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Author Topic: New Lehigh Bullet(s) Choice  (Read 586 times)

Offline Sabotloader

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New Lehigh Bullet(s) Choice
« on: April 19, 2021, 06:45:15 PM »
A lot of you already know that I am really fond of the Lehigh CF bullets. So to add to that I offer this information.

Last week I was doing some muzzle loading bullet investigation, looking at what might be available. I have always been fond of the Lehigh .458x300 gr. Lehigh then Lehigh/Bloodline seen below.



This bullet has long been a favorite of mine for elk hunting. Several people have told me that I really do not need that heavy of a bullet to harvest elk. Which totally may be true, but in my mind I am far more interested in the energy that a bullet might carry to the target within my 200 yard range limitation. The Lehigh 300 with the achieved velocity, energy, - combined with the CF function (Controlled Fracturing). These factors all create outstanding Terminal Ballistics.

After viewing and searching the Lehigh site I found what I thought could be a really interesting bullet. Lehigh lists it as a bullet for a 450 SOCOM. It is a .458x300 CF. This bullet appears to have a more aerodynamic design and might have a greater BC than the computed BC. It is designed to work down to 1200 fps. I believe this bullet might even perform better the Lehigh/Bloodline. The down side is the bullet is designed for a 1-20 bore twist. I do believe it will shoot well from my 1-28 bores. I have shot other longer bullets from my 1-28 with great success using the upper limits of powder loads (110 to 120 gr. Vol of T7 and BH.



When discussing this bullet with personnel at Lehigh they suggested another bullet that I might look at. A bullet designed for the 45-70 Government - .458x300 CF with cut petals. The nose on this CF bullet will function at sub-sonic velocity down to 750 fps. Again the bullet is suggested for a 1-20 twist because of the length of the bullet.



I will include two calculated ballistic sheets computed from the velocities I achieved with T7 and BH powder loads. Again I should mention that I am not shooting a 1-20 twist rifle, just a standard Knight muzzleloader with a 1-28 twist.






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Offline Lead ball 54

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Re: New Lehigh Bullet(s) Choice
« Reply #1 on: April 19, 2021, 07:18:44 PM »
so let's say I have a MK-85 50cal would this style of bullet work at the velocities I would achieve from the 24" barrel or should I stick to shorter bullets

Offline Sabotloader

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Re: New Lehigh Bullet(s) Choice
« Reply #2 on: April 19, 2021, 07:35:15 PM »
so let's say I have a MK-85 50cal would this style of bullet work at the velocities I would achieve from the 24" barrel or should I stick to shorter bullets

Actually I have shot the longer Lehigh .458x305CF from my MK - it shot fine at 100 yards and I felt comfortable shooting to 150 yards with that bullet. But... I was shooting them in a MMP HPH-24 sabot instead of a .457/.458x50 sabot.  They loaded to easy down the bore with the .458 sabot.

I have not shot these new bullet at this point I am just starting my exploration.
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Offline Sneaky

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Re: New Lehigh Bullet(s) Choice
« Reply #3 on: April 19, 2021, 08:10:50 PM »
I bought 100 of the 265gr .452 CF bullets but looked at these when the muzzleloader specific bullets were out of stock....

There is a great video on youtube of an extreme long distance deer being taken with the .458 socom bullet...both shoulders absolutely destroyed.

Offline Sabotloader

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Re: New Lehigh Bullet(s) Choice
« Reply #4 on: April 19, 2021, 08:16:57 PM »
I bought 100 of the 265gr .452 CF bullets but looked at these when the muzzleloader specific bullets were out of stock....

There is a great video on youtube of an extreme long distance deer being taken with the .458 socom bullet...both shoulders absolutely destroyed.

You didn't go wrong with the 265's they are an amazing bullets. I just like that little bit of added weight when it comes to elk, especially with an angry one!
Keep shooting muzzleloaders - They are a blast!!

Offline Sabotloader

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Re: New Lehigh Bullet(s) Choice
« Reply #5 on: April 20, 2021, 10:07:26 AM »
Sharing a couple other thoughts discussed with Lehigh. One of my main concerns with the SP bullet is - at what velocity will the bullet CF function stop functioning. According to the Lehigh specs the SP bullet operates from 3200 fps to 1200 fps which at extend ranges could be a problem. My calculated ballistic sheets show that I really should be alright to 200 yards.

Addressing that problem in our discussion is when he brought up the Subsonic LP version of the bullet. This bullet operates from 2500 fps to 750 fps - so it would certainly would operate out the the 200 yard mark.

Another topic brought up in our conversation was bullet slippage in a sabot. Since the Lehigh brass bullet is so hard and smooth the possibility of it slipping certainly exists. Which brings up another couple of points... This bullet is designed as a centerfire bullet and is manufactured to much tighter dimension specifications. Especially the diameter specs. Because of this I have found that shooting a comparable Lehigh .458x305CF in a normal MMP HPH .457/.458x50 sabot it really seems to go down the bore very smoothly but in my mind somewhat loose which might allow the bullet slippage in the sabot. Because of this concern I started using the MMP Black .452x50 sabot - which did increase the amount of pressure needed to load the bullet, and I feel reduce the fear of bullet slippage.

This picture tends to show what I am indicating



Look closely at the bottom of the bullet in each sabot. The far left is a Lehigh .458 muzzle loading bullet installed in the Orange sabot. Notice the bullet is not completely seated in the bottom of the sabot. In the middle picture the SP bullet drops very right into the sabot and seats all the way down. Almost loose in the sabot. It is just a more skinny load. The left had pic is the SP installed in the Black HPH-24 sabot and as with the ML bullet it is not seated in/on the bottom of the sabot. The bullet will completely seat when pushed through the crown and down the bore.

With this tighter fit the chances of the bullet slipping in the sabot is reduced.
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Offline jrebel

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Re: New Lehigh Bullet(s) Choice
« Reply #6 on: April 20, 2021, 10:43:43 AM »
Tagging along.  I purchased 2-3 different Lehigh bullets to play with in my muzzleloaders.  I have not yet gotten to the range so every bit of information I can glean is helpful.  Thanks for doing these posts....lots of great information. 

Offline Lead ball 54

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Re: New Lehigh Bullet(s) Choice
« Reply #7 on: April 21, 2021, 09:10:33 AM »
Sabotloader I really like that 300grainer for the 45-70 who makes a Sabot for a 54 to .458  thanks

Offline Sabotloader

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Re: New Lehigh Bullet(s) Choice
« Reply #8 on: April 21, 2021, 10:24:38 AM »
Sabotloader I really like that 300grainer for the 45-70 who makes a Sabot for a 54 to .458  thanks

I am not going to be much help on that one - I really do not know of anyone making a .458x54 sabot. But MMP does make a .451/.452x54 sabot.  And if you are using a true .458 rifle bullet this might be the perfect sabot for you.

https://mmpsabots.com/store/red-sabot50-pcs/

As I suggested above I use a .451/.452x50 sabot in my Knights.

« Last Edit: April 21, 2021, 10:48:01 AM by Sabotloader »
Keep shooting muzzleloaders - They are a blast!!

Offline Sabotloader

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Re: New Lehigh Bullet(s) Choice
« Reply #9 on: April 28, 2021, 12:19:44 PM »
Well I failed. These bullets were both listed with a 1-14 twist rate. I was hopping that if I shot them with 120 gr. vol of T7 or BH I might get them to stabilize from a 1-28 Knight. Didn't really happen. So for shooting form a ML - I have to take them off my list.

This first target shows the wobble of the bullets at 25 yards shot with 50gr. vol T7 - which I really expected.



The second target - shot with 120 gr. vol still shows a slight wobble.



Darn!
Keep shooting muzzleloaders - They are a blast!!

 


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