Western Wa elk hunting and scouting questions

[clhutner]

I am fairly new to elk hunting and am trying to get a little more experience as to what to look for as far as scouting.  I was thinking of going down near Packwood area  since that is Natl Forest.  Was wondering, as far as looking in the map book, what do you look for as far as starting points to scout for elk.  I am hoping to go camping down there a few times this summer and combine that with scouting.  But not sure where to start.  Do all the areas down there hold elk or are they concentrated in certain areas.  I am not asking for a specific spot to go to here, i am just wondering for example, are they concentrated in the east side of the forest, etc. I know that homework will need to be done to be succesful, but really do not have any idea as where to begin when checking out a new area. Also, if anybody is familiar with that area, is it as big an area as it looks on the map,and is it as busy as the winston unit? Sorry for the long post and thanks.

[MIKEXRAY]

I don't hunt that area, I hunt hwy 410 on the east side but can give some general observations I have figured out. Where ever I have hunted elk, they are every where and spread out. I always look at a map and find areas away from civilization. I hunted my first three years in the grassy valleys where I found the most sign but then realized (after three unsucessful years)the elk were mostly there at night feeding, I then found their bedding areas and now I set up between feedind and bedding areas. Its pretty exciting to hear the bulls bringing the herds towards you in the timber at first light. Someone that hunts that area will post and give you better detail of your area. Good luck.

[edmondshunter]

All the gmu's in that area are fairly popular.  What season are you going to hunt? Modern fire, Muzzleload, Archery?  It makes a difference.  Mod fire in the Packwood area is way over hunted,  I was there 07 for Elk and it was hunter orange as far as the eye could see.  I could see hunters piled up in small clear-cuts from the highway. 

Winston and Mossyrock have more area to spread out in, but are also busy during mod fire.  Archery is at the beginning of the rut in that region so the elk are higher up, they haven't moved down to the valley drainages yet.  Muzzleload is in the thick of the rut, and Elk are down in the valleys and river bottoms.

The elk are smart, they know where they are safe so you really have to do your home work to get into position to find themin transition   from deep cover in the morning to the grazing areas. And again in the evening.

[Bigshooter]

The one thing that I have found about hunting the packwood unit is where the most amount of elk are, are where the most amount of people are.  You can get away from the people but you won't be hunting the same amount of elk.  If I were you I would hunt the border between the Loowit and the packwood.  Tons of elk but also some years a ton of people.  Remember the Loowit is closed to hunting in general season.  So know the boundaries.

[bobcat]

The one thing that I have found about hunting the packwood unit is where the most amount of elk are, are where the most amount of people are. 

A truer statement has never been said! And, you could replace "the packwood unit" with Washington State and it would still be true. I've learned that over the years. If you try to hunt elk where nobody else is hunting, then you're probably not going to find any elk. It's not true 100% of the time, but pretty close. (not many secret spots anymore)

[PolarBear]

I disagree about the "secret spots".  Hunters are getting more and more lazy and a little homework can put you right in the middle of where the elk hide when they are pressured and usually it is right under everyone else's nose.  My 350+ bull that I stuck in the Randle unit was in a spot where no one had the balls to go into.  All the scouting that I did to find him and never saw a single other person.  Probably because they were hanging a couple of miles in through some thick timber.
That LooWit/Packwood border can be pretty decent if you are good at calling and willing to wait.  There are a bunch of guys that try it but give it up pretty quickly.  There are always bulls that get kicked across or just wander out.  You have to be stealth though because they get pretty hard sometimes.

[bowhunterty]

Agree with PolarBear. The Packwood and Lewis River that border the Loowit can be good at times but you have to be patient.  First couple days there are a lot of people. Scouting pays off. No your GMU boundries. Hey Polarbear any more pictures of your bull. Checked out the one you had, sweet.  Hunt all those areas down that way.  Scout at least 7 days before the season starts. You got the bull in the late season?

[bobcat]

I disagree about the "secret spots".  Hunters are getting more and more lazy and a little homework can put you right in the middle of where the elk hide when they are pressured and usually it is right under everyone else's nose. 

You're right. Maybe I should have said "not many secret spots next to a road." I think I'm one of those "lazy" hunters you refer to. 

[Bigshooter]

The one thing that I have found about hunting the packwood unit is where the most amount of elk are, are where the most amount of people are. 

A truer statement has never been said! And, you could replace "the packwood unit" with Washington State and it would still be true. I've learned that over the years. If you try to hunt elk where nobody else is hunting, then you're probably not going to find any elk. It's not true 100% of the time, but pretty close. (not many secret spots anymore)

This is why you have to scout.  I have a couple of spots in the packwood unit that I hunt and almost always get into elk and have never saw another person.

[bowhunterty]

Bigshooter are you a bowhunter?

[PolarBear]

Bowhunterty, I shot him on Thanksgiving morning during late season.  I dont have any field pics cuz I was hunting alone.  All I have are pics with just the fleshed out head.  I boned it out and left the cape and all for the coyotes.

[clhutner]

I am a bow hunter and would be hunting during bow season.  I am a little curious, where do you guys start when scouting a new area?  Do you just drive the forest roads until you see elk or are there certain things to look for as far as a place to get out and start walking? Thanks everyone for the info.  Is the packwood and lewis river unit spread out a little more than the winston unit?  it seemed to me that everyone in the winton unit were concentrated in the same area and there want a whole lot of acess areas. I saw vehicles at every gate that was closed and I didnt want to walk out into someebody else' s set up and ruin their hard work.  So I am curious, is it ok to walk out where someone else has been all day or is it more polite to find another area?  I have always moved on and tried to find somewhere else so I dont piss anyone off.  Being a beginner, I really dont want to screw up what somebody else has worked on all year.

[bobcat]

You just might have to park at a gate that already has vehicles there, or you may not have anywhere to hunt. It all depends on the road system behind that gate. If the gated road only goes a half mile and ends, then you should probably leave it to whoever is already parked there. But if an entire road system is gated off, feel free to park there and walk in with everybody else. Once you get back in a ways and get in the timber chances are you won't see anybody anyway.

[edmondshunter]

All great advise.  If I were you Id do as much homework as possible before I even went to scout.  Get a map of a few areas of interest,  you don't want a super detailed map, just a good topo.  Look for areas that the elk should be using for that season.  I'm gonna guess at least 2500 ft up to the snow line if there is one.  The drainages and south facing slopes with pasture surrounded by timber is a good place to start.  Also the best resources to look into is the local ranger stations, F&G officers in the area, county clerk, etc.

During archery the big bulls are just starting to feel the urge, but they are still hiding out in the dark deep reaches away from most of the herd cows and calves.  You can catch satellite bulls 2-3 yrs old hanging out on the fringe of the herds. 

The advise about hunting the boarders of a gmu is a good plan.  A lot of hunters don't know the specific boarders and tend to shy away from them. 

[Bigshooter]

Bigshooter are you a bowhunter?

I have rifled hunted for most of my hunting life.  This will be my third year bow hunting and my second year in a row hunting with a bow.  I have also muzzleloader hunted a few times.

Why do you ask?

[bowhunterty]

Just wondering if i may have ran into you down that way. Hunt the RAndle, Packwood, Lewis River units for the last 10 years down there. All i do is bowhunt. You shot an incredible bull.  I missed a 320 bull a couple years ago.  I've killed a 4x5 in 2004.  Had my far chances. In more bulls of that caliber still around.  Most of  my hunting is away from the road about three miles in. When I'm spent i hunt the 99road, that and everybody is usually gone. Plus its open for cows. I prefer the Packwood unit because its three pt. or better.

[Little Fish]

clhutner,
I don't know the Winston unit that well, but its my impression that there are only a few major access points so people have to enter at the same point and spread out after hiking in. This seems to be the norm with most west side hunts.

With respect to scouting (and this is specific to timber company land) the elk can be anywhere. The areas I know best are the ones I've hunted for a number of years. I mentally or with a map keep track of where I've seen elk over the years and although they may not be in the exact same location from year to year I've found they tend to stick around the same general area. Because the elk can be anywhere I usually just try to find areas that look like they should hold elk....for example small clearcuts that are surrounded by timber and are out of the way (at the end of a dead end for example). One thing that I've found helpful is to scout when the gates are open and you can drive in. It's way easier to check out 10 potential spots in your truck during the off season than to hike in 5+ miles without really know what the terrain looks like. Usually when I find what looks to be a good area I jump out of the truck and do some hiking to see if elk are using the area. Come elk season the areas I've already checked out are targets for the season.

Now a couple caveats to the above....I've only been chasing elk a few years and have yet to be successful so clearly I'm still learning myself. I've seen a lots of elk though and have had a few close encounters so hopefully I will connect sometime in the next season or two.

[clhutner]

Thanks very much for the info.  That is defintely an idea of what I was looking for, thanks very much for your time.  Hopefully I can put it to good use.

[Broken Arrow]

just my 2 cents.....

but when your scouting, don't look for elk...they will not be in the same place as they are then....look for areas where you can see rut activity...old tree rubs, water, etc. we like to scout in the 4000' areas....long benches....as like many have said before elk are all over the place.....you get in 4 to 5 miles away from everyone else in hell holes that others would never dare to go...you will find bulls. Some say if the numbers don't show (harvest statistics) not to go to those areas....all i can say...is I applaud this thinking.....no elk to be seen in those 7% success rate areas....go see for your self.

[clhutner]

Since rubs were brought up--how much do you hunt around areas that rubs are found?  Do elk frequent those areas similar to whitetails or do they just make them passing through areas?  I saw some rubs last year and was not quite sure what to do in those areas. I was not sure if they mean that a bull hangs aroud that area or if they just passed through the area?...

[edmondshunter]

Elk tend to roam a larger area then deer. 5-7 mile area for elk vs. 1-2 mile for deer. Having said that, elk and deer both tend to travel the same routes year to year.  Rubs are made for a multitude of reason, removing velvet and or antlers, a show of presence, marking territory, etc. Depending on the time of year and if the rut is on, I wouldn't hesitate to check the area rubs were found in. 
 

[Hornseeker]

Dang Polar... I dont remember hearing about your 350 bull...that is awesome! Congrats on a top end Washington bull...

CL...you have got lots of good advice...

[clhutner]

Yes it is GREAT advice.  I also just learned that I should be able to be hunting with my brother in law next season.  I wasnt sure if I was going to get a chance to go with him, but this weekend we were talking and it sounds like it is going to work out.  I am pretty excited about that ; he is pretty a pretty smart hunter and a great kid. I hope I can learn from him as well as from this advice on here. Thanks all and if there is any more keep it coming this is great stuff.