Results of 3 point or better rule

[Kingofthemountain83]

For myself multi permits haven't helped me shoot many mule deer... A bunch of blackies... I don't archery hunt though if that makes a difference... Only muzzy and modern...

[NOCK NOCK]

Oh oh. Now you’ve done it Nock Nock. You’ve kicked WDFW’s ponzy scheme nest!

LOL, It'll never happen, too many $$ lost, but by far the least intrusive option that will most definitely help.

For myself multi permits haven't helped me shoot many mule deer... A bunch of blackies... I don't archery hunt though if that makes a difference... Only muzzy and modern...

Helps lots of folks kill a deer they normally wouldn't. I have done it several times. but have zero issue giving that option up.

[hunter399]

No..........more...........Multi..........permits.  The WORST thing for muley herds!!!!!

Somebody had to say it.👏 A lot of truth behind that comment.
So much truth , I'd say not only worst for mule deer. Worst for every deer herd in the state.
But only one contributing factor out of many.

I would say 4pt minimum may help, raise the APR.
I'd support a 4pt minimum across the board for WT and muley in region one,OTC.
NO , I won't support permits,every other year, two day seasons,all that,when it's gone ,it never comes back.....OTC

Some call it trophy hunting,while others call it management,when it comes to APR.
I Call it conservation. .

I believe in Canada BC , mule deer hunting is 4pt minimum.
Seems like it works for them ,not that far north of here .
There are some rag horn,dinky 4pt muleys if we would let them grow,also a few giants will grow too. 4pt minimum solve a lot of issues, genetics, accidental forky killings,all that.

That's my solution,raise it to 4pt minimum.
Few years of crappy hunting,then boom . Harvests rates will go up after 3 to 4 years.
We all get to screw each other to the top of the mountain,same seasons, same as we always have.....lol

I will answer the question.
Results of the 3pt minimum......
The results are terrible,just us scraping by .
No real gains ,besides keeping mule deer from becoming extinct.
Population of mule deer .....just enough to sell a tag or two ....that's it.

[huntnnw]

4pt min does NOT work with mule deer! there is a huge percentage of bucks that are forks or 2x3 or 3x3 their whole life. What happens every year thats implemented the herd grows with tons of forks and 3's... they do the breeding while keep spreading that gene and while the bucks that woulda been great deer with age are shot far before potential

[greenhead_killer]

What about going same route as co. Seasons 1-4. Limit permits in each season and unit. Have  otc units for wt and bt but keep md separate. Make nr apply instead of giving tags away(I don’t think we have a nr problem) but would help manage it.

[hunter399]

4pt min does NOT work with mule deer! there is a huge percentage of bucks that are forks or 2x3 or 3x3 their whole life. What happens every year thats implemented the herd grows with tons of forks and 3's... they do the breeding while keep spreading that gene and while the bucks that woulda been great deer with age are shot far before potential

Not saying your right or wrong.
4pt minimum isn't about trophys, what you just wrote is the excuse most biologist will use not to implement.
4pt minimum is about slowing harvest rates,while allowing a normal OTC season.
Bucks will do ,what bucks do , regardless of a 3pt or 4pt minimum.
That means a certain amount of rag horn,cull bucks,forkys,three points ,smaller bucks will breed does .  We could go from no hunting season to an APR season,smaller bucks will breed.
Every area that a mature buck is harvested,more smaller bucks will breed,this happens no matter the season or APR.
Important part is all doe is breed.
This helps with predator/fawn issue.

All I'm saying is ,works in Canada ,not a 💯 that it could work here.

[Longfield1]

4pt min does NOT work with mule deer! there is a huge percentage of bucks that are forks or 2x3 or 3x3 their whole life. What happens every year thats implemented the herd grows with tons of forks and 3's... they do the breeding while keep spreading that gene and while the bucks that woulda been great deer with age are shot far before potential

Not saying your right or wrong.
4pt minimum isn't about trophys, what you just wrote is the excuse most biologist will use not to implement.
4pt minimum is about slowing harvest rates,while allowing a normal OTC season.
Bucks will do ,what bucks do , regardless of a 3pt or 4pt minimum.
That means a certain amount of rag horn,cull bucks,forkys,three points ,smaller bucks will breed does .  We could go from no hunting season to an APR season,smaller bucks will breed.
Every area that a mature buck is harvested,more smaller bucks will breed,this happens no matter the season or APR.
Important part is all doe is breed.
This helps with predator/fawn issue.

All I'm saying is ,works in Canada ,not a 💯 that it could work here.

Could you explain how restrictions work in Canada?

I have an idea, keep the same 3 point minimum for OTC but instead of giving out doe tag drawings, do any buck drawings and give 100 out the first year and see how that impacts the herd. As for the season you could either have in run at the same time as rifle or have it as a multi season tag where archers can shoot any buck with archery equipment during archery season, muzzleloader during muzzleloader season and modern for modern. Another option would be to have 3 separate tag seasons so 33 for archery 33 for muzzleloader and 33 for modern. I think this would cull some of the bad genetics on some old forkys while still generating revenue for the state and hunters with more opportunity.

[hunter399]

4pt min does NOT work with mule deer! there is a huge percentage of bucks that are forks or 2x3 or 3x3 their whole life. What happens every year thats implemented the herd grows with tons of forks and 3's... they do the breeding while keep spreading that gene and while the bucks that woulda been great deer with age are shot far before potential

Not saying your right or wrong.
4pt minimum isn't about trophys, what you just wrote is the excuse most biologist will use not to implement.
4pt minimum is about slowing harvest rates,while allowing a normal OTC season.
Bucks will do ,what bucks do , regardless of a 3pt or 4pt minimum.
That means a certain amount of rag horn,cull bucks,forkys,three points ,smaller bucks will breed does .  We could go from no hunting season to an APR season,smaller bucks will breed.
Every area that a mature buck is harvested,more smaller bucks will breed,this happens no matter the season or APR.
Important part is all doe is breed.
This helps with predator/fawn issue.

All I'm saying is ,works in Canada ,not a 💯 that it could work here.

Could you explain how restrictions work in Canada?

I have an idea, keep the same 3 point minimum for OTC but instead of giving out doe tag drawings, do any buck drawings and give 100 out the first year and see how that impacts the herd. As for the season you could either have in run at the same time as rifle or have it as a multi season tag where archers can shoot any buck with archery equipment during archery season, muzzleloader during muzzleloader season and modern for modern. Another option would be to have 3 separate tag seasons so 33 for archery 33 for muzzleloader and 33 for modern. I think this would cull some of the bad genetics on some old forkys while still generating revenue for the state and hunters with more opportunity.

I'll be honest here,I really don't know how restrictions work in Canada.
But I've watched a very good amount of YouTube hunting videos.
Just search Canada BC mule deer hunting on YouTube.
Watch a few hunting videos, you see them passing on forkys and three points.
Cause they have a 4pt minimum,also looks like some dang nice bucks get taken up there.

Another problem that I haven't heard much talked about yet is....
Most biologist in our state, will tell you that the regulations are fine as is.
Mule deer,WT,black tail population is fine,stable, sustainable or whatever.
That the hunting prospect for 2026 is great.
Which may be true for certain areas,not so true for most areas.
They also won't tell you that mule deer fawns are easy targets for predators,much easier than a WT or black tail for example.
I believe what happens to elk calves in the blues.
Is very similar to what happens to mule deer fawns in that winter to early spring birth areas.
I say that because if you run enough trail cams, you'll find more predator pics in mule deer areas than other areas.

I was just adding another opinion on the subject.
No drama ,no arguing,I really don't think there is a right or wrong answer.
But can say that I believe any harvest of spikes, forkys may help on the genetic side.
Will have downward effects on population,just cause we have had that APR for so long now.

[ghosthunter]

Since you brought biologists.

I think at least in the Methow that may be part of the problem.
 The guy has been there so long I think he is in a rut. He barley changes his tune from year to year. Every year in the newspaper he paints a roses outlook or typical. Which has no resemblance to what hunters see on the ground.

Term limits baby.

[Kingofthemountain83]

I don't think think any APR or any other kind of restrictions are going to change a thing until we can properly manage predators again in WA... When the fawns are getting hammered shortly after dropping they don't have much of a chance no matter the APR... Our best friends are bullets in predators and prime winter range with safe fawning grounds... This place is doomed... It's sad... 

[Loup Loup]

Where I am now in Idaho, mule deer is general spike or two point. Limited draw for three point or better.
From I’ve seen so far I would say mule deer density here is less than Okanogan county, and about the same as Chelan county. So not good.