Winston Unit January 2013 Cow Hunt

[actionshooter]

Nope, thats not coming from my buddies uncles, cousins, life partner. Its from the bios and RMEF members who are working in those areas.
 You are right about the winston unit. Its the least affected, but they are starving in the margret/toutle/blast zone. The elk don't see the GMU lines.  The area has to be looked at as a whole, not just each individual unit. When the elk in the winston are reduced the elk from the other areas will move in.( Why the WDFG didn't give out a butload of margret cow tags, I don't know.)

What I am seeing here is a complete lack of understanding about proper habitat/carrying capacity AND some short sighted thoughts about next years hunting. (OH-NO! I might have to find a new unit!)
Everyone is worried about just filling their tags and don't care about the health of the herd.
 This is going to hurt the hunting opportunity for sure, but if its not done now, disease and winter die off (remember 3 years ago?)
is going to be worse.

Hunting was pretty damn good for about 20 years because of a high elk population but the habitat isn't there anymore. Now the most important thing is to make sure the elk are healthy.

[cem3434]

There are animals that starve to death in almost every unit in this state. Does that mean we should start cutting those herds in half. No, its part of the cycle and some dont make it, but the predators and scavengers rely on them too.

The bottomline is Weyco thinks the elk are causing to much damage to the trees and they want then gone. They started spraying to kill off the things that are nutritious to the elk and the State is letting them do it. Now the WDFW just wants the additional revenue.without actually doing any work. So when you look at it, its really that simple.

I think some plan needs to be developed, but whacking over 500 cows a year isn't a management plan. Maybe they should take some of the money they have gotten from the permit applications and spend it on opening a feeding station or two in the tree farm in a partnership with Weyco. I don't know what the correct plan is, but killing off almost half of the herd is piss poor management at best!

BTKR, I'm sure that cow was surviving just like every other elk right up until you pulled the trigger.

[logger]

How about the forest service get to logging some of our ground again especially in the lewis and wind river, and packwood units, then maybe they would have a little better carrying capacity as it is, the national forest are all but dead to elk and deer as far as I am concerned.

[actionshooter]

How about the forest service get to logging some of our ground again especially in the lewis and wind river, and packwood units, then maybe they would have a little better carrying capacity as it is, the national forest are all but dead to elk and deer as far as I am concerned.

I agree 100%

[elksnout]

How about the forest service get to logging some of our ground again especially in the lewis and wind river, and packwood units, then maybe they would have a little better carrying capacity as it is, the national forest are all but dead to elk and deer as far as I am concerned.

       

  Well said logger. Add the Soiuxon to your list please.

[HntnFsh]

How about the forest service get to logging some of our ground again especially in the lewis and wind river, and packwood units, then maybe they would have a little better carrying capacity as it is, the national forest are all but dead to elk and deer as far as I am concerned.

Very wise words!  Would help so much in so any ways!

[C-Money]

Mounted uterus's look good also, I have 2 mounted on the wall......

Let me guess.....They are hung about waist high?   

[cem3434]

How about the forest service get to logging some of our ground again especially in the lewis and wind river, and packwood units, then maybe they would have a little better carrying capacity as it is, the national forest are all but dead to elk and deer as far as I am concerned.

Very wise words!  Would help so much in so any ways!

 
Jobs and habitat. The state and feds are to messed up to realize that it would help.

[logger]

we  hunted by the ape caves and there were a fair number of elk,BUT in my observation most guys were hunting ground that bordered orm an f.s. we are currently bidding on work for the f.s. that has us thinning 380 acres with half acre clear cuts that arn't really clear cut by definition for elk habitat, half acre is to damn small and will only encourage brush, need to be 2 acre min. to have a impact. I absolutey depise the f.s. and most of their backasswards thinkin. we also have to decommision several roads off the 25 rd. that leads into some of the most beautiful timber that will never be cut and it is not old growth. I am a firm believer that they do not have to go back to massive clear cuts as they did in years past but they need to quit the studying *censored* to death and make a move in the right direction, the state makes a ton of money at it and so can the feds if they would just not try to reinvent the wheel and practice proper forest management and the benefit is money in the coffers and big game back on the f.s. ground that it once was, the elk don't camp in downtown packwood because the food is readily availiable in the surrounding f.s.ground.

[SI Eagle]

SI Eagle.

I would think that this would qualify as starving...would you not? This Winston January cow did not have any fat on it and it was losing muscle mass. These photos show where a tender backstrap should have been. Not a mass of sinew and stringy muscle.





I think you left out the picture of the hoof rot that cow had. I believe when you posted that last it had hoof rot. I will give you the hoof rot and what that is doing to the herd. I can't give you starving. They have plenty of habitat and feed in the Winston and no elk need to be fed or are starving. Between hoof rot and cow tags the herd is in bad shape.

The fact is, most of the Winston cannot carry this many elk for much longer. The bubble has burst and it will never be the same again.

[actionshooter]

SI,
 since it seems you have it all figured out............what causes the hoof rot?

[SI Eagle]

SI,
 since it seems you have it all figured out............what causes the hoof rot?

Not sure but it certainly isn't starvation.

[actionshooter]

SI,
 since it seems you have it all figured out............what causes the hoof rot?

Not sure but it certainly isn't starvation.

Actually hoof rot can be associated with a lack of nutrients and minerals in livestock...........but I'm sure elk are different as they are wild animals.  And since I treat work with livestock and not wild animals, I'm sure your right.

[Cylvertip]

     I would think calf numbers would be through the floor and antler growth would be horrible down there if the elk in Winston were starving.  From what I have heard about the bulls that came out of there this year, that is not the case.

Winston was also largely out of the blast zone, so there was no great opening up of the forest caused by nature.  Clear cuts feed that herd and they have been strong for years.  Again, look at the number of bulls coming out of there every year. 

 

I hunted the Winston for many years during archery.  It is hard to go anywhere else on the Wetside and hunt elk after being in the numbers you see down there. You get really spoiled and have a false sense of elk reality hunting in there. No big deal to see a legal bull every day and put stalks on multiple bulls during a day.  best day in the woods,  on foot and bike ( not driving around and glassing) was seeing 6 legal bulls, with 4 of those being large 5x5's or better, and I think I was within 200 yds of all of them.   A lot of places down there and in the Margeret too, it looks like your in a barn yard. 

If hoof rot ever takes serious hold in there it will be a disaster, especially if we have a big snow year, that is for sure. 

[HntnFsh]

It alrewady has!

If hoof rot ever takes serious hold in there it will be a disaster, especially if we have a big snow year, that is for sure.
[/quote]