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Author Topic: New Elk Rifle Help  (Read 6961 times)

Offline MeepDog

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Re: New Elk Rifle Help
« Reply #45 on: November 22, 2023, 11:44:11 AM »
Why is it that every time I see one of these "long range" hunting youtubers who say they practice so much and that they never miss etc etc just to see them fling a bunch of lead downrange at 700 yards and hit back hams or gut punch animals. The one youtube group that is censored on here being a great example of guys who say theyre good out to 750yards then proceed to edit out the bad shots they make because the wind shifted because theyre shooting too damn far to begin with. Everyone these days wants to think theyre good out to a half mile, and maybe they are, but its my opinion that you shouldnt shoot that far at our animals with any bullet, match, bonded or otherwise.

For this reason I think you should consider a 12 gauge slug gun for your elk rifle.

I bet we could get a rifled slug gun to shoot 700 yards  :drool:
It would need to be a similar set up to a military mortar with the hand winding adjustments and lots of misses.

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Re: New Elk Rifle Help
« Reply #46 on: November 22, 2023, 03:45:31 PM »
My suggestion is a rifle in a .284 caliber of your choice (280 Remington, 280AI, 7mm rem mag, 7 prc) will be suitable for close to longer ranges.  Donít need to burn 70 grains plus of powder to kill an elk adequately.  Ballistically 7mms are hard to beat unless running the big 30s.
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Offline okie john

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Re: New Elk Rifle Help
« Reply #47 on: November 25, 2023, 10:21:29 AM »
Not opposed to the Tikka T3X Viel. Any thoughts on 26" vs. 24" barrel? 1:8" twist vs. 1:10"?

Crunch the numbers and see just how heavy you need to go for a hunting bullet that can kill elk cleanly at the distance you plan to shoot.

I grew up around target shooters. Definitely study what they're doing but remember that their goals are very different from yours. They can be quick to dive down some pretty specific rabbit holes and you don't have to follow them every time.

The 30-03 (which became the 30-06) had a 1:10 twist to stabilize 220-grain bullets. That's been the standard for .30-caliber American rifles ever since but it's fast compared to a lot of other bore diameters. Monos depart from the Greenhill formula somewhat (https://www.ssusa.org/content/how-to-calculate-rifling-twist-rates-for-stabilizing-bullets/#:~:text=Enter%20Professor%20Sir%20Alfred%20George,2)%20%C3%B7%20L%20%3D%20T.) but you should be good for at least 220 grains with a 1:10 twist.


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Online adamR

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Re: New Elk Rifle Help
« Reply #48 on: November 29, 2023, 04:54:36 AM »
Does anyone have any actual experience with Seekins Havak PH2 rifles? I have not read a negative comment about them and I'm leaning that way... It will be a 300 win mag.

Online HereDuckyDucky

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Re: New Elk Rifle Help
« Reply #49 on: November 29, 2023, 05:16:52 AM »
Does anyone have any actual experience with Seekins Havak PH2 rifles? I have not read a negative comment about them and I'm leaning that way... It will be a 300 win mag.

My buddy owns a gun store. When I asked about off-the-shelf, high-end rifles, this is what he recommended. I ended up going custom. Had I not, I probably would have gone with the Seekins. Nice rifles!

RW

Offline raydog

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Re: New Elk Rifle Help
« Reply #50 on: November 29, 2023, 06:09:33 AM »
Does anyone have any actual experience with Seekins Havak PH2 rifles? I have not read a negative comment about them and I'm leaning that way... It will be a 300 win mag.
I bought a seekins 7mm RM havak last year. It's a fantastic rifle. I took it to Montana this year and got my buck early in the trip. My dad like how well the rifle performed so much, he used it for the rest of the trip until he got his buck. I really like how seekins rifles have a faster twist allowing heavier bullets. My deer was shot at 400 yards and his at 460, which is pretty far for us westside guys

Offline dreadi

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Re: New Elk Rifle Help
« Reply #51 on: November 30, 2023, 01:48:19 PM »
Does anyone have any actual experience with Seekins Havak PH2 rifles? I have not read a negative comment about them and I'm leaning that way... It will be a 300 win mag.
I bought a seekins 7mm RM havak last year. It's a fantastic rifle. I took it to Montana this year and got my buck early in the trip. My dad like how well the rifle performed so much, he used it for the rest of the trip until he got his buck. I really like how seekins rifles have a faster twist allowing heavier bullets. My deer was shot at 400 yards and his at 460, which is pretty far for us westside guys
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Offline xXLojackXx

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Re: New Elk Rifle Help
« Reply #52 on: December 03, 2023, 08:08:28 PM »
Does anyone have any actual experience with Seekins Havak PH2 rifles? I have not read a negative comment about them and I'm leaning that way... It will be a 300 win mag.

Seekins makes nice rifles all around. The barrels are Rock Creek 5r 416 stainless cut rifled and shoot well. You also wonít find a nicer groups of guys to deal with. Do not hesitate to get a Seekins rifle.

Offline raydog

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Re: New Elk Rifle Help
« Reply #53 on: December 03, 2023, 08:11:14 PM »
Does anyone have any actual experience with Seekins Havak PH2 rifles? I have not read a negative comment about them and I'm leaning that way... It will be a 300 win mag.
I bought a seekins 7mm RM havak last year. It's a fantastic rifle. I took it to Montana this year and got my buck early in the trip. My dad like how well the rifle performed so much, he used it for the rest of the trip until he got his buck. I really like how seekins rifles have a faster twist allowing heavier bullets. My deer was shot at 400 yards and his at 460, which is pretty far for us westside guys
Thatís a dandy.


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Thanks Dreadi!

Offline jbuck

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Re: New Elk Rifle Help
« Reply #54 on: December 05, 2023, 07:35:36 AM »
I'll add that tikka's are known for slower barrels. They shoot great, but you won't be getting close to published velocities. Given that nosler reccomends a minimum of 1,800fps for the accubond. That's going to realistically handicap yourself to just over 600yds. My ballistic calculator says 630yds at 1,803fps. That is running 2,850fps which is 100fps less then the box says, still may be optimistic.

If you handload the PRC makes it easier since it doesn't have the belt and should be built with a tighter twist to take advantage of high BC bullets.

A Seekins PH2 is probably my next rifle. Or a waypoint 2020. Still deciding.

Now to my 700yd soapbox. Please do the animal right by actually practicing at the ranges you are planning on shooting. Field positions, not just off a bench. Every year I get to see people blasting at deer or elk way past their abilities. The best scenario is they miss 7 or 8 shots throwing dirt all around. The worst case is they actually wound the animal just to have it run off and suffer.


Offline sage rat

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Re: New Elk Rifle Help
« Reply #55 on: December 05, 2023, 08:01:44 AM »
I love my Seekins Havak.  Its topped off with the same scope you have. shoots .25

Offline Sneaky

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Re: New Elk Rifle Help
« Reply #56 on: December 05, 2023, 08:16:48 AM »
I suppose I should have been more specific; I don't plan on hunting elk at 700 yards. I do plan on practicing out to 700+ accurately with the hope of sub 600 yard shots. As I said, I currently shoot Accubonds but have reloading equipment and plan to play around with other projectiles in the future. I want a rifle capable of whatever I decide to do; my current rifle is not the gun to do that with. I've been hunting with a 300 win mag for probably 20 years and have used those Accubonds for probably 15 of those; I'm very aware of their capabilities. Sub 600, would not hesitate!

If you are practicing at 700 Iíd have zero hesitation taking that shot with a 300 win mag and 180gr bullet for elk. More than enough energy to drop an elk. Reality as long as that bullets 1200 fps or faster that bullet will expand and it has that out to 1,000. The key to all of it is PRACTICE.


does anyone have a photograph of a recovered accubond at 1200FPS? You might not, because that bullet at that speed will likely pass through with minimal expansion.

I found this video in a quick search that shows a 140gr accubond traveling at 1700-1800ish FPS. A tough, bonded bullet like an accubond can pencil through an animal with that sort of performance at low velocities.


This is why a lot of long range guys are shooting ELD-M/Berger style bullets is because they are still getting good upset/killing characteristics out of low velocity bullets....not to mention superior accuracy. Its all about picking the right tool for the right job. If you plan on shooting long, use a hyper accurate bullet that will provide reliable expansion at low velocities. If you plan on sub 500 yard impacts and want the ability to take advantage of unorthodox shot angles, pick a tough bonded or monometal bullet.  Whatever you do, make sure your rifle has a barrel with a fast enough twist to stabilize the bullet you decide to shoot. :twocents:




Offline ipkus

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Re: New Elk Rifle Help
« Reply #57 on: December 05, 2023, 09:41:52 AM »
People also need to understand that using a Berger type bullet in their military grade sniper rifle that they are all dialed in to kill rabbits at 1,200 yds will blow up and usually not kill the whitetail/elk/whatever that jumps up at 80 yds. when they are hiking in.  I've seen waaaay too many examples of it over the years.  Looks like a grenade went off on the entry side and little if any penetration.

Offline BULLBLASTER

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Re: New Elk Rifle Help
« Reply #58 on: December 05, 2023, 09:51:52 AM »
People also need to understand that using a Berger type bullet in their military grade sniper rifle that they are all dialed in to kill rabbits at 1,200 yds will blow up and usually not kill the whitetail/elk/whatever that jumps up at 80 yds. when they are hiking in.  I've seen waaaay too many examples of it over the years.  Looks like a grenade went off on the entry side and little if any penetration.
:rolleyes:

Not anything ive seen. Ive used plenty of berger bullets from 95 grain 6mm clear up to 215 grain 30 cal, very near to far and never had one not penetrate and kill the animal.
« Last Edit: December 05, 2023, 10:21:29 AM by BULLBLASTER »

Offline Taco280AI

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Re: New Elk Rifle Help
« Reply #59 on: December 05, 2023, 09:54:02 AM »
...Looks like a grenade went off on the entry side and little if any penetration.

That was the last time I used BTs on game.

 


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