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Author Topic: Anybody ever get a dog from WALABS?  (Read 32636 times)

Offline wahunter21

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Anybody ever get a dog from WALABS?
« on: February 12, 2013, 09:16:01 PM »
This is my first post, my name is Sean I just moved to medical lake about 5 months ago. I got a chocolate lab puppy from Jim Young at WALABS in September. My wife and i did a good amount of research and Jim claimed to have 25+ years breeding labs and so on. So we put a deposit down and decided to go to Onalaska, WA(about 7 hours away) and pick up our puppy. So when we showed up at Jim's place there were at least a dozen adult labs( one labradoodle) and they were all in small dog runs. Jim had so many dogs and he had goats chickens etc. He made the comment " Yep, the only thing not pregnant here is the chicken." So we took our female puppy Bailey, home and hoped for the best.  She was sick from day one and we spent lots of time and money to get her healthy. She had worms bad and was way under weight. She seems happy and healthy now at 6 months, she is 50 lbs. and real short. I went on WALABS website and now it says Jim is breeding miniature labs. This guy is scum his dogs are not healthy and mistreated. I am sorry about the long post but i just hope this guy gets stopped from ever breeding labs again. He is cutting every corner in the book and now he says he has miniature labs and wants 2500.00. He needs to be stopped. I have heard of several families getting sick puppies from Jim. One puppy from Bailey's litter was born with three legs.  He has moved locations from Oregon to WA trying to run from his past of running a puppy mill. Anyways anybody ever here of Jim or WALABS? Thanks for reading, i just needed to vent, this guys makes me sick.

Offline Birdguy

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Re: Anybody ever get a dog from WALABS?
« Reply #1 on: February 12, 2013, 09:33:08 PM »
Wow, that is terrible. Glad you got your pup healthy, though you should not have had to. Thanks for sharing your experience, hopefully it will prevent someone else from going through what you had to  :sry:.

Offline YellowDog

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Re: Anybody ever get a dog from WALABS?
« Reply #2 on: February 12, 2013, 11:35:03 PM »
I don't really know anything about WALABS but I have been considering a new pup in the next 6 months or so.  I went to his website a couple weeks ago and as soon as I saw the advertisement for his "Tea Cup Labs" I about threw up and vowed to never visit the site again (on purpose anyway).

Offline Mudman

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Re: Anybody ever get a dog from WALABS?
« Reply #3 on: February 12, 2013, 11:45:12 PM »
I will ask my wife to ask about this walabs guy in Vet. community? 
« Last Edit: February 12, 2013, 11:51:06 PM by Mudman »
MAGA!  Again..

Offline Stilly bay

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Re: Anybody ever get a dog from WALABS?
« Reply #4 on: February 13, 2013, 12:41:01 PM »
this is why research is paramount when choosing your new hunting buddy for the next 10-12 years, although one look at the guy's website would have me running away like my ass was on fire.
he seems too hung up on gimmicks like color and size, two points that if not done properly could huge genetic nightmares. not to mention there is enough BS on that website to fill a five yard dump truck, but there is no information on pedigrees or titles.

last but not least he seems overly proud of the fact his dogs are AKC registered. AKC registration doesn't mean much and it definitely isn't a promise of quality. what I am saying is if a breeder is making a hunting dog sound like its main selling point is the AKC registration (espc at the price point he is selling at)  either take a closer look for all the proper health checks on the parents as well as titles before running away... OR JUST RUN AWAY.

of course an actual visit to the kennel trumps a visit to the website any day.
"Love the dogs before loving the hunt; love the hunt for the dogs." - Ben O. Williams

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Offline AspenBud

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Re: Anybody ever get a dog from WALABS?
« Reply #5 on: February 13, 2013, 01:10:19 PM »
A few points...

First, take a look at these websites...

http://www.bergbrossetters.com/

http://www.hifivekennels.com/

http://www.tekoamountainsetters.com/

http://crosswindkennel.com/

All of these guys stress careful breeding and they all advertise that their dogs are proven in competition. While these are all pointing dog breeders you can find the same mentality in the retriever world. While their dogs have papers (most are FDSB and not AKC), that's not their focus or what's important to them.

Second, a dozen dogs isn't uncommon for breeders to have. Some go small scale and some keep a large kennel. That doesn't make them a puppy mill. A good and selective breeding program requires a fair number of dogs to evaluate. The number will arguably go up or down depending on who makes the cut and who gets washed out. This is something animal rights people generally don't get and why their policies often hurt legitimate breeders and those of us seeking well bred dogs.

Third, I've never heard of "tea cup labs" but 90 lbs labs are NOT ideal for upland hunting. 45-60 lbs is better suited to that and a number of breeders have switched to that. There is a difference between lab dwarfism (which can be tested for) and a small performance lab.

Labs have a whole raft of health clearances that should be obtained and buyers should be demanding to see them. Understanding pedigrees, titles, and asking around, even on boards like this is generally good policy before buying.

Offline jetjockey

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Re: Anybody ever get a dog from WALABS?
« Reply #6 on: February 13, 2013, 02:29:25 PM »
Not to mention that the best dogs from the best breeds typically don't get advertised and the dogs go to select owners.  If you can get in the door with those types of breeding, you greatly enhance your chances of getting a top end dog.

Offline AspenBud

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Re: Anybody ever get a dog from WALABS?
« Reply #7 on: February 13, 2013, 02:48:54 PM »
Not to mention that the best dogs from the best breeds typically don't get advertised and the dogs go to select owners.  If you can get in the door with those types of breeding, you greatly enhance your chances of getting a top end dog.

True. Top line breedings are often sold before they even take place.

If you look at that guy's website it looks like he saw some things at a shelter that bothered him, and with good reason. My guess is it affected him to the point of not being able to make the hard decisions that go with breeding or he's in over his head and not willing to admit it. Three legged pups and dwarf dogs say it all.

Offline YellowDog

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Re: Anybody ever get a dog from WALABS?
« Reply #8 on: February 13, 2013, 03:54:29 PM »
Third, I've never heard of "tea cup labs" but 90 lbs labs are NOT ideal for upland hunting. 45-60 lbs is better suited to that and a number of breeders have switched to that. There is a difference between lab dwarfism (which can be tested for) and a small performance lab.


He's advertising "Tea Cup Labs" that he claims "nobody else has" and their maximum weight will be 25 pounds.  I realize 90 pound labs are not ideal for upland hunting but I'm not sure what the ideal task/purpose of a 25 pound lab is.  IMO his Tea Cup Labs are nothing but a gimmic and advertising and breeding for them tells me that his breeding program is not speaking for itself and/or producing pups like that of a quality breeder that sells pups or has a wait list before the breeding even occurs.  He's trying to make a buck by creating the next new designer dog from what I can tell...not doing what is right for the breed.

Offline AspenBud

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Re: Anybody ever get a dog from WALABS?
« Reply #9 on: February 13, 2013, 04:56:25 PM »
Third, I've never heard of "tea cup labs" but 90 lbs labs are NOT ideal for upland hunting. 45-60 lbs is better suited to that and a number of breeders have switched to that. There is a difference between lab dwarfism (which can be tested for) and a small performance lab.


He's advertising "Tea Cup Labs" that he claims "nobody else has" and their maximum weight will be 25 pounds.  I realize 90 pound labs are not ideal for upland hunting but I'm not sure what the ideal task/purpose of a 25 pound lab is.  IMO his Tea Cup Labs are nothing but a gimmic and advertising and breeding for them tells me that his breeding program is not speaking for itself and/or producing pups like that of a quality breeder that sells pups or has a wait list before the breeding even occurs.  He's trying to make a buck by creating the next new designer dog from what I can tell...not doing what is right for the breed.

Like I said, they're probably dogs afflicted with dwarfism. Either that or it's some designer dog cross like a Labradoodle.

Offline YellowDog

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Re: Anybody ever get a dog from WALABS?
« Reply #10 on: February 13, 2013, 05:12:05 PM »
Sounds like we are on the same  :tup:

Offline wahunter21

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Re: Anybody ever get a dog from WALABS?
« Reply #11 on: February 13, 2013, 08:30:32 PM »
Thanks for the input, everyone. I just hate knowing this guy is still pumping out litters with such poor standards and unorthodox methods and charging so much. Jim Young (WALABS) runs a puppy mill and has sick puppies i just feel bad for the other families who will go through what we went through. But our dog, Bailey is doing great and we have just bonded more with her through it all. We even found a couple sheds today when we were out and about.  :tup:

Offline Happy Gilmore

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Re: Anybody ever get a dog from WALABS?
« Reply #12 on: February 13, 2013, 08:34:15 PM »
Guys who have dogs or breedings that are the "chit" have their pups sold before they are bred and have little need for a website. They will not print fliers to sell dogs.
"Far better it is to dare mighty things, to win glorious triumphs, even though checked by failure, than to take rank with those poor spirits who neither enjoy much nor suffer much, because they live in the grey twilight that knows not victory nor defeat."
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Offline Happy Gilmore

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Re: Anybody ever get a dog from WALABS?
« Reply #13 on: February 13, 2013, 08:37:26 PM »
It might not be a good thing to call people out on the hunt wa website by name like this for legal reason. As with anything, buyer beware. If you didn't do your research it's hard to make a complaint after the fact. Sorry you've had to learn the hard way.
"Far better it is to dare mighty things, to win glorious triumphs, even though checked by failure, than to take rank with those poor spirits who neither enjoy much nor suffer much, because they live in the grey twilight that knows not victory nor defeat."
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Offline wahunter21

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Re: Anybody ever get a dog from WALABS?
« Reply #14 on: February 13, 2013, 08:43:06 PM »
Ok, Happy but not everyone who is getting a pup has the "in" to find those breeders, so they get them from other (advertised) breeders.

Offline Happy Gilmore

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Re: Anybody ever get a dog from WALABS?
« Reply #15 on: February 14, 2013, 05:56:02 AM »
Ok, Happy but not everyone who is getting a pup has the "in" to find those breeders, so they get them from other (advertised) breeders.

Spend time asking around. Most breeders are always happy to give referrals. Problem come when people decide they want a pup and go out and buy from the first guy who has some advertised. Waiting 6 months or being on a waiting list usually provides good results.
"Far better it is to dare mighty things, to win glorious triumphs, even though checked by failure, than to take rank with those poor spirits who neither enjoy much nor suffer much, because they live in the grey twilight that knows not victory nor defeat."
Theodore Roosevelt 1899

Offline AspenBud

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Re: Anybody ever get a dog from WALABS?
« Reply #16 on: February 14, 2013, 12:01:18 PM »
Go to field trials and hunt tests. Talk to people and watch dogs run. Breeders are often at those events and people who buy and use their dogs show up too. It will give you an insight into how different breeds and lines work and better educate you for your puppy buying process.

Offline Stilly bay

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Re: Anybody ever get a dog from WALABS?
« Reply #17 on: February 14, 2013, 04:31:38 PM »
Ok, Happy but not everyone who is getting a pup has the "in" to find those breeders, so they get them from other (advertised) breeders.

Spend time asking around. Most breeders are always happy to give referrals. Problem come when people decide they want a pup and go out and buy from the first guy who has some advertised. Waiting 6 months or being on a waiting list usually provides good results.

just like with every thing else, the guys that have to advertise are having a harder time moving their pups and are trying to attract people in the pet trade. the guys that don't have to advertise usually have people already looking for them because the breeding sells itself.


 
"Love the dogs before loving the hunt; love the hunt for the dogs." - Ben O. Williams

“It is easy to forget that in the main we die only seven times more slowly than our dogs.”
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Offline coachcw

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Re: Anybody ever get a dog from WALABS?
« Reply #18 on: February 14, 2013, 04:44:48 PM »
That guys need a arsh Kicking . I'd sick Jessie on him from king five news . There's afew other things I'd like to say but I might get banned for it !

Offline bearpaw

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Re: Anybody ever get a dog from WALABS?
« Reply #19 on: February 14, 2013, 05:14:23 PM »
I cannot comment about the breeder in question as I know nothing about him, but for future reference, we do have several lab breeders on this forum whom I've never heard anything bad about. :twocents:
Americans are systematically advocating, legislating, and voting away each others rights. Support all user groups & quit losing opportunity!

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Offline YellowDog

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Re: Anybody ever get a dog from WALABS?
« Reply #20 on: February 14, 2013, 10:09:44 PM »
This is kind of off topic a bit but I have been trying to figure out the best way to determine who all of the site sponsors are here.  I checked the site sponsor page and it looks like there are a few sponsors that don't have anything on that page.  Is having a banner on that page an optional thing or is it just not quite up to date.  Just curious. 

Offline wahunter21

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Re: Anybody ever get a dog from WALABS?
« Reply #21 on: February 15, 2013, 07:15:06 AM »
Thanks for the advice happy and others. If we decide to get another pup I will do more research and take the time to find. A responsible breeder.

Offline Happy Gilmore

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Re: Anybody ever get a dog from WALABS?
« Reply #22 on: February 15, 2013, 09:52:24 AM »
Thanks for the advice happy and others. If we decide to get another pup I will do more research and take the time to find. A responsible breeder.

Didn't mean to come across wrong. Only been on here via my phone for the last week and it's hard for me to type on it without abbreviating my thoughts-

Stuff does happen although, any decent breeder is going to give you the record of shots and dates of wormings. Pups should be wormed and have their first round of shots when they go home. After that, the new owner should be taking over. I recommended all of my new puppy buyers to get with THEIR vet within a week of getting home. Pups I sold had urinary tract infections. It comes with the territory of owning a dog. It wasn't a big cost(except one which was misdiagnosed by the DVM) but, pups do get sick and not every one is always perfectly healthy. Now, based on the other crap the guy was/is breeding I would have run the other way after seeing or hearing him talk about Lab x Poodle MUTTS(not labradoodle, MUTT) and whatever other midget labs he's trying to pass as purebred.

Either way, there is no reason ANY dog can't turn out to be a good hunting companion. I'm not a dog snob. Only when people breed and sell dogs, put money in their pocket(whether $300 or $1,000) dogs and don't spend a fraction of it to make sure what you are selling will last and live long for the new owners family. It's not fair to make a penny off your backyard breeding and not be willing to spend $300 on the most basic of tests to help ensure the dog will live long for the new family.

To charge a dime for a dog with no testing is like selling a car with wood chips in the transmission to your friends family before they drive to disneyland.
« Last Edit: February 15, 2013, 11:39:48 AM by Happy Gilmore »
"Far better it is to dare mighty things, to win glorious triumphs, even though checked by failure, than to take rank with those poor spirits who neither enjoy much nor suffer much, because they live in the grey twilight that knows not victory nor defeat."
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Offline Happy Gilmore

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Re: Anybody ever get a dog from WALABS?
« Reply #23 on: February 15, 2013, 10:08:58 AM »
My cut and paste from Word didn't work. Bear with my edits.

This is from WALABS Website. My comments will be in bold italic and underlined- I hope this helps some folks understand why asking questions and getting with educated dog folks is important no matter what you are paying for a new dog.


WALABS offers the following guarantee to the original buyer only.

We guarantee the puppy to be free of PRA (progressive retinal atrophy) for up to 1 year of age. PRA usually onsets later in a dogs’ life, around 4 if I remember correctly.
If you suspect your puppy has PRA, it must be verified by a certified Canine Ophthalmologist with CERF. PRA is not detected via CERF. PRA is a genetic disease and is a DNA test. CERF is simply a viewing of the dogs retina looking for cataracts. Completely different. CERF should be done regularly before each breeding. Most good breeders have their dogs CERF'd once a year. We guarantee the puppy to be free of hip dysplasia and elbow dysplasia for up to 25 months of age. You can only do pre-lim hip (OFA) prior to 24 months of age.
If your veterinarian suspects a dysplasia problem, the x-ray showing this condition must be verified
by the OFA (Orthopedic Foundation for Animals). This x-ray must be done before 25 months of age. OFA cannot be tested until the dog is 24 months of age. Results can take a few months. There is NO WAY you can get an OFA back before this limit on his contract would expire. If any of these conditions are verified, We the breeder has the option of either refunding the entire purchase price,
or replacing the dog with a puppy of comparable breeding when available.
The first puppy will have to be returned to WALABS with its AKC paperwork.
In any case, all veterinary, diagnostic, return, and replacement costs will be the owner's responsibility. You spend all the money to do the tests to prove the problem. He’s banking that you will probably really like the dog, most people do after two years and won’t return it. He’ll look the other way at this point and say, return the dog. If you do return it, you’ll be on some distant waiting list. Also likely, you’ll get another pup from the same crap unhealthy breeding. You’ll get to do the same thing all over again.
These guarantees are dependent upon demonstration that the puppy has received adequate care and nutrition.
Anything that affects the development or well-being of the puppy, such as abuse, neglect,
trauma (i.e. jumping in the air for frisbees), or being used for breeding will void these guarantees. This statement is a completely open ended “catch all” to blame you for pretty much letting the dog be a dog. “oh, you play catch with your dog? Oh, you didn’t go to the vet three times a month?” They’ll say anything, make up anything to make the problem your fault.
The following puppies will NOT carry ANY kind of guarantee. Shipped puppies, puppies NOT bred through us. EA Rescue labs, I have no idea what this means. Are they getting dogs from the pound and re-selling them? Shipped puppies?? What does shipping have to do with hip dysplasia?

This is the type of disclaimer that when you read it, you don’t walk away, you run like hell!
« Last Edit: February 15, 2013, 10:16:59 AM by Happy Gilmore »
"Far better it is to dare mighty things, to win glorious triumphs, even though checked by failure, than to take rank with those poor spirits who neither enjoy much nor suffer much, because they live in the grey twilight that knows not victory nor defeat."
Theodore Roosevelt 1899

Offline Stilly bay

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Re: Anybody ever get a dog from WALABS?
« Reply #24 on: February 15, 2013, 01:32:25 PM »
great googley moogley.... :yike:
"Love the dogs before loving the hunt; love the hunt for the dogs." - Ben O. Williams

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Offline Happy Gilmore

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Re: Anybody ever get a dog from WALABS?
« Reply #25 on: February 15, 2013, 01:42:16 PM »
This was the second option after searching the kennel name.

http://www.yelp.com/biz/walabs-onalaska

"Far better it is to dare mighty things, to win glorious triumphs, even though checked by failure, than to take rank with those poor spirits who neither enjoy much nor suffer much, because they live in the grey twilight that knows not victory nor defeat."
Theodore Roosevelt 1899

Offline Stilly bay

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Re: Anybody ever get a dog from WALABS?
« Reply #26 on: February 15, 2013, 02:03:59 PM »
gotta love the pic of his kennels... yeeesh. nothing says cleanliness and health like wet moldy straw.

if all this isn't enough to pizz everyone off Im sure this WALABS guy -as bad as he is- isn't even close to the worst examples of breeders churning out puppies for uneducated would be dog owners to purchase.

if people were as picky about buying dogs as they were about cars, all these bogus breeders would soon dry up and go out of business and the world would be a better place for it.

"Love the dogs before loving the hunt; love the hunt for the dogs." - Ben O. Williams

“It is easy to forget that in the main we die only seven times more slowly than our dogs.”
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Offline h20hunter

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Re: Anybody ever get a dog from WALABS?
« Reply #27 on: February 15, 2013, 02:35:15 PM »
I don't know jack about dogs and breeding but alway learn from readind threads about it. I looked at his webite and you can tell it is a hack job.

Offline Scrappy

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Re: Anybody ever get a dog from WALABS?
« Reply #28 on: April 11, 2013, 11:54:18 AM »
 >:( YES! We got our pup 3 weeks ago and same thing. Our pup was 7 weeks old and only 5# he had massive round worms and eggs and also had Coccidia. He was one sick puppy. He is now doing much better after Meds and now weighs 9#10oz. This breeder states on his website that all puppies go to the vet for checks before going home with new owners. Absolute lie!! Only the very sick ones get to go to the vet so he can get a prescription to buy meds online..problem is a prescription is for the one and two pups he takes in not for all 40+ that were in the pen together. We have been constantly lied to about our pup and it's care. As soon as you complain he blocks you from his site. He is nothing but a puppy mill with numerous lies on his website page to suck people in and to think he is a reputable breeder. I have now heard from others that have gotten there puppy since we got ours and ALL are finding the same thing plus another rare parasite. Just SO sad this man has not been stopped.

Offline WRL

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Re: Anybody ever get a dog from WALABS?
« Reply #29 on: April 14, 2013, 06:28:25 PM »
I am sorry about your puppy. Its really unfortunate there are breeders out there like that.

Getting the word out does help and will cut down on these types of operations.

WRL

Offline Labs07

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Re: Anybody ever get a dog from WALABS?
« Reply #30 on: May 07, 2013, 03:32:39 PM »
That is too bad!  I got my Lab from Hightest Retrievers out of CA.  He is the best Lab I've owned!

Offline jwings

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Re: Anybody ever get a dog from WALABS?
« Reply #31 on: July 02, 2013, 09:10:13 AM »
I ran across this thread and had to enter my 2 cents. I have through the years 3 labs from Walabs kennel and Yes one had worms. but it was a easy cure and from what I can tell from sibling adopters the only one of the litter (It happens) My dogs were gives shots/vaccines/microchips and had a complete record and vet check. I saw this statement about small pens and that is false. walabs has 16 live cameras that can be viewed 24/7 The pens are cleaned daily you can watch this on line. The smallest pens are 10ft X 10ft and those are reserved for pregnant mamas. Walabs has yearly reunions with the adopting families, I have joined in on 4 of these.
My opinion You folks are bad mouthing the wrong breeder. Just look at his Face Book (walabs kennel) he has over 500 families that have 1 or more labs, From what I can see they are very happy with Walabs.

Offline curtmdavis

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Re: Anybody ever get a dog from WALABS?
« Reply #32 on: July 02, 2013, 11:41:33 AM »
  :twocents:   Read a couple of bad raps about the outfit, but took those with a grain of salt, and got our dog from them back in May, weighing around 6-7 lbs.  He’s a healthy and energetic 14 weeks old now. Took him to the vet when we got him home, had him wormed and got his shots all dialed in. Last night when we took him  in for his next visit, he scaled at 24 pounds and healthy as could be had, not sure what else to ask for.

 Most of what I've read, was, "My dog came home with worms and such." Now granted, I've never been to a breeder where my dog cost a month’s mortgage, and came with a contract as long as King James's Bible, but I have always come to expect, that the dog has worms, and most likely some sort of parasitic alien in its belly.  :o  Always cleared up with their first trip to the vet and just always thought that's the way things were. :dunno:

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Re: Anybody ever get a dog from WALABS?
« Reply #33 on: July 02, 2013, 11:51:03 AM »
I don't really know anything about WALABS but I have been considering a new pup in the next 6 months or so.  I went to his website a couple weeks ago and as soon as I saw the advertisement for his "Tea Cup Labs" I about threw up and vowed to never visit the site again (on purpose anyway).

All I have to say is Ireland Farms. If you want a quality dog and a Quality Breeder. :twocents:
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Re: Anybody ever get a dog from WALABS?
« Reply #34 on: July 02, 2013, 12:11:31 PM »
thread forwarded to King 5 Investigators, Get Jesse, and Komo Problem solvers

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Re: Anybody ever get a dog from WALABS?
« Reply #35 on: July 02, 2013, 12:33:22 PM »
My cut and paste from Word didn't work. Bear with my edits.

This is from WALABS Website. My comments will be in bold italic and underlined- I hope this helps some folks understand why asking questions and getting with educated dog folks is important no matter what you are paying for a new dog.


WALABS offers the following guarantee to the original buyer only.

We guarantee the puppy to be free of PRA (progressive retinal atrophy) for up to 1 year of age. PRA usually onsets later in a dogs’ life, around 4 if I remember correctly.
If you suspect your puppy has PRA, it must be verified by a certified Canine Ophthalmologist with CERF. PRA is not detected via CERF. PRA is a genetic disease and is a DNA test. CERF is simply a viewing of the dogs retina looking for cataracts. Completely different. CERF should be done regularly before each breeding. Most good breeders have their dogs CERF'd once a year. We guarantee the puppy to be free of hip dysplasia and elbow dysplasia for up to 25 months of age. You can only do pre-lim hip (OFA) prior to 24 months of age.
If your veterinarian suspects a dysplasia problem, the x-ray showing this condition must be verified
by the OFA (Orthopedic Foundation for Animals). This x-ray must be done before 25 months of age. OFA cannot be tested until the dog is 24 months of age. Results can take a few months. There is NO WAY you can get an OFA back before this limit on his contract would expire. If any of these conditions are verified, We the breeder has the option of either refunding the entire purchase price,
or replacing the dog with a puppy of comparable breeding when available.
The first puppy will have to be returned to WALABS with its AKC paperwork.
In any case, all veterinary, diagnostic, return, and replacement costs will be the owner's responsibility. You spend all the money to do the tests to prove the problem. He’s banking that you will probably really like the dog, most people do after two years and won’t return it. He’ll look the other way at this point and say, return the dog. If you do return it, you’ll be on some distant waiting list. Also likely, you’ll get another pup from the same crap unhealthy breeding. You’ll get to do the same thing all over again.
These guarantees are dependent upon demonstration that the puppy has received adequate care and nutrition.
Anything that affects the development or well-being of the puppy, such as abuse, neglect,
trauma (i.e. jumping in the air for frisbees), or being used for breeding will void these guarantees. This statement is a completely open ended “catch all” to blame you for pretty much letting the dog be a dog. “oh, you play catch with your dog? Oh, you didn’t go to the vet three times a month?” They’ll say anything, make up anything to make the problem your fault.
The following puppies will NOT carry ANY kind of guarantee. Shipped puppies, puppies NOT bred through us. EA Rescue labs, I have no idea what this means. Are they getting dogs from the pound and re-selling them? Shipped puppies?? What does shipping have to do with hip dysplasia?

This is the type of disclaimer that when you read it, you don’t walk away, you run like hell!


 
if you take walabs out of the picture, I think this portion of the thread needs to become a sticky so that all future puppy buyers on this forum can have some food for thought before they pick a kennel and sign a puppy contract. For a couple paragraphs it speaks volumes :twocents:
"Love the dogs before loving the hunt; love the hunt for the dogs." - Ben O. Williams

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Offline Happy Gilmore

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Re: Anybody ever get a dog from WALABS?
« Reply #36 on: July 03, 2013, 05:34:48 AM »
Not uncommon for a pup to have worms. It is uncommon for someone to have bred enough pups to have 500 families and they don't understand the tests they are mentioning in their guarantee.
"Far better it is to dare mighty things, to win glorious triumphs, even though checked by failure, than to take rank with those poor spirits who neither enjoy much nor suffer much, because they live in the grey twilight that knows not victory nor defeat."
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Re: Anybody ever get a dog from WALABS?
« Reply #37 on: July 03, 2013, 06:31:31 AM »
Here is a pretty good start to look for a pup. http://www.retrievertraining.net/forums/forumdisplay.php?31-Classifieds-Lab-Puppies

When it comes to Labs I say spend the money! Buy from either reputable breeders or at least from great bloodlines and people who look and sound legit. Most people are not in the Field Trial and Hunt Test game and not running in those circles might not understand or know about what good dogs are. They also might not know how to go about getting a good dog from a good breeding/breeder. When you see AFC, FC, MH, QAA, NFC, NAFC, things like that in the lines you are stacking the deck in your favor. This shows that the lines have been producing good smart dogs. 

You did good bringing this to attention. Have you thought to contact AKC and inform them of your experience?? If he is registering his litters and they are being mistreated AKC can do something about that.
« Last Edit: July 03, 2013, 06:49:41 AM by CoryTDF »
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Re: Anybody ever get a dog from WALABS?
« Reply #38 on: July 03, 2013, 06:38:35 AM »
Very interesting 2 first time posts from 2 people on this thread both praising walabs.  One even pms everyone?  I said nothing derogatory don't know why got pm. :dunno: Ironic.
MAGA!  Again..

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Re: Anybody ever get a dog from WALABS?
« Reply #39 on: July 03, 2013, 09:32:55 AM »
It is uncommon for someone to have bred enough pups to have 500 families and they don't understand the tests they are mentioning in their guarantee.

Or maybe they understand the tests perfectly and are counting that potential buyers are the ones who can't figure it out.
Im sorry but that puppy contract is a scam.
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Offline Happy Gilmore

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Re: Anybody ever get a dog from WALABS?
« Reply #40 on: July 03, 2013, 10:42:48 PM »
I just hope they read this and try to better understand breeding healthy pups. Contacting the akc will do nothing. The akc is not a breed police. The akc is simply a breed registry and has nothing to do with monitoring health standards. Buying an akc registered dog means Nothing! Buying a dog from a breeder who knows and understands what health testing means and the importance of it means everything. Many fine dogs who have excellent breeding and health clearances are never registered. Testing parents before breeding is much more important than any akc pedigree. With that being said, those who spend a little extra making sure the parents are sound animals before breeding will almost always be those whom properly register the dogs. It isn't about being snooty or high brow, it's about loving animals and wanting the breeds to live long healthy lives and allow the owners to enjoy their companions for the longest time possible
"Far better it is to dare mighty things, to win glorious triumphs, even though checked by failure, than to take rank with those poor spirits who neither enjoy much nor suffer much, because they live in the grey twilight that knows not victory nor defeat."
Theodore Roosevelt 1899

Offline Don Fischer

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Re: Anybody ever get a dog from WALABS?
« Reply #41 on: July 04, 2013, 01:29:22 PM »
First time at a puppy farm it sounds. Doesn't mean the dogs they sell are no good but could be wormy like your's was. That's probably why she appeared sick and thin, worms! There's a puppy farm not far from here and I visited it one time. Sicking at best. Dog's stuck in really small kennels all over the place. This one had a bunch on different toy breeds. Building near the house was full of small cages of pregnate dog's, back room in the house the same and more out in the barn. Was the breeding bad? Shoot I don't know but what a sorry way for a dog to spend it's life. And breeding to improve the breed is not a goal. It's breeding to improve income.

My guess is you'll have a good dog that you can enjoy, might even be a good retrieving dog. But the environment of a puppy farm is putrid!
There's a reason I like dog's more than people

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Re: Anybody ever get a dog from WALABS?
« Reply #42 on: July 04, 2013, 02:22:36 PM »


I just hope they read this and try to better understand breeding healthy pups. Contacting the akc will do nothing. The akc is not a breed police. The akc is simply a breed registry and has nothing to do with monitoring health standards. Buying an akc registered dog means Nothing! Buying a dog from a breeder who knows and understands what health testing means and the importance of it means everything. Many fine dogs who have excellent breeding and health clearances are never registered. Testing parents before breeding is much more important than any akc pedigree. With that being said, those who spend a little extra making sure the parents are sound animals before breeding will almost always be those whom properly register the dogs. It isn't about being snooty or high brow, it's about loving animals and wanting the breeds to live long healthy lives and allow the owners to enjoy their companions for the longest time possible
:yeah:

the environment of a puppy farm is putrid!

All the more reason to promote responsible breeders and discourage people from supporting bad breeders, and puppy mills.

If everyone put as much thought into buying a new dog as they did a new car we would soon see all these operations dry up.

How many people just pick a brand new car off the lot because they like the color and brand and take the salesman's word on every thing else? Damn few, most halfway intelligent people do their research, talk to other people that had same car, and even find out if that model or even the car lot is responsible for any lemons in the past.

But its perfectly acceptable to just grab the first puppy that comes along just because you like the breed, like the color, and take the breeder at his word without talking to anyone else about it or doing a lick of research? Granted dogs don't cost as much, but if your a halfway decent person the emotional investment in dog is at least tenfold that of a car.
"Love the dogs before loving the hunt; love the hunt for the dogs." - Ben O. Williams

“It is easy to forget that in the main we die only seven times more slowly than our dogs.”
― Jim Harrison

Offline Birdguy

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Re: Anybody ever get a dog from WALABS?
« Reply #43 on: July 04, 2013, 04:32:15 PM »
Granted dogs don't cost as much, but if your a halfway decent person the emotional investment in dog is at least tenfold that of a car.

I do not know I have bought some pretty cheap cars  :chuckle: :chuckle: :chuckle:

All kidding aside, a dog is an investment both financial and emotional, it should be considered one of the family and as such will have plenty of bills that go along with it. Just like a child, Dr. visits, accidents, wellness checks, school, food, housing...... the list goes on and on. Putting a little effort and research into your investment will make it more enjoyable when you get the right one and hopefully you have great times for a long with the fewest issues possible

Offline gonehunting

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Re: Anybody ever get a dog from WALABS?
« Reply #44 on: October 04, 2013, 08:06:57 AM »
I am appauled by seeing this post and thread about Walabs Kennel. I purchased my fox red from walabs in dec 2011, we drove from Sacramento CA to get him. He has always been very healthy. Yes he had worms... so what?? a good vet will tell you that it is NORMAL, a couple of deworming once they are away from the litter mates and problem solved..... Jim Young of Walabs, loves his dogs and puppies and takes care of them very well; he is always here to answer questions.  My dog Niner is a great family dog and a hunter. He hunts ducks very well, with barely any training.  Walabs Kennel is no puppy mill.. That's non sense. Dogs have large pens, everything can be viewed on the cameras. I'm getting my second walab next weekend. I've seen him grow up on the cameras for past 7 weeks.  Check out Facebook and the other families with more than 1 lab... Plus it's not internet sales... Yes he has a website, who doesn't? it's 2013.  Bad mouthing is easy. but no one realizes the impact you are having on people by slandering..... I stand by WALABS Kennel at 200% and recommend his labs to anyone. Specially Hunters.

Offline Happy Gilmore

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Re: Anybody ever get a dog from WALABS?
« Reply #45 on: October 04, 2013, 08:42:27 AM »
My cut and paste from Word didn't work. Bear with my edits.

This is from WALABS Website. My comments will be in bold italic and underlined- I hope this helps some folks understand why asking questions and getting with educated dog folks is important no matter what you are paying for a new dog.


WALABS offers the following guarantee to the original buyer only.

We guarantee the puppy to be free of PRA (progressive retinal atrophy) for up to 1 year of age. PRA usually onsets later in a dogs’ life, around 4 if I remember correctly.
If you suspect your puppy has PRA, it must be verified by a certified Canine Ophthalmologist with CERF. PRA is not detected via CERF. PRA is a genetic disease and is a DNA test. CERF is simply a viewing of the dogs retina looking for cataracts. Completely different. CERF should be done regularly before each breeding. Most good breeders have their dogs CERF'd once a year. We guarantee the puppy to be free of hip dysplasia and elbow dysplasia for up to 25 months of age. You can only do pre-lim hip (OFA) prior to 24 months of age.
If your veterinarian suspects a dysplasia problem, the x-ray showing this condition must be verified
by the OFA (Orthopedic Foundation for Animals). This x-ray must be done before 25 months of age. OFA cannot be tested until the dog is 24 months of age. Results can take a few months. There is NO WAY you can get an OFA back before this limit on his contract would expire. If any of these conditions are verified, We the breeder has the option of either refunding the entire purchase price,
or replacing the dog with a puppy of comparable breeding when available.
The first puppy will have to be returned to WALABS with its AKC paperwork.
In any case, all veterinary, diagnostic, return, and replacement costs will be the owner's responsibility. You spend all the money to do the tests to prove the problem. He’s banking that you will probably really like the dog, most people do after two years and won’t return it. He’ll look the other way at this point and say, return the dog. If you do return it, you’ll be on some distant waiting list. Also likely, you’ll get another pup from the same crap unhealthy breeding. You’ll get to do the same thing all over again.
These guarantees are dependent upon demonstration that the puppy has received adequate care and nutrition.
Anything that affects the development or well-being of the puppy, such as abuse, neglect,
trauma (i.e. jumping in the air for frisbees), or being used for breeding will void these guarantees. This statement is a completely open ended “catch all” to blame you for pretty much letting the dog be a dog. “oh, you play catch with your dog? Oh, you didn’t go to the vet three times a month?” They’ll say anything, make up anything to make the problem your fault.
The following puppies will NOT carry ANY kind of guarantee. Shipped puppies, puppies NOT bred through us. EA Rescue labs, I have no idea what this means. Are they getting dogs from the pound and re-selling them? Shipped puppies?? What does shipping have to do with hip dysplasia?

This is the type of disclaimer that when you read it, you don’t walk away, you run like hell!


I'm worried about Jim's interpretation of how genetic testing works and the promises made in his guarantee. I bolded and highlighted my comments. Hopefully, he's learned something and has done some research on the differences between PRA, CERF and OFA timelines. This taken straight off his website shows a serious lack of comprehension and understanding of health testing. As far as miniature labs? If I ever see anyone intentionally breeding dwarf labs, I'll call them an idiot to their face. Dwarfism(not miniature) is a serious genetic defect and should never be promoted. Many will argue breeding two chocolate dilute genes to produce a silver is also a bad practice although, I'm not a study on the subject so, I'll refrain from commenting about "designer breeds" such as silver labs and Labradoodle mixes sold for big bucks because of trendiness.
« Last Edit: October 04, 2013, 09:52:45 AM by Happy Gilmore »
"Far better it is to dare mighty things, to win glorious triumphs, even though checked by failure, than to take rank with those poor spirits who neither enjoy much nor suffer much, because they live in the grey twilight that knows not victory nor defeat."
Theodore Roosevelt 1899

Offline AspenBud

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Re: Anybody ever get a dog from WALABS?
« Reply #46 on: October 04, 2013, 11:14:30 AM »
My cut and paste from Word didn't work. Bear with my edits.

This is from WALABS Website. My comments will be in bold italic and underlined- I hope this helps some folks understand why asking questions and getting with educated dog folks is important no matter what you are paying for a new dog.


WALABS offers the following guarantee to the original buyer only.

We guarantee the puppy to be free of PRA (progressive retinal atrophy) for up to 1 year of age. PRA usually onsets later in a dogs’ life, around 4 if I remember correctly.
If you suspect your puppy has PRA, it must be verified by a certified Canine Ophthalmologist with CERF. PRA is not detected via CERF. PRA is a genetic disease and is a DNA test. CERF is simply a viewing of the dogs retina looking for cataracts. Completely different. CERF should be done regularly before each breeding. Most good breeders have their dogs CERF'd once a year. We guarantee the puppy to be free of hip dysplasia and elbow dysplasia for up to 25 months of age. You can only do pre-lim hip (OFA) prior to 24 months of age.
If your veterinarian suspects a dysplasia problem, the x-ray showing this condition must be verified
by the OFA (Orthopedic Foundation for Animals). This x-ray must be done before 25 months of age. OFA cannot be tested until the dog is 24 months of age. Results can take a few months. There is NO WAY you can get an OFA back before this limit on his contract would expire. If any of these conditions are verified, We the breeder has the option of either refunding the entire purchase price,
or replacing the dog with a puppy of comparable breeding when available.
The first puppy will have to be returned to WALABS with its AKC paperwork.
In any case, all veterinary, diagnostic, return, and replacement costs will be the owner's responsibility. You spend all the money to do the tests to prove the problem. He’s banking that you will probably really like the dog, most people do after two years and won’t return it. He’ll look the other way at this point and say, return the dog. If you do return it, you’ll be on some distant waiting list. Also likely, you’ll get another pup from the same crap unhealthy breeding. You’ll get to do the same thing all over again.
These guarantees are dependent upon demonstration that the puppy has received adequate care and nutrition.
Anything that affects the development or well-being of the puppy, such as abuse, neglect,
trauma (i.e. jumping in the air for frisbees), or being used for breeding will void these guarantees. This statement is a completely open ended “catch all” to blame you for pretty much letting the dog be a dog. “oh, you play catch with your dog? Oh, you didn’t go to the vet three times a month?” They’ll say anything, make up anything to make the problem your fault.
The following puppies will NOT carry ANY kind of guarantee. Shipped puppies, puppies NOT bred through us. EA Rescue labs, I have no idea what this means. Are they getting dogs from the pound and re-selling them? Shipped puppies?? What does shipping have to do with hip dysplasia?

This is the type of disclaimer that when you read it, you don’t walk away, you run like hell!


I'm worried about Jim's interpretation of how genetic testing works and the promises made in his guarantee. I bolded and highlighted my comments. Hopefully, he's learned something and has done some research on the differences between PRA, CERF and OFA timelines. This taken straight off his website shows a serious lack of comprehension and understanding of health testing. As far as miniature labs? If I ever see anyone intentionally breeding dwarf labs, I'll call them an idiot to their face. Dwarfism(not miniature) is a serious genetic defect and should never be promoted. Many will argue breeding two chocolate dilute genes to produce a silver is also a bad practice although, I'm not a study on the subject so, I'll refrain from commenting about "designer breeds" such as silver labs and Labradoodle mixes sold for big bucks because of trendiness.

 :yeah:

Offline REHJWA

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Re: Anybody ever get a dog from WALABS?
« Reply #47 on: February 12, 2014, 09:38:49 PM »
I am appauled by seeing this post and thread about Walabs Kennel. I purchased my fox red from walabs in dec 2011, we drove from Sacramento CA to get him. He has always been very healthy. Yes he had worms... so what?? a good vet will tell you that it is NORMAL, a couple of deworming once they are away from the litter mates and problem solved..... Jim Young of Walabs, loves his dogs and puppies and takes care of them very well; he is always here to answer questions.  My dog Niner is a great family dog and a hunter. He hunts ducks very well, with barely any training.  Walabs Kennel is no puppy mill.. That's non sense. Dogs have large pens, everything can be viewed on the cameras. I'm getting my second walab next weekend. I've seen him grow up on the cameras for past 7 weeks.  Check out Facebook and the other families with more than 1 lab... Plus it's not internet sales... Yes he has a website, who doesn't? it's 2013.  Bad mouthing is easy. but no one realizes the impact you are having on people by slandering..... I stand by WALABS Kennel at 200% and recommend his labs to anyone. Specially Hunters.
Yes! We do understand the impact sharing information has  :tup: :tup: and if it impacts a business  :'( :'( then hopefully they will change their business practices to benefit the animals they are profiting from!! :dunno:

Offline Happy Gilmore

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Re: Anybody ever get a dog from WALABS?
« Reply #48 on: February 13, 2014, 01:10:00 AM »
There were doctors who sold medicine out of wagons in towns throughout the west with great success during the gold rush.
"Far better it is to dare mighty things, to win glorious triumphs, even though checked by failure, than to take rank with those poor spirits who neither enjoy much nor suffer much, because they live in the grey twilight that knows not victory nor defeat."
Theodore Roosevelt 1899

 


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