March 11, 2024, 09:39:44 AM »
I think most dedicated western wa deer hunters that currently make trips to the east side will continue to do so if that system ever took place in which it would make minimal difference. I personally want to keep the deer seasons how they are on the subject. And see other changes for deer.
Maturity is when you have the power to destroy someone who did you wrong but instead you breathe, walk away, and let life take care of them.

Offline SuperX

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Re: EAST/WEST DEER TAG SPLIT POLL
« Reply #102 on: March 11, 2024, 10:09:50 AM »
for me it ties to what side I hunt elk on.  I like to have a deer tag along with me when I'm hunting elk. 

Offline dvolmer

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Re: EAST/WEST DEER TAG SPLIT POLL
« Reply #103 on: March 11, 2024, 11:47:02 AM »
I would lean towards choosing one or the other. Not to sure of all of the ramifications, but from a distance it looks ok to reduce a little bit of pressure and still allow everyone to hit the hills hunting. Another option is to have one deer season statewide with the exact dates so no one person can be more than one place at a time????  Really haven’t thought of all the ramifications of that either. I would much more agree with an East/West tag selection over the species specific. I would also strongly support that the multi-season tag would match your selection on what side of the state you choose. Would do what it says, let you hunt all three weapon seasons but limits your LE choices to that side of the state you choose. I think the multi season elk should be the same.
Zonk Volmer

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Re: EAST/WEST DEER TAG SPLIT POLL
« Reply #104 on: March 11, 2024, 11:51:46 AM »
One thing I hear on opinion is east side guys don't like the fact that westside guys have the ability to capitalize on both eastern and western wa seasons. But one thought is eastside guys have the same ability to do so. They just don't because they don't know how to hunt as well as the westside folks do for the grey ghosts. That's why they choose to hunt those easy whitetails and mule deer only. That can be patterned much easier than blacktails.  :chuckle:
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