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Author Topic: Breeds for upland  (Read 4997 times)

Offline J-Bone

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Re: Breeds for upland
« Reply #45 on: January 28, 2022, 11:18:24 PM »
Buy Craig koshyk's pointing dog book called "the continentals" will everything you want to know.

No matter what people say, IMO no dog is truly 50/50 waterfowl or upland. And if they are, you hit the lotto. A couple of things you should figure out

1 - is your priority waterfowl or upland?
2 - what size?
3 - what type of coat?
4 - do you want a dog to point instinctually.
5 - what range do you want to hunt at?
6 - what weather will you hunt at?

Also, narrow breeds down based upon breeders close to you. All breeds have variance among them, best thing you can do to zero in on the personality and skills of your dog is hang out with the breeders dogs as much as possible. if they don't allow it, that's a red flag and move on. Another thing I would look for is a personable breeder that will answer all your questions before and after you bring the pup home. some breeders/trainers are really bizarre.


I have a griff. He has an off switch, until new people come over to the house. then he gets a bit jumpy and annoying. Nothing horrible. if the new people aren't dog people, I just crate him. otherwise he sleeps and lounges all the time, has great recall, and an instinctual hunter. He won't stay super still in a duck blind, but he'll retrieve anything, wherever. Nothing against Griffs, but I reckon when it is time to get another one I'll go Small Munsterlander or a Drentsche Patrijshond just bc I want to try something new.

Agree to disagree but the GSP can and DOES excel at both Waterfowl and Upland hunting. Versatility being the exact objective they were bred for. 

https://projectupland.com/hunting-dogs/german-shorthaired-pointers-for-waterfowl-hunting/#:~:text=The%20GSPs%20were%20bred%20to,when%20they%20have%20a%20job.

Any dog from this https://www.navhda.org/recognized-breeds/ list would perform ideally at both tasks. And if trained to NAVDHA standards would go even further.

The sire of my pup retrieves limits of green heads every year in N Idaho.



I think there is a difference to being a versatile dog and excelling equally at upland and water which is the point i'm making. I agree GSPs are a versatile dog, but I don't think they are equally skilled at both water and upland. Example, GSPs dominate upland field trials, that is absolutely not the case for water. Their chest shape  + long legs also impacts their ability to swim. Of course there are exceptions to this rule, but how do you know if you are buying an exception.

So if you favor upland and want a dog you can take water duck hunting every now and then (aka versatile dog) buy a pointer of whatever variety suits. If the inverse is true, buy a retriever.

I've seen border collies point and a dachshund sniff grouse. Point is basically any dog can do anything, but I'm feeling really good about my chances of a lab retrieving ducks and a GSP pointing birds. Your chances of getting a lab to point and a GSP to  crush waterfowl go down.



Offline mcrawfordaf

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Re: Breeds for upland
« Reply #46 on: January 31, 2022, 08:44:54 AM »
Buy Craig koshyk's pointing dog book called "the continentals" will everything you want to know.

No matter what people say, IMO no dog is truly 50/50 waterfowl or upland. And if they are, you hit the lotto. A couple of things you should figure out

1 - is your priority waterfowl or upland?
2 - what size?
3 - what type of coat?
4 - do you want a dog to point instinctually.
5 - what range do you want to hunt at?
6 - what weather will you hunt at?

Also, narrow breeds down based upon breeders close to you. All breeds have variance among them, best thing you can do to zero in on the personality and skills of your dog is hang out with the breeders dogs as much as possible. if they don't allow it, that's a red flag and move on. Another thing I would look for is a personable breeder that will answer all your questions before and after you bring the pup home. some breeders/trainers are really bizarre.


I have a griff. He has an off switch, until new people come over to the house. then he gets a bit jumpy and annoying. Nothing horrible. if the new people aren't dog people, I just crate him. otherwise he sleeps and lounges all the time, has great recall, and an instinctual hunter. He won't stay super still in a duck blind, but he'll retrieve anything, wherever. Nothing against Griffs, but I reckon when it is time to get another one I'll go Small Munsterlander or a Drentsche Patrijshond just bc I want to try something new.

Agree to disagree but the GSP can and DOES excel at both Waterfowl and Upland hunting. Versatility being the exact objective they were bred for. 

https://projectupland.com/hunting-dogs/german-shorthaired-pointers-for-waterfowl-hunting/#:~:text=The%20GSPs%20were%20bred%20to,when%20they%20have%20a%20job.

Any dog from this https://www.navhda.org/recognized-breeds/ list would perform ideally at both tasks. And if trained to NAVDHA standards would go even further.

The sire of my pup retrieves limits of green heads every year in N Idaho.



I think there is a difference to being a versatile dog and excelling equally at upland and water which is the point i'm making. I agree GSPs are a versatile dog, but I don't think they are equally skilled at both water and upland. Example, GSPs dominate upland field trials, that is absolutely not the case for water. Their chest shape  + long legs also impacts their ability to swim. Of course there are exceptions to this rule, but how do you know if you are buying an exception.

So if you favor upland and want a dog you can take water duck hunting every now and then (aka versatile dog) buy a pointer of whatever variety suits. If the inverse is true, buy a retriever.

I've seen border collies point and a dachshund sniff grouse. Point is basically any dog can do anything, but I'm feeling really good about my chances of a lab retrieving ducks and a GSP pointing birds. Your chances of getting a lab to point and a GSP to  crush waterfowl go down.

Yeah definitely agree with ya there.

Offline 2MANY

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Re: Breeds for upland
« Reply #47 on: January 31, 2022, 10:31:40 AM »
Pointing dogs are great IF...................

You hunt upland cover that the birds will hold in BUT isn't so thick that them thin skin stubby tails won't hunt it for hours and hours.
Not to mention a pointing dog in heavy cover is like a ghost unless of course you run them new fangled electronic tracking gadgets.

Pointers are great if you limit yourself to the perfect pointer cover.   

Offline Shannon

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Re: Breeds for upland
« Reply #48 on: January 31, 2022, 10:57:12 AM »
I completely disagree with 2MANY. There is a reason pointers are called upland specialist. The average well bred pointer will do better than the average retriever for upland bird hunting. I’ve had pointers that would go into any cover to look for birds. A good pointer will hunt any cover as hard as any retriever ever will. Retrievers have the edge over pointers in waterfowl hunting especially in cold weather but saying you have to limit where you upland hunt with pointers is a joke.

Offline metlhead

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Re: Breeds for upland
« Reply #49 on: January 31, 2022, 11:11:01 AM »
My pointer does not enjoy very thick cover, unless it has trails or tunnels. He will however point a very large patch of thick cover from the outside. He also made 317 waterfowl retrieves this season with only 4 swimmers and 1 brush landing lost. Sure, labs can outpace him in the water, and he can out run any retriever in the uplands. Whatever dog one has, just enjoy them for all their versatility. We only get them for such a short time.

Offline 2MANY

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Re: Breeds for upland
« Reply #50 on: January 31, 2022, 12:51:08 PM »
It's OK Shannon.........Lots of people disagree with me all the time.

Just going by what I've seen during my lifetime.

*****Results may not be indicative of your personal experiences or future*****

Offline bigdub257

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Re: Breeds for upland
« Reply #51 on: January 31, 2022, 01:16:57 PM »
I completely disagree with 2MANY. There is a reason pointers are called upland specialist. The average well bred pointer will do better than the average retriever for upland bird hunting. I’ve had pointers that would go into any cover to look for birds. A good pointer will hunt any cover as hard as any retriever ever will. Retrievers have the edge over pointers in waterfowl hunting especially in cold weather but saying you have to limit where you upland hunt with pointers is a joke.
I disagree also. I've had lots of pointers over the years.  Switched from GSP to GWP about 12 years ago.  My current GWP female who weighs about 60 pounds will  bust the heaviest brush all day long.  Some of the birds will flush in cattails although she is an excellent pointer.  Retrieves birds on land and water like crazy and is an excellent house dog who is pretty spoiled.  Retrieved over 25 ducks and a goose from the Columbia over the weekend in 20 degree temps.  Hunted with my buddy and his male lab one day and really didn't notice any difference between the dogs except the lab can swim a bit faster.  She also sits in the blind and behaves amazingly well.  It's almost comical how still and serious she is in the duck blind.

Offline 2MANY

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Re: Breeds for upland
« Reply #52 on: January 31, 2022, 01:54:59 PM »
GWP's are a great dog.
IMHO

Offline 509

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Re: Breeds for upland
« Reply #53 on: January 31, 2022, 09:04:03 PM »
Buy Craig koshyk's pointing dog book called "the continentals" will everything you want to know.

No matter what people say, IMO no dog is truly 50/50 waterfowl or upland. And if they are, you hit the lotto. A couple of things you should figure out

I have had two labs and two German Longhair Pointers.

The Labs were great family dogs. 

The German Longhair Pointers out-hunted the labs both on upland and waterfowl by a significant margin.  Their hunting drive was just light years ahead of the Labs. 

BUT, they were definitely not the family dogs that the Labs were.  They are ONE PERSON dogs. 


 


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