Musket Caps v. #11's

[Ridgerunner]

Can someone explain to me(a non-muzzleloader) what the difference is in these caps and if there is an advantage to one or the other in this state?  Thanks!

[CP]

MC – is bigger than a #11 PC and therefore easier put on and takeoff, big advantage when your fingers are cold and dexterity limited, they are also easier to see, if your eyes are over 50 you’ll appreciate that.

Oh yea, they burn hotter too.

[whacker1]

most people use them, because they are believed to be hotter.  I have never tested them myself, so I just go off the rhetoric.  I personally found the caps that fit my nipple the best and they happen to be the remnington #11.  The remington nipples are different.

[carpsniperg2]

I will only shoot musket caps. They are bigger, easy to handle and they aslo have a bigger nipple whole to get the fire into the powder. They say the 11 mag "which if you want to use 11's is the way to go" is as hot ask a musket cap. I still Don't know if I agree, but I have no way of testing it

[JColony]

I will only shoot musket caps. They are bigger, easy to handle and they aslo have a bigger nipple whole to get the fire into the powder.

Agreed.

[jrebel]

 

German musket caps are the only way to go.....

[Machias]

The musket cap nipple has a WAY bigger hole and allows a heck of alot more flame into the powder.  I've never had a misfire with a musket cap.  Used to have quite a few with #11s.  I would never go back.  I only use the German musket caps.

[Machias]

This was posted before:

In page 83 of Dave Ehrig's book "Muzzleloading for Deer & Turkey", he lists some information on percussion caps and primers.

#11 standard cap - 6.53 cc of gas at 3,024 degrees F when fired.
#11 magnum cap - 7.59 cc of gas at 3,717 degrees F when fired.
U.S. #2 musket cap - 14.36 cc of gas at 3,717 degrees F when fired.
#209 shotgun primer - 21.98 cc of gas at 3,024 degrees F when fired.
#200 rifle primer - 11.68 cc of gas at 3,024 degrees F when fired.

[Sabotloader]

The musket cap nipple has a WAY bigger hole and allows a heck of alot more flame into the powder.  I've never had a misfire with a musket cap.  Used to have quite a few with #11s.  I would never go back.  I only use the German musket caps.

You are correct the stack on a Musket Cap nipple is greater in diameter than is a #11 Nipple - but if you look at the other end, the flash hole, you will note they are the same size in the two nipples.  And in that case they both apply the same amount of gas to the powder.  You can only get so much volume through a given orfice.  Although... if the first gases to reach the powder do not ignite it  - the musket cap will have more additional to possible keep heating the powder - but even in that case the result will be a hang-fire.

In both cases a portion of the gas they can produce is lost in pushing the plunger back and in combination with blow back pressure created by ignition a portion of the gas supplied by the cap is allowed gas to vent off excess gas off.  In the case of the Musket more gas is lost to the breech area than is lost from the #11.

[Machias]

I must be looking at a regular nipple then, because the opening is much larger on the musket nipple on mine.  I'll have to double check that tonight.  Thanks for the information!!

[Sabotloader]

I must be looking at a regular nipple then, because the opening is much larger on the musket nipple on mine.  I'll have to double check that tonight.  Thanks for the information!!

The flash hole should be about .030-.032 in diameter, if you get much larger than that the blow back from the ignition of the load would push the plunger or the hammer all the way back in to the re-kocked position.

You can see in these pictures what I am trying to refer to...

[Machias]

 

[MtnMuley]

Always enjoy your posts, sabotloader.

[Kowsrule30]

I always shoot German Musket Caps.... Had a few other brands not want to stay on to well and when I would bend them a *censored* hair they were so hard to get off.... That was with #11 and other musket caps.... These German ones are made sweet with great regularity.... And easy to remove and install.... I have big fingers.... It makes it so much easier.... You could get a good capper and not have to worry..... But I always loose mine.... Every time.... Some caps you can't use in a capper..... Like these German ones....

[grundy53]

I always shoot German Musket Caps.... Had a few other brands not want to stay on to well and when I would bend them a *censored* hair they were so hard to get off.... That was with #11 and other musket caps.... These German ones are made sweet with great regularity.... And easy to remove and install.... I have big fingers.... It makes it so much easier.... You could get a good capper and not have to worry..... But I always loose mine.... Every time.... Some caps you can't use in a capper..... Like these German ones....

I use German ones in my capper....

[Sabotloader]

I always shoot German Musket Caps.... Had a few other brands not want to stay on to well and when I would bend them a *censored* hair they were so hard to get off.... That was with #11 and other musket caps.... These German ones are made sweet with great regularity.... And easy to remove and install.... I have big fingers.... It makes it so much easier.... You could get a good capper and not have to worry..... But I always loose mine.... Every time.... Some caps you can't use in a capper..... Like these German ones....

Speaking of the #11 caps - i really want them difficult to get off for two reasons... 1.  I do not have to worry about them falling off which they do on occasion and 2. More importantly with the tight fit... let it rain they are very close to water and moisture proof.  one less worry. (Which by the way, IMO is very difficult to do with a Musket Cap - since they are slit all the way to the percussion material)

But you are right they are a bear to get off if you do not shoot them off.  I have to use the edge of a knife to pull them off.  Then that cap will not be used for hunting again as it has been stretched - but it will be good one to shoot paper with.

[muzbuster]

MC – is bigger than a #11 PC and therefore easier put on and takeoff, big advantage when your fingers are cold and dexterity limited, they are also easier to see, if your eyes are over 50 you’ll appreciate that.

Oh yea, they burn hotter too.

Exactly the reasons I use musket caps. 

[Sabotloader]

MC – is bigger than a #11 PC and therefore easier put on and takeoff, big advantage when your fingers are cold and dexterity limited, they are also easier to see, if your eyes are over 50 you’ll appreciate that.

Oh yea, they burn hotter too.

I hope you saw the temp burn chart in this thread... It is often believed that the Musket cap is hotter than a #11, well that is the truth for a regular #11 but a #11 mag cap is just as hot as a Musket Cap...

I do not handle a cap at all (well other than to load a capper) whether it be a Musket or #11 - I use a capper much more reliable in the field to get the caps on the post tight and snug against the cap rim...

[Kowsrule30]

I always shoot German Musket Caps.... Had a few other brands not want to stay on to well and when I would bend them a *censored* hair they were so hard to get off.... That was with #11 and other musket caps.... These German ones are made sweet with great regularity.... And easy to remove and install.... I have big fingers.... It makes it so much easier.... You could get a good capper and not have to worry..... But I always loose mine.... Every time.... Some caps you can't use in a capper..... Like these German ones....

I use German ones in my capper....

The caps I always get have flares on them and tend to jam up in my cappers..... Do you have this problem??

[grundy53]

Nope. They feed fine. I was leary of the flanges at first but haven't had any problems.

[Kowsrule30]

Do you know the brand of your capper?  Maybe I was just getting some cheap crap!!!!   

[Machias]

What I found with mine was if I tried to load caps that I'd had loaded before, then I started getting them to jam in the capper.  If I load my german musket caps in the capper once, I never have an issue.

[grundy53]

Do you know the brand of your capper?  Maybe I was just getting some cheap crap!!!!   

I can't remember. I will check when I get home.

[muzbuster]

Nope. They feed fine. I was leary of the flanges at first but haven't had any problems.

No problems here.

[grundy53]

Do you know the brand of your capper?  Maybe I was just getting some cheap crap!!!!   

Thompson center musket capper

[Kowsrule30]

Do you know the brand of your capper?  Maybe I was just getting some cheap crap!!!!   

Thompson center musket capper

Yep.... Mine says something I can't even read..... Thanks....

[huntnnw]

The musket cap nipple has a WAY bigger hole and allows a heck of alot more flame into the powder.  I've never had a misfire with a musket cap.  Used to have quite a few with #11s.  I would never go back.  I only use the German musket caps.