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Author Topic: Shot placement for black bears.  (Read 175545 times)

Offline dilleytech

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Re: Shot placement for black bears.
« Reply #105 on: August 18, 2021, 06:02:52 PM »
Right behind the shoulder usually works. This bear didn’t go 40 yards after the shot.

Looks like a heart shot to me good work.  My preference is 4”behind the leg, a little below the midway point. That’s a heart/double lung shot.

Offline dilleytech

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Re: Shot placement for black bears.
« Reply #106 on: August 18, 2021, 06:04:46 PM »
It is interesting to see the differences between Deer and elk vitals, and those of a black bear. Whereas the heart of the ungulates is directly above the foreleg, that of the bear is just behind, about the same distance from the bottom of the torso. Remember that with the bear, hair hangs down about 4-6 inches below the bottom of the torso. The lungs toward the front on the black bear and elk start at roughly the same place. But the position of the elk's is much more vertical, as the bears seems more horizontal. As many have pointed out, the more effective bear shot is farther back, about 1/4 to 1/3of the torso from the chest.

Did you look at that bear pick? Looks like the lungs are in the neck and the leg bones are nearly out of the skin on the front leg lol. That needs to be shifted back about 4”.

Offline YellowShells

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Re: Shot placement for black bears.
« Reply #107 on: August 24, 2021, 02:53:06 PM »
I bought into the "middle of the middle" hype, and it cost me a nice bear this weekend. Don't ask me why I changed my POA, my first two bears were double-lung or heart shots, or both. I will be going back to a "normal" point of aim, behind the shoulder by maybe a few inches.

Offline Magnum_Willys

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Re: Shot placement for black bears.
« Reply #108 on: August 24, 2021, 04:52:11 PM »
I was listening to the gritty podcast on my way to and from my spring bear adventures. They had a good podcast on shot placement for bears. Both Brian and Ryan say they dissect the bear in half horizontally and vertically and aim where those 2 points meet which is dead center of the bears body. The vitals on a bear are further back then one would think.


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I know this is a bear thread but that is also true of deer and elk.
   :yike: :bdid:  That doesn't sound right ?  But I'm a high shoulder guy anyway - don't like packing out of canyon/cliffs ......

Offline Jonathan_S

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Re: Shot placement for black bears.
« Reply #109 on: August 24, 2021, 05:22:27 PM »
I was listening to the gritty podcast on my way to and from my spring bear adventures. They had a good podcast on shot placement for bears. Both Brian and Ryan say they dissect the bear in half horizontally and vertically and aim where those 2 points meet which is dead center of the bears body. The vitals on a bear are further back then one would think.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I know this is a bear thread but that is also true of deer and elk.
   :yike: :bdid:  That doesn't sound right ?  But I'm a high shoulder guy anyway - don't like packing out of canyon/cliffs ......

I'm not suggesting it. I'm pointing out that broadside double lung hits go back as far as mid body. I prefer to shoot close to the < when I can
Kindly do not attempt to cloud the issue with too many facts.

Offline jrebel

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Re: Shot placement for black bears.
« Reply #110 on: August 24, 2021, 05:31:59 PM »
I was listening to the gritty podcast on my way to and from my spring bear adventures. They had a good podcast on shot placement for bears. Both Brian and Ryan say they dissect the bear in half horizontally and vertically and aim where those 2 points meet which is dead center of the bears body. The vitals on a bear are further back then one would think.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I know this is a bear thread but that is also true of deer and elk.
   :yike: :bdid:  That doesn't sound right ?  But I'm a high shoulder guy anyway - don't like packing out of canyon/cliffs ......

I'm not suggesting it. I'm pointing out that broadside double lung hits go back as far as mid body. I prefer to shoot close to the < when I can


I hate seeing this stuff on hunting forums.....as it is simply not true.  I took a pic of my son's bear yesterday but it has no reference to the half way point.  I can tell you that half way back would have been a gut shot.....maybe liver, but no lungs.  Next bear we kill, I will take pics with reference to the diaphragm.  If I can get it out whole, I will put a tape measure on it to prove my point.  Right behind the shoulder is as good a shot as any.  A shoulder / leg shot is also good.  Half way back is no good in most cases.  If you hit the liver it will kill a bear quick, if you are off by even a little....and shoot back by even a couple inches, you have a got shot bear that will likely never be recovered. 

All of this is assuming the bear is perfectly broadside.  Clearly if it is quartering away, the half way point might be a great entry point with the offside shoulder being the exit. 

Deer and elk are no different....if you are truly half way back, you are too far back and risk a gut shot.  If your luck, the liver will be your saving grace.   

Offline Jonathan_S

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Re: Shot placement for black bears.
« Reply #111 on: August 24, 2021, 05:44:23 PM »
1) my post which appears to have triggered your hate was clearly focused on deer and elk. Again I don't aim for it but middle/middle is a double lung hit, won't bleed much but will kill quickly.

2) hate it or not, it's true and I've killed plenty of bears very quickly with that shot. I don't prefer it over a shoulder shot.

3) lots of bears are hit too far forward and lost.

Kindly do not attempt to cloud the issue with too many facts.

Offline dilleytech

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Re: Shot placement for black bears.
« Reply #112 on: August 29, 2021, 01:14:24 PM »
I was listening to the gritty podcast on my way to and from my spring bear adventures. They had a good podcast on shot placement for bears. Both Brian and Ryan say they dissect the bear in half horizontally and vertically and aim where those 2 points meet which is dead center of the bears body. The vitals on a bear are further back then one would think.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I know this is a bear thread but that is also true of deer and elk.
   :yike: :bdid:  That doesn't sound right ?  But I'm a high shoulder guy anyway - don't like packing out of canyon/cliffs ......

I'm not suggesting it. I'm pointing out that broadside double lung hits go back as far as mid body. I prefer to shoot close to the < when I can


I hate seeing this stuff on hunting forums.....as it is simply not true.  I took a pic of my son's bear yesterday but it has no reference to the half way point.  I can tell you that half way back would have been a gut shot.....maybe liver, but no lungs.  Next bear we kill, I will take pics with reference to the diaphragm.  If I can get it out whole, I will put a tape measure on it to prove my point.  Right behind the shoulder is as good a shot as any.  A shoulder / leg shot is also good.  Half way back is no good in most cases.  If you hit the liver it will kill a bear quick, if you are off by even a little....and shoot back by even a couple inches, you have a got shot bear that will likely never be recovered. 

All of this is assuming the bear is perfectly broadside.  Clearly if it is quartering away, the half way point might be a great entry point with the offside shoulder being the exit. 

Deer and elk are no different....if you are truly half way back, you are too far back and risk a gut shot.  If your luck, the liver will be your saving grace.

Well this was double lung. Lungs go beyond midway back. Perfectly broadside. You don’t know the internals of a bear as much as you think.

Offline Platensek-po

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Re: Shot placement for black bears.
« Reply #113 on: August 29, 2021, 01:33:34 PM »
I was listening to the gritty podcast on my way to and from my spring bear adventures. They had a good podcast on shot placement for bears. Both Brian and Ryan say they dissect the bear in half horizontally and vertically and aim where those 2 points meet which is dead center of the bears body. The vitals on a bear are further back then one would think.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I know this is a bear thread but that is also true of deer and elk.
   :yike: :bdid:  That doesn't sound right ?  But I'm a high shoulder guy anyway - don't like packing out of canyon/cliffs ......

I'm not suggesting it. I'm pointing out that broadside double lung hits go back as far as mid body. I prefer to shoot close to the < when I can


I hate seeing this stuff on hunting forums.....as it is simply not true.  I took a pic of my son's bear yesterday but it has no reference to the half way point.  I can tell you that half way back would have been a gut shot.....maybe liver, but no lungs.  Next bear we kill, I will take pics with reference to the diaphragm.  If I can get it out whole, I will put a tape measure on it to prove my point.  Right behind the shoulder is as good a shot as any.  A shoulder / leg shot is also good.  Half way back is no good in most cases.  If you hit the liver it will kill a bear quick, if you are off by even a little....and shoot back by even a couple inches, you have a got shot bear that will likely never be recovered. 

All of this is assuming the bear is perfectly broadside.  Clearly if it is quartering away, the half way point might be a great entry point with the offside shoulder being the exit. 

Deer and elk are no different....if you are truly half way back, you are too far back and risk a gut shot.  If your luck, the liver will be your saving grace.

Well this was double lung. Lungs go beyond midway back. Perfectly broadside. You don’t know the internals of a bear as much as you think.

That is one awesome picture!
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Offline Jonathan_S

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Re: Shot placement for black bears.
« Reply #114 on: August 30, 2021, 08:25:29 AM »
I was listening to the gritty podcast on my way to and from my spring bear adventures. They had a good podcast on shot placement for bears. Both Brian and Ryan say they dissect the bear in half horizontally and vertically and aim where those 2 points meet which is dead center of the bears body. The vitals on a bear are further back then one would think.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I know this is a bear thread but that is also true of deer and elk.
   :yike: :bdid:  That doesn't sound right ?  But I'm a high shoulder guy anyway - don't like packing out of canyon/cliffs ......

I'm not suggesting it. I'm pointing out that broadside double lung hits go back as far as mid body. I prefer to shoot close to the < when I can


I hate seeing this stuff on hunting forums.....as it is simply not true.  I took a pic of my son's bear yesterday but it has no reference to the half way point.  I can tell you that half way back would have been a gut shot.....maybe liver, but no lungs.  Next bear we kill, I will take pics with reference to the diaphragm.  If I can get it out whole, I will put a tape measure on it to prove my point.  Right behind the shoulder is as good a shot as any.  A shoulder / leg shot is also good.  Half way back is no good in most cases.  If you hit the liver it will kill a bear quick, if you are off by even a little....and shoot back by even a couple inches, you have a got shot bear that will likely never be recovered. 

All of this is assuming the bear is perfectly broadside.  Clearly if it is quartering away, the half way point might be a great entry point with the offside shoulder being the exit. 

Deer and elk are no different....if you are truly half way back, you are too far back and risk a gut shot.  If your luck, the liver will be your saving grace.

Well this was double lung. Lungs go beyond midway back. Perfectly broadside. You don’t know the internals of a bear as much as you think.

^ Part of the issue is post mortem examination of the diaphragm and lungs reveal deflated and shrunken vitals.

I shot my 15th and 16th bear a week and a half ago and mid-body hits resulted in a thorough job on the lungs.
Kindly do not attempt to cloud the issue with too many facts.

Offline dilleytech

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Re: Shot placement for black bears.
« Reply #115 on: August 30, 2021, 01:34:45 PM »
Exactly right, deflated Lungs are something like 1/4 the size of inflated lungs.

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Re: Shot placement for black bears.
« Reply #116 on: August 30, 2021, 01:44:28 PM »
It is interesting to see the differences between Deer and elk vitals, and those of a black bear. Whereas the heart of the ungulates is directly above the foreleg, that of the bear is just behind, about the same distance from the bottom of the torso. Remember that with the bear, hair hangs down about 4-6 inches below the bottom of the torso. The lungs toward the front on the black bear and elk start at roughly the same place. But the position of the elk's is much more vertical, as the bears seems more horizontal. As many have pointed out, the more effective bear shot is farther back, about 1/4 to 1/3of the torso from the chest.

I wish people would stop posting these bone pictures. They are bound to convince people to take shots (especially with a bow) that they ought not to do.

The anatomical alignment of the shoulder bones are not correct.  They are too far forward.

If anyone doubts this, simply look at an bulges of the musculature at the top of the scapula under the "hump" of the skin and the pivot point of the shoulder when they walk.
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Re: Shot placement for black bears.
« Reply #117 on: August 31, 2021, 03:33:42 AM »
What we need is a pic like Dilleytech's pic but with the bear sawn in half down the back bone.  Then we could see the "skin" side and the inside with them aligned.  That will prove where the lungs are and how far back.
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Offline Jonathan_S

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Re: Shot placement for black bears.
« Reply #118 on: August 31, 2021, 04:39:26 AM »
What we need is a pic like Dilleytech's pic but with the bear sawn in half down the back bone.  Then we could see the "skin" side and the inside with them aligned.  That will prove where the lungs are and how far back.

That will prove where the dead lungs are, not where the live lungs are. Cutting the rib cage, even on a live animal results in pneumothorax and collapses the lungs.
Kindly do not attempt to cloud the issue with too many facts.

Offline trophyhunt

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Re: Shot placement for black bears.
« Reply #119 on: August 31, 2021, 06:20:48 AM »
Didn't read the thread, but I've killed a dozen bears, I aim the same place on all my animals with my 300 win.  They all died within yards of being shot, except one, hit back and livered it, found it barley alive the next day and killed it.  Behind the shoulder, aim and shoot.
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