RMEF retracts support of H.R. 1581

[Elkaholic daWg]

  Sure is good to see that 69.4% of those who responded  to that poll disagreed with you on the "horrible" legislation, especially when outfits like the wilderness society send out alerts to their minions on polls of such issues!

[DBHAWTHORNE]

I certainly don't agree in going through and creating a bunch of new roads strictly for commercial interest. But I do believe we should open many of the roads we have closed over the years.

I think theres some middle ground that would include some reopened roads and some that remain closed.  But I'm glad the wolf in sheeps clothing is being revealed with this horrible legislation.  It's not going to help hunters.  We need another avenue to move towards some compromise with road use.

When it comes to giving up our liberties there can be no Bipartisan or middle ground. If those for liberty took the middle ground on every issue there wouldn't be any liberty left. Here is a synopsis of the bill:

"To release wilderness study areas administered by the Bureau of Land Management that are not suitable for wilderness designation from continued management as defacto wilderness areas and to release inventoried roadless areas within the National Forest System that are not recommended for wilderness designation from the land use restrictions of the 2001 Roadless Area Conservation Final Rule and the 2005 State Petitions for Inventoried Roadless Area Management Final Rule, and for other purposes."

It is a fact that lands are being managed as wilderness that shouldn't be. When this happens we lose liberties such as the ones we are having in our other discussion. I have to support this bill because it is in support of repealing practices and old legislation that took away freedoms from the people (commercial or otherwise).

[WAcoyotehunter]

It's not a fact that the lands are being managed as a wilderness!  They're being actively managed now and can be logged or used as they are.  They're under the same protection as wilderness.

If you want to go hunt at a mine or oil well go to Pinedale WY...take a look around and see how fantastic that is.  Why the hell would you guys want to see these lands opened to that kind of development???  It's not liberties we're at risk of losing, it's hunting opportunites on currently open land.  Liberty doesn't have anything to do with it.  I'm not intrested in see OUR public land destroyed so a giant corperation can make a bunch of money and leave a mess! 

[Elkaholic daWg]

It's not a fact that the lands are being managed as a wilderness!  They're being actively managed now and can be logged or used as they are.  They're under the same protection as wilderness.

If you want to go hunt at a mine or oil well go to Pinedale WY...take a look around and see how fantastic that is.  Why the hell would you guys want to see these lands opened to that kind of development???  It's not liberties we're at risk of losing, it's hunting opportunites on currently open land.  Liberty doesn't have anything to do with it.  I'm not intrested in see OUR public land destroyed so a giant corperation can make a bunch of money and leave a mess!

 I call TOTAL BS on that first paragraph! Do you know what the LEGAL definition of wilderness is? If they are under the same protection as wilderness then NO machine can be used there. NONE! Are they going to log with axes?

Sounds like greenie double talk to me.

[WAcoyotehunter]

Oops... typo there.  IRA's are NOT under the same protection as wilderness. IRA's are not wilderness.  They are not protected under the wilderness act and they do not have protection from logging... with axes, chainsaws, hot saws...whatever. They're less stringent than wilderness,  but have attractrive wild qualities that we should protect by not allowing development.  Let them log, let us hunt and recreate, but don't let our government give our land to a damn oil developer.  They don't need any more subsidies.

[Elkaholic daWg]

 Then OPEN the damn roads!!!!!!!  .

[DBHAWTHORNE]

It's not a fact that the lands are being managed as a wilderness!  They're being actively managed now and can be logged or used as they are.  They're under the same protection as wilderness.

If you want to go hunt at a mine or oil well go to Pinedale WY...take a look around and see how fantastic that is.  Why the hell would you guys want to see these lands opened to that kind of development???  It's not liberties we're at risk of losing, it's hunting opportunites on currently open land.  Liberty doesn't have anything to do with it.  I'm not intrested in see OUR public land destroyed so a giant corperation can make a bunch of money and leave a mess!

You are correct the IRA's aren't being managed as wilderness but the WSA are. However, that is even more of a reason that these roads should be open. They should be multi-use and available for all user groups. I can guarantee that RMEF won't be getting a dime from me in the future since I now know they do not support liberty.

The liberal agenda pushed by the Clinton administration has put millions of acres of our forest behind lock and key for no good reason. These lands are for all peoples use and enjoyment and opening them up will increase the diversity of recreational opportunities.

As far as environment and habitat. When they allow these areas to languish behind lock and key and do not maintain those roads it also restricts access to firefighting equipment due to the roads not being maintained like they should. There are certainly benefits to fire in the habitat but I can tell you I don't normally prefer to hunt in areas that were recently destroyed from wildfires.

I do appreciate you bringing RMEF's support of the liberal agenda to my attention so I can give money to organizations that want to fight for our liberties.

[turbo]

Yep, the RMEF is now the enemy as they are in bed with the enemy. Do not give them any money and cancel your memberships!!! They don't even have the guts to reply to simple questions regarding their support with extremist left wing groups.

Wilderness is the gateway drug for liberal idiots to restrict your rights as their agenda continues down the tracks. Just take a look at the North Cascades proposal. This is the direction of their agenda. Wake up Wacoyotehunter, you'be been duped.

[Elkaholic daWg]

  Which I Did. thanks to a fellow :tup:member over at BCR/ SW who enlightened me.
 They used to be in my Sig.

[turbo]

Which I Did. thanks to a fellow :tup:member over at BCR/ SW who enlightened me.
 They used to be in my Sig.

LOL!

[WAcoyotehunter]

Yep, the RMEF is now the enemy as they are in bed with the enemy. Do not give them any money and cancel your memberships!!! They don't even have the guts to reply to simple questions regarding their support with extremist left wing groups.

Wilderness is the gateway drug for liberal idiots to restrict your rights as their agenda continues down the tracks. Just take a look at the North Cascades proposal. This is the direction of their agenda. Wake up Wacoyotehunter, you'be been duped.

I don't think I'll be dropping my RMEF membership any time soon.  I also think you're way off base to say they're "in bed with the enemy".  They're actually INTERESTED in protecting elk habitat so in 50 years there will be some wild places left for people to enjoy.  If you want to hunt in a mine, or oil field be my guest.  I prefer to enjoy nature in a natural setting.  RMEF is on the right track, and in this case the NRA is bowing to a real enemy- big business.

[DBHAWTHORNE]

Yep, the RMEF is now the enemy as they are in bed with the enemy. Do not give them any money and cancel your memberships!!! They don't even have the guts to reply to simple questions regarding their support with extremist left wing groups.

Wilderness is the gateway drug for liberal idiots to restrict your rights as their agenda continues down the tracks. Just take a look at the North Cascades proposal. This is the direction of their agenda. Wake up Wacoyotehunter, you'be been duped.

I don't think I'll be dropping my RMEF membership any time soon.  I also think you're way off base to say they're "in bed with the enemy".  They're actually INTERESTED in protecting elk habitat so in 50 years there will be some wild places left for people to enjoy.  If you want to hunt in a mine, or oil field be my guest.  I prefer to enjoy nature in a natural setting.  RMEF is on the right track, and in this case the NRA is bowing to a real enemy- big business.

Yeah... I guess since we don't live in those rural towns we shouldn't concern ourselves with the impact wilderness designations have on them... they might starve from job loss but at least we have more wilderness to hunt. Shame on the NRA for supporting big business that brings jobs/money into these rural economies.

[WAcoyotehunter]

I live in one of those communities that will benefit from wilderness rather than extra mining.  As a matter of fact- i live in a county that has water restrictions and fish advisories for heavy metals and pollution from these terrific businesses.  Don't preach to me about how wonderful all this development is- the damage that is caused by this stuff is often irreversible and can literally kill a stream or watershed.  I'm unwilling to sacrifice the quality of my drinking water, my hunting areas, or the landscape so some company ("Teck" come to mind???) can make a bunch of money and leave a mess.

[DBHAWTHORNE]

I won't deny we have to be good stewards of the land...(not a big fan of mines myself and I have seen the damage they can do) but wilderness designations (which place many more restrictions...like the road closures we have discussed) is not what we should constantly seek. Their goal is to turn many of these places into designated wilderness. I have heard it straight from the forest service. They are already trying to manage many of our public lands in the nation as if they are wilderness without an actual wilderness designation from congress (which is requried). When they do this it wrongly restricts responsible motorized access to many areas. I fully support the wilderness designation set by congress back in 1964 but I do not support abusing this legislation which is exactly what has happened by anti-access groups which RMEF apparently supports.

[turbo]

Yep, the RMEF is now the enemy as they are in bed with the enemy. Do not give them any money and cancel your memberships!!! They don't even have the guts to reply to simple questions regarding their support with extremist left wing groups.

Wilderness is the gateway drug for liberal idiots to restrict your rights as their agenda continues down the tracks. Just take a look at the North Cascades proposal. This is the direction of their agenda. Wake up Wacoyotehunter, you'be been duped.

I don't think I'll be dropping my RMEF membership any time soon.  I also think you're way off base to say they're "in bed with the enemy".  They're actually INTERESTED in protecting elk habitat so in 50 years there will be some wild places left for people to enjoy.  If you want to hunt in a mine, or oil field be my guest.  I prefer to enjoy nature in a natural setting.  RMEF is on the right track, and in this case the NRA is bowing to a real enemy- big business.

Thank you!!! Your endorsement of the RMEF is all some people on here need to see to start doing their homework. When they do, MOST will be very disappointed with their alignments with extremist groups like the Sierra club and The Wilderness Society who's whole mission is to end hunting, restrict our rights on our land and end our gun rights. It's true, they want more restricted land with more elk on it, they just don't want you hunting them or using the land in any way. RMEF is in bed with groups that actually hate you as a hunter but are willing to use you like a pawn to further their agendas. All I ask is for people to get educated about how they are spending their money and who's agenda they are supporting. Hunters are currently loosing the battle right now but there will be a tipping point as we play catch up to the left wing extremists groups. The lefties are WAY ahead of the game. Even able to convince hunting groups like suckers to join them....

I also love how you say we will be hunting in oil fields.. lol.. DRILL BABY DRILL!!!!

As far as mining and the NRA go we might find some common ground. I am not a member of the NRA but could be swayed the way things are going right now in our country and the UN. We have to have mines but not at the expense of our water supplies and environment.  Besides, with out heavy metals how would power and you drive your Prius?