collapse

Advertisement


Author Topic: Elk article in Yakima Herald newspaper  (Read 16043 times)

Offline buckmaster_wa

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Longhunter
  • *****
  • Join Date: Jun 2008
  • Posts: 946
  • Location: Selah
Elk article in Yakima Herald newspaper
« on: June 15, 2010, 05:19:47 AM »
Fellow hunt-wa member and hunting partner (Colockumelk) got some recognition to his Colockum elk research paper today in the Yakima Herald Republic. The story is pretty good but its funny to see the responses that WDFW had on the topic. Good job Aaron.   :tup:   Keep up the good work.

Offline Skyvalhunter

  • Washington For Wildlife
  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Explorer
  • ******
  • Join Date: Oct 2007
  • Posts: 16010
  • Location: Sky valley/Methow
Re: Elk article in Yakima Herald newspaper
« Reply #1 on: June 15, 2010, 05:21:44 AM »
DO you have an online link?
The only man who never makes a mistake, is the man who never does anything!!
The further one goes into the wilderness, the greater the attraction of its lonely freedom.

Offline Buschingc

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Longhunter
  • *****
  • Join Date: Apr 2008
  • Posts: 521
  • Location: Moses Lake, Wa
  • Go Big or Go Home...
Re: Elk article in Yakima Herald newspaper
« Reply #2 on: June 15, 2010, 05:39:41 AM »
Good read, makes sense....

Offline Skyvalhunter

  • Washington For Wildlife
  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Explorer
  • ******
  • Join Date: Oct 2007
  • Posts: 16010
  • Location: Sky valley/Methow
The only man who never makes a mistake, is the man who never does anything!!
The further one goes into the wilderness, the greater the attraction of its lonely freedom.

Offline whacker1

  • Trade Count: (+3)
  • Old Salt
  • ******
  • Join Date: Dec 2008
  • Posts: 5816
  • Location: Spokane
Re: Elk article in Yakima Herald newspaper
« Reply #4 on: June 15, 2010, 06:40:12 AM »
It is amazing that when you get the media involved that you begin to draw additional attention to a subject.  Well written article showing both sides of the conversation to the public and will continue to get additional attention from WDFW, because the public has now been exposed to a different point of view.

 :tup:

Offline C-Money

  • Non-Hunting Topics
  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Explorer
  • ******
  • Join Date: Sep 2008
  • Posts: 10941
  • Location: Grant County
  • Self proclaimed 3pt master
Re: Elk article in Yakima Herald newspaper
« Reply #5 on: June 15, 2010, 06:49:27 AM »
Interesting!
I felt like a one legged cat trying to bury a terd on a frozen pond!

Offline bearpaw

  • Family, Friends, Outdoors
  • Administrator
  • Trade Count: (+10)
  • Legend
  • *****
  • Join Date: Apr 2009
  • Posts: 38555
  • Location: Idaho<->Colville
  • "Rather Be Cougar Huntin"
    • http://www.facebook.com/DaleDenney
    • Bearpaw Outfitters
  • Groups: NRA, SCI, F4WM, NWTF, IOGA, MOGA, CCOC, BBB, RMEF, WSTA, WSB
Re: Elk article in Yakima Herald newspaper
« Reply #6 on: June 15, 2010, 06:54:23 AM »
Quote
Clausing said a permit-only system would mean losing about 75 percent of the elk hunters who typically work the Colockum.

This wording tells me they are more worried about losing the hunters (dollars).



Quote
“If we have 4,000 out there right now, we’d totally displace 3,000 hunters … that will have to find somewhere else to go. And every hunt camp would be disrupted,” he says. “We’re trying to get to the same objective without disrupting the greatest number of people. If you displace these hunters, you’re just going to move your problem somewhere else.”

This admission is confirmation that the problem exists. I agree whacker1, this will get people talking and it has exposed them to another viewpoint which in the longrun will most likely be good for the elk herd.
Americans are systematically advocating, legislating, and voting away each others rights. Support all user groups & quit losing opportunity!

http://bearpawoutfitters.com Guided Hunts, Unguided, & Drop Camps in Idaho, Montana, Utah, and Wash. Hunts with tags available (no draw needed) for spring bear, fall bear, bison, cougar, elk, mule deer, turkey, whitetail, & wolf! http://trophymaps.com DIY Hunting Maps are also offered

Offline General Disarray

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Scout
  • ****
  • Join Date: May 2007
  • Posts: 394
  • Location: Selah
Re: Elk article in Yakima Herald newspaper
« Reply #7 on: June 15, 2010, 07:39:32 AM »
must've missed the part of the article mentioning the poaching of branched bulls by Native Americans... >:(
hey, where's Professor Chaos? Anyone seen him?

This post will be deleted in 5, 4, 3, 2....

Offline colockumelk

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Frontiersman
  • *****
  • Join Date: Jan 2009
  • Posts: 4910
  • Location: Watertown, NY
Re: Elk article in Yakima Herald newspaper
« Reply #8 on: June 15, 2010, 09:53:19 AM »
For a reference here is a link to the paper that I wrote.

http://hunting-washington.com/smf/index.php/topic,47084.0.html

 General D. In the paper I wrote about the the Yakamas.  It's just a part of the problem, its not THE problem.  I explained it to the reporter like this. 

I like to use the river system in Central Washington as an example of how one or two problems combine to create on big problem.  The overall problem is bull elk recruitment.  AKA more bulls are killed than are produced every year.  This will be the end point/The Columbia River.

The Bumping River/Openess of the Terrain and the Tieton River=Large amount of road access flow into each other and become the Naches River/Geographical Advantages to Hunters.  Meanwhile the Cle Elum River/Herd migration (or lack thereofe) flows into the Northern Yakima River/Large amounts of hunters.  The Northern Yakima River/Hunter success is not weather dependent-large amount of hunters is combined with the Naches River/ Geography of the area contributes to likelier hunter success which becomes THE Yakima River/Spike survival %.  Now the Yakima flows happily along and just as it hits the Columbia River/Bull Recruitment the Snake River/Poaching and Tribal Hunting is brought into the equation.  So all of these factors/rivers flow into one another and add onto each other to give you the overall problem/Big Huge River.  Again the Tribal Hunting does NOT help out but it's not the ONLY problem. 

"We Sleep Safe In Our Beds because rough men stand ready in the night to visit violence on those that would do us harm."
Author: George Orwell

Offline Elkaholic daWg

  • Political & Covid-19 Topics
  • Trade Count: (+2)
  • Old Salt
  • ******
  • Join Date: Mar 2009
  • Posts: 6068
  • Location: Arlington Wa / Rock n Roll-Kelly Hill
Re: Elk article in Yakima Herald newspaper
« Reply #9 on: June 15, 2010, 10:11:25 AM »
must've missed the part of the article mentioning the poaching of branched bulls by Native Americans... >:(

 True Colockumelk, but it seems no one wants to touch that subject.
Blue Ribbon Coalition
CCRKBA
SAF
NRA                        
Go DaWgs!!

Offline colockumelk

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Frontiersman
  • *****
  • Join Date: Jan 2009
  • Posts: 4910
  • Location: Watertown, NY
Re: Elk article in Yakima Herald newspaper
« Reply #10 on: June 15, 2010, 10:44:14 AM »
No one wants to touch that subject because no one has the balls or the determination to take this head on.  If people on here or as the hunting community would be willing to come together and collect evidence on how immoral and unethical the Tribes really are when it comes to their unrestricted hunting, and then started a media campaign using those pictures and video and the researched facts the Tribes COULD NOT DO ANYTHING ABOUT IT!!!!!!!!!!!  What are they gonna do?  There's a reason why they never talk about it.  Because they know if what they do was brought to the medias attention they would be screwed.  WE HAVE THE POWER not them.  They can not and will not control their hunters.  We are in the right they are in the wrong.  If we would raise awareness about what they do in the media and in picketing Olympia doing anything and everything to bring the truth to light SOMETHING WOULD BE DONE!!!!  Its a PR campaign and when the truth comes out they will LOOK LIKE CRAP!!!!  They sit there HOPING and PRAYING that nobody does that.  Why do you think a bunch of Yakamas came on here last year when I started talking about what they do? Because they know how much damage can be done by speaking the truty.  Now that no one talks about it where have they gone? 

No if those of you who live in Washington want to change how the tribes are allowed to do business you CAN do something.  And don't play nice.  Go for the jugular.  YOU are right not THEM.  I get sick of people thinking nothing can change.  Public perception is a very powerful thing.  Right now the public is on their side.  You show the truth and people will jump ship to your side.

PS Elk Dawg this isn't directed at you.  Its directed at all the people who have said we can't do anything.  I'd do what I just said in a heart beat however Im in Alabama so I can't do it.
"We Sleep Safe In Our Beds because rough men stand ready in the night to visit violence on those that would do us harm."
Author: George Orwell

Offline Ridgerunner

  • Trade Count: (+1)
  • Old Salt
  • ******
  • Join Date: Mar 2007
  • Posts: 5073
  • Location: Enumclaw
Re: Elk article in Yakima Herald newspaper
« Reply #11 on: June 15, 2010, 10:55:53 AM »
now that the article was published someone needs to write an editorial piece talking about the other big pieceof the puzzle that was left out of the article, start the PR campaign that way.

Offline grundy53

  • Global Moderator
  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Explorer
  • *****
  • Join Date: Mar 2010
  • Posts: 12860
  • Location: Lake Stevens
  • Learn something new everyday.
    • facebook
Re: Elk article in Yakima Herald newspaper
« Reply #12 on: June 15, 2010, 11:08:42 AM »
now that the article was published someone needs to write an editorial piece talking about the other big pieceof the puzzle that was left out of the article, start the PR campaign that way.


 :yeah:
Molôn Labé
Can you skin Grizz?

The opinions expressed in my posts do not represent those of the forum.

Offline Special T

  • Truth the new Hate Speech.
  • Business Sponsor
  • Trade Count: (+13)
  • Legend
  • *****
  • Join Date: Aug 2009
  • Posts: 25043
  • Location: Skagit Valley
  • Make it Rain!
    • Silver Arrow Bowmen
    • Silver Arrow Bowmen
Re: Elk article in Yakima Herald newspaper
« Reply #13 on: June 15, 2010, 11:24:12 AM »
I think that was a fair writeup by the Yakima herald. Atta boy from a fellow wildcat... I especially like the last line from the article.  “Guys just aren't seeing legal animals,” Blanchard says. “And if you're not successful, after a while you take up golf, you know?”
That parting shot should be a wake up call for anyone at the WDFW... Hunters have other opportunities for their time and $$$. Many of those options have nothing to do with spending their hard earned $$$ with the WDFW.  :twocents:

In archery we have something like the way of the superior man. When the archer misses the center of the target, he turns round and seeks for the cause of his failure in himself. 

Confucius

Offline runamuk

  • Trade Count: (+1)
  • Explorer
  • ******
  • Join Date: Jan 2008
  • Posts: 17878
Re: Elk article in Yakima Herald newspaper
« Reply #14 on: June 15, 2010, 11:29:49 AM »
good article...I posted a comment alluding to the useless nature of a management plan that allows one user group to continue to harvest unchecked.....might make it in might not.  I may end up on a hit list but I keep saying something needs to be done to stop this be it elk or fishing or any other use that is excessive where we are restricted to supposedly help management.

Offline Skyvalhunter

  • Washington For Wildlife
  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Explorer
  • ******
  • Join Date: Oct 2007
  • Posts: 16010
  • Location: Sky valley/Methow
Re: Elk article in Yakima Herald newspaper
« Reply #15 on: June 15, 2010, 11:42:12 AM »
Atleast Native Americans weren't mentioned this time!!
The only man who never makes a mistake, is the man who never does anything!!
The further one goes into the wilderness, the greater the attraction of its lonely freedom.

Offline colockumelk

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Frontiersman
  • *****
  • Join Date: Jan 2009
  • Posts: 4910
  • Location: Watertown, NY
Re: Elk article in Yakima Herald newspaper
« Reply #16 on: June 15, 2010, 07:26:45 PM »
now that the article was published someone needs to write an editorial piece talking about the other big pieceof the puzzle that was left out of the article, start the PR campaign that way.

I agree.  But only if people use facts that they can use to back up their argument.  Remember if you give out data but don't have something to back it up with you are viewed as ignorant or worse a racist.  But if you have pictures and petitions etc then you are viewed as a patriot.

As far as the tribal thing goes.  Before we go cleaning someone elses house up we need to make sure our house is clean first.  And in the instance of the Colockum Elk herd; that house is far from clean.  The goal of my paper and of the ensuing article was to raise awareness of a very dramatic problem that exists in the Colockum Elk herd.  Most people until today after reading that article probably didn't have a clue that the problem was that bad let alone that they had lost 70% of the adult bulls.  Hopefully alot of people take notice now and start doing the right thing which is buggin and writing the WDFW.  Hopefully as responsible sportsmen we do take action. 

Especially since its quite obvious that the WDFW isn't going to EVER do the right thing.  To be honest I was very disappointed in their responses to my paper.  It was obvious that they were not prepared and it was obvious that they either are not aware of this problem or do not care.  I think they don't care.  The statement about losing hunters says it all.  We want the money and don't care that they have lost 70% of the branch bull population is not a big deal.   :yike:  That last part right there says it all where their priorities lie.  Hopefully something is done.   
"We Sleep Safe In Our Beds because rough men stand ready in the night to visit violence on those that would do us harm."
Author: George Orwell

Offline bobcat

  • Global Moderator
  • Trade Count: (+14)
  • Legend
  • *****
  • Join Date: Mar 2007
  • Posts: 39202
  • Location: Rochester
    • robert68
Re: Elk article in Yakima Herald newspaper
« Reply #17 on: June 15, 2010, 07:30:50 PM »
colockumelk,

Just curious... do you know if elk are native in the Colockum? I'm thinking not but I don't know for certain.

Offline colockumelk

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Frontiersman
  • *****
  • Join Date: Jan 2009
  • Posts: 4910
  • Location: Watertown, NY
Re: Elk article in Yakima Herald newspaper
« Reply #18 on: June 15, 2010, 07:39:39 PM »
From what I've read there were some on the very western part around the PCT.  And there was some in the Quilomene in the sage brush just like alot of plains type areas.  But as far as an actual "herd" that stayed there it is not beleived that there was any. 

Now there are cave and rock pictures from the Yakamas that show Indians hunting elk in the area.  So there was SOME elk here.  But it is believed that when the Yakamas finally domesticated horses is when the elk in the area disappeared.  When Whites settled the Kittitas Valley there was no record of elk there at that time.  UNTIL.... 1919 when local WHITE Sportsman reintroduced elk into the area. 

Thank you for asking that Bobcat I had completely forgotten that bit of information until now.  I'd forgotten that one of the theories behind why there used to be elk but they disappeared by the time whites got here was because the INDIANS had hunted them to extinction. 
"We Sleep Safe In Our Beds because rough men stand ready in the night to visit violence on those that would do us harm."
Author: George Orwell

Offline Bob33

  • Global Moderator
  • Trade Count: (+3)
  • Legend
  • *****
  • Join Date: Apr 2009
  • Posts: 21761
  • Groups: SCI, RMEF, NRA, Hunter Education
Re: Elk article in Yakima Herald newspaper
« Reply #19 on: June 15, 2010, 07:42:09 PM »
[I think they don't care.  The statement about losing hunters says it all.  We want the money and don't care that they have lost 70% of the branch bull population is not a big deal. 
I'm just curious who you think they'll sell licenses to when all the elk are gone?
Nature. It's cheaper than therapy.

Offline Special T

  • Truth the new Hate Speech.
  • Business Sponsor
  • Trade Count: (+13)
  • Legend
  • *****
  • Join Date: Aug 2009
  • Posts: 25043
  • Location: Skagit Valley
  • Make it Rain!
    • Silver Arrow Bowmen
    • Silver Arrow Bowmen
Re: Elk article in Yakima Herald newspaper
« Reply #20 on: June 15, 2010, 08:04:00 PM »
My bet Bob is they will burn that bridge when they get there... Since less people at the WDFW actually hunt anymore they don't seem to have a vested interest.... I think conspiracy theory  would bed that they are tying to change their funding source.... That makes no since since hunting $$$ makes up a large portion of the $$$ they recieve... Unless they are able to raid Pittman-Roberts funds to fund themselves....
In archery we have something like the way of the superior man. When the archer misses the center of the target, he turns round and seeks for the cause of his failure in himself. 

Confucius

Offline dkhtr

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Tracker
  • **
  • Join Date: Sep 2007
  • Posts: 34
Re: Elk article in Yakima Herald newspaper
« Reply #21 on: June 16, 2010, 08:09:38 AM »
We were hunting in Idaho a couple years ago and came across a group of Wa. game wardens we spent time with during the week.  I asked them why they hunted Idaho when it would seem they would have a lot of "inside" info as to where to hunt, know owners of private property, etc.  There response was "not enough animals to waste time hunting"

Offline WSU

  • Political & Covid-19 Topics
  • Trade Count: (+1)
  • Old Salt
  • ******
  • Join Date: Mar 2009
  • Posts: 5502
Re: Elk article in Yakima Herald newspaper
« Reply #22 on: June 16, 2010, 08:22:43 AM »
I'm actually a little inclined to agree with WDFW (talk about a popular sentiment!).  With an added yearling bull recruitment of 25-30% this past season, it is not at all clear to me that the true-spike regulation isn't working.  When we last discussed this, Clockum stated that he did not know what the effect of the new regulation is.  It now appears that stats are available.  As Clockum stated, an added 71 bulls survived the season.  That seems like a pretty good start, especially because the herd is not in immediate (as in next year) danger of collapse.  It is presently slightly over management objective.  Assuming that roughly 25 to 30 percent more spikes survive each season, that  is a pretty damn good improvement without having to drastically curtail opportunity.  Like it or not, we have to come to terms with the fact that Washington is the smallest western state, has one of the smallest (if not the smallest) population of elk, has very localized elk herds, and a lot of hunters. 

Offline SpotandStalk

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Tracker
  • **
  • Join Date: Mar 2009
  • Posts: 55
Re: Elk article in Yakima Herald newspaper
« Reply #23 on: June 16, 2010, 09:10:26 PM »
I have tried to stay out of this subject because I am of the opinion that I don't know all there is to know about the Colockum elk herd, though I live at the base of the Colockum and I spend a considerable amount of time "following" the herd throughout the year.  I have spike hunted the Colockum since I was 10 (currently 29) and my family has hunted it for generations (and we plan to continue).  I 100% agree with fact that management strategies need to be seriously looked at and changes are needed in some areas. But I have heard too much over the last year how all the branch bulls in the Colockum are disappearing....I say BS and it is more of bull patterns and migrations changing due to a changing landscape.

The first issue that I personally have stressed to many, including WDFW, is my 100% disagreement with managing the Teanaway, Mission, Naneum, and Quilomene units like they are one and the same.  Sorry, its apples to oranges.  Yes, there is major problem with spike recruitment in the Quilomene and maybe the east half of the Naneum, but there is very little spike recruitment problem in the west half of the Naneum, most of the Mission, and all of the Teanaway.  I will 100% agree with Aaron on every subject IF the geographic area is confined to the Quilomene unit, but when you lump in the Mission, Naneum, and Teanaway I cannot agree. 

If you were to ask me if there are less mature bulls now than there were 10 years ago in the Quilomene unit, I would yes, absolutely; but if you were to ask me if there are less mature bulls now than there were 10 years ago in the "Colockum" herd, I would say no, they just have changed their migrations, they have gotten smarter, and have really developed into a couple different sub herds.  A majority of the Teanaway bulls no longer winter in the Quilomene, and even a good number of Naneum and Mission bulls no longer winter in the Quilomene.  So when you see branch bull counts by WDFW show a drastic decline, you have to consider that they only fly the Quilomene and are missing a huge amount of bulls.  So I ask, is this pattern showing a drop in total number of bulls in the "Colockum" or just a change in bull migration?

And I think WDFW missed the mark with "true spike".  Perhaps it will prove a valuable tool and increase spike recruitment, but a much more effective tool that would help address the forbidden subject--tribal hunting--as well, would be road closures.  WDFW greatly missed an opportunity that was served on a platter to FINALLY make a management decision that would address the over-harvest of mature bulls in the Colockum by tribal hunters.  They had all the data they needed to back up a decision for road closures and/or seasonal closures that would have an impact on tribal hunting and they let it slip through the cracks.

I know how I roll my eyes when I see a long post like this, so my apologies for ranting.



 


Offline colockumelk

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Frontiersman
  • *****
  • Join Date: Jan 2009
  • Posts: 4910
  • Location: Watertown, NY
Re: Elk article in Yakima Herald newspaper
« Reply #24 on: June 17, 2010, 10:22:20 AM »
  It is presently slightly over management objective.  Assuming that roughly 25 to 30 percent more spikes survive each season, that  is a pretty damn good improvement without having to drastically curtail opportunity.  Like it or not, we have to come to terms with the fact that Washington is the smallest western state, has one of the smallest (if not the smallest) population of elk, has very localized elk herds, and a lot of hunters. 

#1 why do you let the WDFW fool you with the "above managment objective"  Like I said in the article that is TOTAL 100% SPIN to make themselves look good.  Their #1 goal is to get the branch bull to cow ratio to 12-15:100 cows.  In the past ten years that number has dropped to 2.5:100.  Yes the herd numbers has reached its objective.  Big Whoop.  That herd is made up of 96% cows.  How healthy is that.  WSU you are wrong the WDFW is failing miserably. Its not about managment its about $$$$$.

#2  Assuming 25-30 percent more spikes is a huge assumption.  Because that did not happen.  Not even close.  The spike survival rate went up from 20% up to a whopping 25% survival rate.  Wow 5%.  It'll help but not much. 

#3 just because we have a small state with alot of hunters doesn't mean that we have to have crappy hunting and mismanagment of our herds.  I challenge you to tell me how a 70% decline in a branch bull population is good managment or good business?
"We Sleep Safe In Our Beds because rough men stand ready in the night to visit violence on those that would do us harm."
Author: George Orwell

Offline colockumelk

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Frontiersman
  • *****
  • Join Date: Jan 2009
  • Posts: 4910
  • Location: Watertown, NY
Re: Elk article in Yakima Herald newspaper
« Reply #25 on: June 17, 2010, 10:32:38 AM »
Spot and Stalk.  Thank you for your post.  I will agree I don't think that the Teanaway should be managed the same as the Naneum and the Quilomene.  Usually when I refer to the "Clockum"  I am referring to GMU's 328 and 329.  The terrain is completely different and so is road access.  

I will have to disagree with you on the branch bull population and its trend.  The WDFW does actually fly the entire Colockum, and not just the Quilomene like you suggest.  They only survey a percentage of the Yakima GMU's but they do overfly 100% of the Colockum GMU's.  Also the reason I wrote this paper is because of what I have witnessed in the passed 4 years.  And yes like yourself I spend alot of time up in the Colockum.  As far as "herd migrations" that is one unique thing about the Colockum elk herd.  They don't really migrate.  The majority of the Yakima herd migrates from the Pacific Crest Trail down to Oak Creek every year.  But in the Colockum 2/3 of the total Colockum elk herd spends its entire life east of Highway 97.  They migrate about 5 miles onto the wildlife refuge just before hunting season starts.  Then as soon as the hunting season ends they bomb farther east to the Columbia.  

One large impact on the herd is the Yakama Indian Tribe.  Word of mouth has gotten around about the quality bulls in the Colockum and even Whitefoot admitted that there's twice as many Indians up there as there was even 4 years ago.  They HAVE become a problem.  Ten years ago maybe one or two hunted up there.  Now there's too many to count.

As far as the road closures go you can thank a local hunting club that is 100% against road closures.  You can also thank our road hunters for writing all those letters complaining about how they can't possible go elk hunting without their ATV's.  Unfortunately people who walk in and are willing to write about it and support road closures are way outnumbered by the road hunting bunch who are more than willing to complain about road closures.  That is why.  

So for all you guys who complain about the Indians but at the same time are against road closures you are a hippo-crite  Again what I just said is definately not popular.  But alot of times the popular thing isn't the right thing.  I look forward to your posts spot and stalk.  especially since youve grown up around the area.  
« Last Edit: June 17, 2010, 11:07:03 AM by colockumelk »
"We Sleep Safe In Our Beds because rough men stand ready in the night to visit violence on those that would do us harm."
Author: George Orwell

Offline colockumelk

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Frontiersman
  • *****
  • Join Date: Jan 2009
  • Posts: 4910
  • Location: Watertown, NY
Re: Elk article in Yakima Herald newspaper
« Reply #26 on: June 17, 2010, 07:07:49 PM »
I heard that this article made it in the Seattle Paper. Can anyone confirm this?
"We Sleep Safe In Our Beds because rough men stand ready in the night to visit violence on those that would do us harm."
Author: George Orwell

Offline bobcat

  • Global Moderator
  • Trade Count: (+14)
  • Legend
  • *****
  • Join Date: Mar 2007
  • Posts: 39202
  • Location: Rochester
    • robert68
Re: Elk article in Yakima Herald newspaper
« Reply #27 on: June 17, 2010, 07:17:12 PM »
I did a search and didn't find it. But I did find another interesting article somewhat related to elk in this state:



 
Tuesday, May 18, 2010

Experimental Washington state grazing program put on hold
By Lynda V. Mapes

Seattle Times staff reporter

A controversial cattle-grazing program on state wildlife lands has been put on hold for the 2010 season after a sharp rebuke by a Superior Court judge.

The experimental Department of Fish and Wildlife grazing program, begun in 2005 in Southeast Washington, drew criticism from conservationists concerned about damage to native plants, streams and threatened fish runs. The Western Watershed Project, based in Hailey, Idaho, sued in 2008, challenging permits for the program.

Thurston County Superior Court Judge Paula Casey ruled last month that the department had no scientific basis for granting permits for grazing the lands on the promise that the program would benefit wildlife, including elk. The theory was that grazing cattle would stimulate growth of grasses and other plants that wildlife, such as elk, could eat.

"As I began to review the record, I was quite shocked," the judge said, according to a transcript of the proceedings. The department's own scientists had very harsh criticism of the program, the judge found, yet managers making the decisions about the plan "instead of responding with any scientific information countering the information advanced by the biologists seemed more about minimizing the effect of the warnings," the judge said.

Since the ruling, the department has decided to rest the lands grazed under the so-called Pilot Grazing Program. No decision has been announced at the department as to whether to appeal the judge's ruling.

A second, separate grazing effort in Kittitas County is also on hold for lack of funding and staff. That effort is also under challenge by the same group.

Phil Anderson, who recently became director of the agency - long after the experimental program started - said the department is going to take a step back and assess the pilot program before continuing it. For now, he says, he does not favor initiating any more grazing on lands that have not been grazed in the past 10 years, as the pilot program allowed.

"There were a lot of lessons learned," said Jennifer Quan, a lands-division manager in the department. "We could have shored up the research better at the beginning," she said. Also under evaluation are decisions to use lands for the program that were steep, near streams with protected fish, and to the agency's surprise, included large stands of a federally protected plant, Spalding's catchfly.

The pilot program was started with the support of Gov. Chris Gregoire as a way to help the Washington Cattlemen's Association. In November 2005, the department signed an agreement with the cattlemen to launch the experimental program, allowing the cattlemen to run their cows on public wildlife lands at no charge.

The Legislature appropriated hundreds of thousands of dollars for the program. Agency staffers put in nearly 4,000 hours on grazing plans, attending meetings, monitoring, and herding cattle. They installed more than 5 miles of fence, nearly 3 miles of pipeline and five troughs on wildlife lands.

The department had some bad luck and bad outcomes. Two employees were severely injured while stringing fencing. And the state's own reports on the program found missteps in implementation, with ranchers putting out too many cattle or letting them graze too long in one place, damaging habitat.

Offline colockumelk

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Frontiersman
  • *****
  • Join Date: Jan 2009
  • Posts: 4910
  • Location: Watertown, NY
Re: Elk article in Yakima Herald newspaper
« Reply #28 on: June 22, 2010, 07:42:48 PM »
must've missed the part of the article mentioning the poaching of branched bulls by Native Americans... >:(

General D.  Don't fret brother.  I am currently working on the second part of the paper.  It is about how hunting in our state of Washington discriminates based upon race, and how it is wrong.  It will also relate that issue to the Jim Crow laws and how the Yakama's and our Government only follow certain parts of the treaty.  Such as article 4 which states that Indians are not allowed to drink or buy alcohol and how Non-Natives are not allowed to sell alcohol to Indians and how its against the law.  But that one is not enforced.  I will post that paper sometime in August.  I've started working on it but..... I have to go to SERE (Survival Evasion Resistance Escape) School on Monday so I wont be able to write anything.  I can't  wait for the reaction from the media on that one.  It will be very interesting indeed.   :chuckle:
"We Sleep Safe In Our Beds because rough men stand ready in the night to visit violence on those that would do us harm."
Author: George Orwell

Offline grundy53

  • Global Moderator
  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Explorer
  • *****
  • Join Date: Mar 2010
  • Posts: 12860
  • Location: Lake Stevens
  • Learn something new everyday.
    • facebook
Re: Elk article in Yakima Herald newspaper
« Reply #29 on: June 22, 2010, 07:50:08 PM »
Good luck with SERE.
Molôn Labé
Can you skin Grizz?

The opinions expressed in my posts do not represent those of the forum.

Offline whacker1

  • Trade Count: (+3)
  • Old Salt
  • ******
  • Join Date: Dec 2008
  • Posts: 5816
  • Location: Spokane
Re: Elk article in Yakima Herald newspaper
« Reply #30 on: June 22, 2010, 08:16:20 PM »
must've missed the part of the article mentioning the poaching of branched bulls by Native Americans... >:(

General D.  Don't fret brother.  I am currently working on the second part of the paper.  It is about how hunting in our state of Washington discriminates based upon race, and how it is wrong.  It will also relate that issue to the Jim Crow laws and how the Yakama's and our Government only follow certain parts of the treaty.  Such as article 4 which states that Indians are not allowed to drink or buy alcohol and how Non-Natives are not allowed to sell alcohol to Indians and how its against the law.  But that one is not enforced.  I will post that paper sometime in August.  I've started working on it but..... I have to go to SERE (Survival Evasion Resistance Escape) School on Monday so I wont be able to write anything.  I can't  wait for the reaction from the media on that one.  It will be very interesting indeed.   :chuckle:

What do you mean?  You should have countless hours in a little box to write that paper.....  just joking - good luck with SERE

Offline sako223

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Longhunter
  • *****
  • Join Date: Sep 2009
  • Posts: 830
Re: Elk article in Yakima Herald newspaper
« Reply #31 on: June 22, 2010, 08:20:31 PM »
Quote
The pilot program was started with the support of Gov. Chris Gregoire as a way to help the Washington Cattlemen's Association. In November 2005, the department signed an agreement with the cattlemen to launch the experimental program, allowing the cattlemen to run their cows on public wildlife lands at no charge.
No Charge!!!

Quote
The Legislature appropriated hundreds of thousands of dollars for the program. Agency staffers put in nearly 4,000 hours on grazing plans, attending meetings, monitoring, and herding cattle. They installed more than 5 miles of fence, nearly 3 miles of pipeline and five troughs on wildlife lands.
Why are they herding cattle? Is this free day care?

Quote
The department had some bad luck and bad outcomes. Two employees were severely injured while stringing fencing. And the state's own reports on the program found missteps in implementation, with ranchers putting out too many cattle or letting them graze too long in one place, damaging habitat.
Cattleman have never been known to overgraze especially when they get free rent and herders.

They should tack somebody's balls to the outhouse and give them a hacksaw blade.
All that extra money should have been spent on game management like fencing in needed areas.


Offline elkaholic

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Longhunter
  • *****
  • Join Date: Jul 2007
  • Posts: 542
  • Location: Cheney,WA
  • Brokenleg elk
Re: Elk article in Yakima Herald newspaper
« Reply #32 on: June 22, 2010, 08:29:19 PM »
Box or a 55 gallon drum barrell..... Email me we can do lunch when you get abreak before you hit the firld part. I am at Fairchild

Offline colockumelk

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Frontiersman
  • *****
  • Join Date: Jan 2009
  • Posts: 4910
  • Location: Watertown, NY
Re: Elk article in Yakima Herald newspaper
« Reply #33 on: June 23, 2010, 06:42:44 PM »
Elkaholic I'd love to but I'm in the Army down here at Ft. Rucker, AL.  Unless your willing to pay for the air fare.  :chuckle:
"We Sleep Safe In Our Beds because rough men stand ready in the night to visit violence on those that would do us harm."
Author: George Orwell

Offline 1morebuck

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Longhunter
  • *****
  • Join Date: Apr 2010
  • Posts: 627
  • Location: Shelton
  • Team Hood Canal Hookers
Re: Elk article in Yakima Herald newspaper
« Reply #34 on: June 23, 2010, 08:30:26 PM »
Colockumelk, I would agree with most of the statements you are writing, as an outdoor writer in the newspaper field it is rare to get coverage about such issues. You feel free to send me any fact based article on the WDFW's poor management that I can apply to the entire state and I will publish it. I have touched base on this within the pages of my paper and had quite a response from local hunters and WDFW employees, heck ol' dave or Phil wont even return my calls  :chuckle:. When you you be back from AL?

PS I have family around Montgomery, so if you want a good shin-dig and a col' beer let me know!

Offline colockumelk

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Frontiersman
  • *****
  • Join Date: Jan 2009
  • Posts: 4910
  • Location: Watertown, NY
Re: Elk article in Yakima Herald newspaper
« Reply #35 on: June 23, 2010, 09:38:52 PM »
1morebuck.  Feel free to use anything you want in the paper I wrote about the Colockum.  Follow this link and at the bottom of the first post you can open the paper I wrote.  It has graphs and everything.  I don't know if I could do one for the entire state but I know in Central Washington our deer herd has been cut in half by disease and predation.  Yet there is still a general season and they still give out rut permits.  That's mismanagment.

After SERE school I plan on finishing a paper that has to do with Tribal hunting and how it is unfair based upon racial discrimination and I'll relate it to the Jim Crow laws etc.  To my knowledge this issue has not been tackled from this standpoint and it should be pretty interesting to see the response.  It will also talk about how our government and theirs only follows certain portions of the treaty.   Such as Article 9 is pretty much ignored.  FYI article 9 states that Indians are not allowed to consume alcohol and no one is allowed to sell alcohol to them. 

As far as flight school goes I'll be here until fall of 2011.  After that I will most likely be stationed in Afghanistan.  Hopefully hunting down the Taliban in either an Apache Longbow or a Kiowa Warrior.  :IBCOOL:
"We Sleep Safe In Our Beds because rough men stand ready in the night to visit violence on those that would do us harm."
Author: George Orwell

Offline elkaholic

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Longhunter
  • *****
  • Join Date: Jul 2007
  • Posts: 542
  • Location: Cheney,WA
  • Brokenleg elk
Re: Elk article in Yakima Herald newspaper
« Reply #36 on: June 23, 2010, 09:43:31 PM »
*censored*. I though you were at the SERE scholl here... Well when you get back her and near SPokaen, Ill buy you lunch! or Make some elk brats from my last years bull! :drool:

Offline 1morebuck

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Longhunter
  • *****
  • Join Date: Apr 2010
  • Posts: 627
  • Location: Shelton
  • Team Hood Canal Hookers
Re: Elk article in Yakima Herald newspaper
« Reply #37 on: June 24, 2010, 08:57:45 AM »
Colockum, thank you. I will send you an article or two on some of the stuff I cover as well.

Thank you for your service and a speedy return home.

Kelly

Offline denali

  • Washington For Wildlife
  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Sourdough
  • *****
  • Join Date: May 2009
  • Posts: 2212
  • Location: Tri Cities
    • https://www.facebook.com/bret.greene
Re: Elk article in Yakima Herald newspaper
« Reply #38 on: July 04, 2010, 07:39:01 PM »
just ran in the Tri-City Herold, thank you Colocomelk.
Honesty is the best policy,  but insanity is a better defense.

Offline 300magman

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Tracker
  • **
  • Join Date: Jul 2010
  • Posts: 81
Re: Elk article in Yakima Herald newspaper
« Reply #39 on: July 04, 2010, 08:50:16 PM »
Colockumelk,
Thanks for serving this country, I have been in the NAVY for 19 years... My boss just came from SERE school he was an instructor, you will be tested I can tell you that.

In response to your post about the Elk Herds. I truly believe that for the most part you are right on the money... The tribes must have some kind of guidance on what they can a cannot do.. Our Elk numbers as a whole in the state of Washington are in bad shape in my opinion. BUt one thing I think you forgot to touch on is POACHING in our state.....I try to hunt every season and for the past twenty years there has not been one season go by that I dont find a BIG bull Elk that has been shot and the horns takens and the rest of the Elk left there to rot... This is abosloute crap in my book. These poachers are doing alot of unseen damage on our ELK. Every year we hear about a ring of poachers getting caught....THEY SHOULD BE HUNG RIGHT THEN AND THERE IN MY BOOK... Several years ago a ring of poachers were caught hunting the Hanford Site out of Richland Wa. These guys had a (pay me and i will take you hunting operation going on) THey were killing numerous record book bulls out of season not to mention the fact the land is closed to any and all hunting.
I guess what i am saying is we need to look real hard at POACHING in our state. Dont turn them in for just the points you will gain but do it because it is wrong and unethical.........

KURT

Offline br8kitoff

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Hunter
  • ***
  • Join Date: Jul 2010
  • Posts: 128
  • Location: Silverdale
Re: Elk article in Yakima Herald newspaper
« Reply #40 on: July 07, 2010, 08:43:10 PM »
Very good arguements!  I have to agree with Colockumelk with much of what he has said..
I began hunting the 328 in 1990 and have ever since, except for 2 years I went for trophy bulls in the 618....steep!  I've made early archery camp just below the "T" of swift creek in "JUDY's Tamarack Forest"  which they recently cut down.  Big blue crew cab ford and wall tent IAFF sicker and plates.  I walk/ hike from there and have found myself just below the towers on Nanum Ridge to Walter Flats to the western edge of the perserve.  Some of you recall when you used to have to pick clockum or Yakima.  The only people Iv'e seen try to make the place better for elk are the RMEF and the gates they have been putting up over the last few years!! There used to be ALOT of bow hunters compared to now and they started dropping off when WDFW took cows away and will probably fall even more with the new rule.  I they keep it I bet Warren his 2 brothers my hunting buddy and I will be damn near the only ones left, I will probably scout the Taneum this weekend though.  I have personally witnessed tribal members shoot BIG branch antlered bulls as they walk across the road out of the preserve going to the Mission, because it closed during archery, and stack them up in the backs of their trucks like cord wood.  The game wardens say their hands are tied and there "ain't *censored* they can do and the tribe knows it" and the tribes presence is growing. I used to see huge bulls and large herds not so much any more, unless your catching them comming out of the preserve.  There were always large herds there but there were also large groups everywhere else.  I guess the point I'm making is that I emailed WDFW and they gave me a spin email on how They  how "they" and the tribes are working together to manage them, but it gets worse every year!
We are what we repeatedly do.  Excellence, therefore, is not an act but a habit.
IAFF Local 2819

Offline colockumelk

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Frontiersman
  • *****
  • Join Date: Jan 2009
  • Posts: 4910
  • Location: Watertown, NY
Re: Elk article in Yakima Herald newspaper
« Reply #41 on: July 19, 2010, 12:54:21 PM »
just ran in the Tri-City Herold, thank you Colocomelk.
 

Holy cow really? That is so awesome for the Colockum elk herd. Now even more people will start to learn the truth.

Thanks for the support. I just got back crime SERE school and it was very challenging. It was also an AWSOME school. Thanks again for the support and please spread what you know about the colockum herd to raise more awareness. Thanks all.
"We Sleep Safe In Our Beds because rough men stand ready in the night to visit violence on those that would do us harm."
Author: George Orwell

Offline Dan-o

  • Global Moderator
  • Trade Count: (+30)
  • Explorer
  • *****
  • Join Date: Jul 2010
  • Posts: 18129
Re: Elk article in Yakima Herald newspaper
« Reply #42 on: July 20, 2010, 10:00:37 PM »
Really an interesting article.   Thanks, ColockumElk.    Thanks for doing the hard work that went into it, and for having the passion to push for the benefit of the herd.
Member:   Yakstrakgutp (or whatever we are)
I love the BFRO!!!
I wonder how many people will touch their nose to their screen trying to read this...

 


* Advertisement

* Recent Topics

Cell cam recommendation for security? by Stein
[Today at 05:01:50 PM]


Looking for Solid 22 LR input by Zardoz
[Today at 04:57:06 PM]


If this is your trap by MADMAX
[Today at 04:40:56 PM]


Raffle ticket sales 2025 by trophyhunt
[Today at 03:57:41 PM]


2025 Montana alternate list by Sakko300wsm
[Today at 03:55:08 PM]


The end? Bird bands. by hdshot
[Today at 03:44:43 PM]


WA Moose scouting by TriggerMike
[Today at 03:15:08 PM]


3 days for Kings by Tball77
[Today at 02:46:19 PM]


North Sea Fishing trip by BLH69
[Today at 02:05:14 PM]


2025 Crab! by BLH69
[Today at 02:02:40 PM]


Early Huckleberry Bull Moose tag drawn! by MMCCAULEY
[Today at 09:25:10 AM]


I'm Going To Need Karl To Come up With That 290 Muley Sunscreen Bug Spray Combo by riflehunter
[Today at 08:03:26 AM]


Mt. St. Helens Goat by CNELK
[Today at 07:31:32 AM]


49 Degrees North Early Bull Moose by trophyhunt
[Today at 06:01:45 AM]


Hunting bears in the thick stuff by J-Bone
[Yesterday at 09:23:26 PM]


Calling in August in Western Washington by J-Bone
[Yesterday at 06:44:50 PM]


How To Get Your $0.00 Tax Stamp - Black Hammer Arms by dreadi
[Yesterday at 06:39:00 PM]


Crabbing at cornet bay? by swanderek
[Yesterday at 06:32:44 PM]


Wyoming elk who's in? by bobcat
[Yesterday at 06:23:38 PM]

SimplePortal 2.3.7 © 2008-2025, SimplePortal