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Author Topic: Reintroduce Jaguars to the United States  (Read 3139 times)

Offline Dan-o

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Re: Reintroduce Jaguars to the United States
« Reply #30 on: June 16, 2021, 12:35:06 PM »
Lots of strong opinions against reintroductions here... I didn't hear you guys bitching when the Colville's reintroduced Antelope, I don't hear anyone screaming about them reintroducing Lynx...

I bet you you all were fired up when turkeys and elk were added to NE Washington in the 1990's.   :chuckle:

Quit painting with a broad brush.  Most of you all support reintroductions of most sorts.  Its the idea of jaguars that gets your hackles up.  If they were augmenting desert bighorns you would all be on board.

Who did the antelope reintroductions put out of business?

I was personally disgusted by the wolf intro virtue signalling crowd.
They were perfectly willing to let others pay the price.   
Pretty much my definition of dirtbags.
« Last Edit: June 16, 2021, 12:53:59 PM by Dan-o »
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Offline LDennis24

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Re: Reintroduce Jaguars to the United States
« Reply #31 on: June 16, 2021, 01:16:04 PM »
I don't see jaguars putting anyone out of business either. I also see Dales point of view but then that's purely based on people being partial to what animal they are passionate about hunting. Bird hunters don't wanna see more bobcats, ungulate hunters don't wanna see more wolves and bears etc. I don't enjoy cleaning ducks and eating duck meat but every once in a while. I still believe in the conservation of ducks and protecting critical habitat for them. Why wouldn't I? Or even for mountain goats, I don't hunt them or put in for them. So who cares if they all died off right? They don't belong here right? Not in my neighborhood...

Offline andrew_in_idaho

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Re: Reintroduce Jaguars to the United States
« Reply #32 on: June 16, 2021, 01:25:26 PM »
I seem to recall an episode of MeatEater pod sometime last fall or winter with a big cat bio from Texas who said that while Jaguars might occasionally wander into the states in the SW desert that is probably historically the very northern fringe of their range. It was an interesting listen


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Offline bearpaw

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Re: Reintroduce Jaguars to the United States
« Reply #33 on: June 16, 2021, 01:52:57 PM »
I seem to recall an episode of MeatEater pod sometime last fall or winter with a big cat bio from Texas who said that while Jaguars might occasionally wander into the states in the SW desert that is probably historically the very northern fringe of their range. It was an interesting listen


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I've watched some stuff about them also, you are correct, the southern edge of the US is the northern edge of their range.
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Offline bearpaw

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Re: Reintroduce Jaguars to the United States
« Reply #34 on: June 16, 2021, 02:00:57 PM »
Just to be clear, I'm not opposed to jaguars, or any other naturally occurring critter, I wished we had enough jaguars, antelope, and desert bighorns to open hunting season and hunt a few of them, what I'm opposed to is the bureaucracy and inevitable "conditions" that come with reintroductions, especially big carnivore reintroductions! Consider what has happened with WOLVES OR GRIZZLIES and how they have been handled it pretty well sums it up!
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Offline WAcoyotehunter

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Re: Reintroduce Jaguars to the United States
« Reply #35 on: June 16, 2021, 02:14:49 PM »
WAcoyote, I think a big difference is whether it's big predators or non-predators, and what the impacts will be. I haven't seen any large land grabs for turkeys, antelope, or sheep, perhaps if the wolves, grizzlies, and jaguar introductions were handled differently you wouldn't see the opposition! Just sayin! Give that a little thought?
Yep- that's fair.  Big carnivores get people pretty excited and stir emotions.  I just thought it was funny that a bunch of folks get on here and say they're against species reintroductions... but what they really mean is that they are against carnivore reintroductions. 

I agree that the ESA has been misused by agency folks as well as animal rights groups.  I just hate to see actual conservation lose support from hunters because they're jaded

Offline bearpaw

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Re: Reintroduce Jaguars to the United States
« Reply #36 on: June 16, 2021, 02:47:52 PM »
WAcoyote, I think a big difference is whether it's big predators or non-predators, and what the impacts will be. I haven't seen any large land grabs for turkeys, antelope, or sheep, perhaps if the wolves, grizzlies, and jaguar introductions were handled differently you wouldn't see the opposition! Just sayin! Give that a little thought?
Yep- that's fair.  Big carnivores get people pretty excited and stir emotions.  I just thought it was funny that a bunch of folks get on here and say they're against species reintroductions... but what they really mean is that they are against carnivore reintroductions. 

I agree that the ESA has been misused by agency folks as well as animal rights groups.  I just hate to see actual conservation lose support from hunters because they're jaded

 :yeah: I don't really have a problem with having a few wolves around as long as they are managed in a manner to fit in with our modern ecosystems. Idaho needs to reduce the population more in certain areas but they will probably eventually get there, Washington I'm pretty sure is a lost cause, the moose and caribou have already suffered the consequences of favoring one specie over another! It's unfortunate!
Americans are systematically advocating, legislating, and voting away each others rights. Support all user groups & quit losing opportunity!

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Offline grundy53

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Re: Reintroduce Jaguars to the United States
« Reply #37 on: June 16, 2021, 05:36:06 PM »
WAcoyote, I think a big difference is whether it's big predators or non-predators, and what the impacts will be. I haven't seen any large land grabs for turkeys, antelope, or sheep, perhaps if the wolves, grizzlies, and jaguar introductions were handled differently you wouldn't see the opposition! Just sayin! Give that a little thought?
Well said!

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Offline grundy53

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Re: Reintroduce Jaguars to the United States
« Reply #38 on: June 16, 2021, 05:37:22 PM »


Just to be clear, I'm not opposed to jaguars, or any other naturally occurring critter, I wished we had enough jaguars, antelope, and desert bighorns to open hunting season and hunt a few of them, what I'm opposed to is the bureaucracy and inevitable "conditions" that come with reintroductions, especially big carnivore reintroductions! Consider what has happened with WOLVES OR GRIZZLIES and how they have been handled it pretty well sums it up!

Exactly! Plus the litigation... no thanks!

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Offline nwwanderer

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Re: Reintroduce Jaguars to the United States
« Reply #39 on: June 16, 2021, 08:23:25 PM »
Litigation concerning the jaguar is currently happening in Arizona, been going for 5 years I think.  Our 'friends' at the center for biological diversity are involved. 

Offline KFhunter

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Re: Reintroduce Jaguars to the United States
« Reply #40 on: June 16, 2021, 09:43:40 PM »
I would support transplanting endangered ungulates to the NE corner of Washington.


Offline Bill W

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Re: Reintroduce Jaguars to the United States
« Reply #41 on: June 17, 2021, 07:10:40 AM »
I think we should re-introduce cave bears and sabertooth tigers.   I think a past stronghold for the sabertooth tigers was Queen Anne Hill.  Good spot to start re-introducing them.

Offline lokidog

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Re: Reintroduce Jaguars to the United States
« Reply #42 on: June 17, 2021, 07:23:00 AM »
I think your correct Hoffa, they would most likely continue moving East from these areas but there is nothing to show that they would populate very easily. But historically they have been found clear to the Atlantic in the U.S.

If conditions were good for them, they would repopulate on their own. If they do, fine, otherwise quit wasting sportsman's dollars on this stuff!

Offline LDennis24

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Re: Reintroduce Jaguars to the United States
« Reply #43 on: June 17, 2021, 07:45:39 AM »

Literally just posted yesterday, so weird.

Offline LDennis24

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Re: Reintroduce Jaguars to the United States
« Reply #44 on: June 17, 2021, 07:53:51 AM »
I think your correct Hoffa, they would most likely continue moving East from these areas but there is nothing to show that they would populate very easily. But historically they have been found clear to the Atlantic in the U.S.

If conditions were good for them, they would repopulate on their own. If they do, fine, otherwise quit wasting sportsman's dollars on this stuff!

C'mon man, you can't say that. That blanket statement would have to also encompass deer and elk habitat right? If that was always the koto then there wouldn't be alot of elk in Eastern Washington. There wouldn't be alot of mile deer in some areas where they need critical wintering habitat etc. People just don't like the idea that it's a very large predator and that it could turn into a bias propaganda puppet. It may not even happen. I just wondered if people would enjoy seeing them in the wild and maybe one day even be able to hunt them! They could even find donors to fund the majority of it I'm sure. 

 


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