Creating Scouting Maps/Low Budget

[pope]

I'm getting to know the area I'm scouting well enough and I want to create maps on my computer which I can mark with trails, rubs, beds, info on animals observed, etc. What I've come up with is screen-capturing google-map images and pasting them into a program like Microsoft Paint (I'm sure Photoshop or Illustrator would work too). Is there a better way w/o spending money on digital topo maps? I thought what would be really cool is to insert icons into the map which would be hot-linked to files containing detailed notes (deer: two does, 7 p.m., SW wind, feeding on .....you get the idea), but I haven't figured that part out. Any ideas? Thanks in advance.

[Smossy]

I'm getting to know the area I'm scouting well enough and I want to create maps on my computer which I can mark with trails, rubs, beds, info on animals observed, etc. What I've come up with is screen-capturing google-map images and pasting them into a program like Microsoft Paint (I'm sure Photoshop or Illustrator would work too). Is there a better way w/o spending money on digital topo maps? I thought what would be really cool is to insert icons into the map which would be hot-linked to files containing detailed notes (deer: two does, 7 p.m., SW wind, feeding on .....you get the idea), but I haven't figured that part out. Any ideas? Thanks in advance.

I print directly off  the GoHunt maps on WDFW website. I "think" there Is a better program out there for doing specifically what your thinking, Radsav would be the man to ask as I think we have talked about it before. Let me check my messages. I may still have the info.


*Edit*
Cant find anything. Google Maps / Gohunt Maps would be your best bet probably, Then just modify them by hand even. Using colored pens and what not. Or use simple windows paint or w'e its called. Seems to work for me, Its what I do for hikes. Then I have a waterproof map case thats see-through that I place my hike maps into so I can refer to them in any weather.

Do you know how to use a map compass? If not I very very highly recommend learning, It could take you as little as a few hours or a single day. Dont rely 100% on a gps.

[pope]

I started going in the hills before GPS and haven't really found a use for it. I'm pretty comfortable with map and compass (which will work in heavy timber where GPS may not).

[Alan K]

I use a Garmin Rino 655t GPS and use it regularly to track where I walk, snap photos of rubs, beds, wallows, etc.  Never had any problem with reception, and it's seen the deepest holes the Willapa Hills have to offer, as well as the back country of the Salmon River in Idaho.  I think the technology has come a long ways since the old unreliable reception days.    Sure it's only accurate to like 15-20 feet reliably, but that's plenty good for me. A lot closer to an exact position than I could place myself with a paper map, compass, and pacing.

With this GPS all the routes I walk, photos I take, as well as waypoints etc., are stored and then loaded up on my computer when I get home. You can also trace routes you want to walk, as well as mark points of interest in Google Earth and load them onto the GPS for your next trip into the field. Don't get me wrong, there is still a place for the old compass and paper map, but GPS is plenty accurate for me for hunting type applications.

Attached is an example of the maps that are produced, granted it's just a snippet.

[Smossy]

I use a Garmin 655t GPS and use it regularly to track where I walk, snap photos of rubs, beds, wallows, etc.  Never had any problem with reception, and it's seen the deepest holes the Willapa Hills have to offer, as well as the back country of the Salmon River in Idaho.  I think the technology has come a long ways since the old unreliable reception days.    Sure it's only accurate to like 15-20 feet reliably, but that's plenty good for me. A lot closer to an exact position than I could place myself with a paper map, compass, and pacing.

With this GPS all the routes I walk, photos I take, as well as waypoints etc., are stored and then loaded up on my computer when I get home. You can also trace routes you want to walk, as well as mark points of interest in Google Earth and load them onto the GPS for your next trip into the field. Don't get me wrong, there is still a place for the old compass and paper map, but GPS is plenty accurate for me for hunting type applications.

Attached is an example of the maps that are produced, granted it's just a snippet.

Sure, If you want to spend hundreds of hundreds of dollers that gps is what? $400-500 Alot of people, Including myself dont have money for high end pieces of equipment like that, When knowledge of following a map with a compess is free. Nothing is failproof obviously, What if you lose your map, but Very unlikely..  Then what happens when your battery runs out on your gps? Hope you know how to use a compass lol. Just saying. I can follow a map/compass and be within a pretty good distance of where I want to do, Its all about following bearings. Lensatic compass is virtually fail-proof.

[Alan K]

Then what happens when your battery runs out on your gps? Hope you know how to use a compass lol. Just saying. I can follow a map/compass and be within a pretty good distance of where I want to do, Its all about following bearings. Lensatic compass is virtually fail-proof.

Like I say, there's no doubt there's a place for a hand compass.  I use them every day, but only because my older boss doesn't trust them lol.  And when my batteries die, I put more batteries in it. . . I have a rechargeable battery, but also bought the standard battery pack to bring along for overnight/extended trips. Bring an 8 pack of lithium AA's and I'm good for a LONG time, never had to replace them more than twice during a trip anyways. 

Maybe I sink more $$ into the outdoors than others, but when you think about the price of fuel, a rifle, a bow, a set of camo, boots, etc. etc. the price of a GPS is really not that much.  Cut a few long distance scouting trips, use your old set of camo one more year, and cut a couple cases of beer out of the budget and you've got one. 

[pope]

AlanK, thanks for taking time to respond. That looks pretty slick, and the map you attached is pretty much what I have in mind. Are the photo thumbs clickable (linked to the photo files so they will expand)? Can you also create clickable links for text and icons where field notes would open in a reduced window? I have nothing against GPS and I'm sure I'll end up getting a unit (although $500 is steep when I'm trying to raise a family on one income). But I'm curious about creative ways people have fabricated scouting maps using tools already available with standard software.

[Alan K]

AlanK, thanks for taking time to respond. That looks pretty slick, and the map you attached is pretty much what I have in mind. Are the photo thumbs clickable (linked to the photo files so they will expand)? Can you also create clickable links for text and icons where field notes would open in a reduced window? I have nothing against GPS and I'm sure I'll end up getting a unit (although $500 is steep when I'm trying to raise a family on one income). But I'm curious about creative ways people have fabricated scouting maps using tools already available with standard software.

The screen on the Rino is pretty small, but both the Oregon unit and especially the Montana unit have larger screens.  On all of these you can tap your photo on the map and pull it up the size of the screen.  Once back home you can pull the pictures up full size.  The camera on mine is 5 megapixels, so the photos aren't huge but clear enough.  The cool thing about having the camera built in is how it's stamped with the coordinates and loaded into the map.

You can get the Oregon and Montana units cheaper than the Rino, the bonus to the Rino is if you have hunting partners with them, they work as handheld radios.  You can get cheaper versions without the cameras built in and just take a waypoint at each place you take a photo with your normal camera or camera phone.

As far as keeping field notes, I'd suggest keeping a Rite in the Rain notebook with you.  I use Rite in the Rain for business, and used to carry one of these to record my hunting notes:

http://www.riteintherain.com/inventoryD.asp?item_no=350F&CatId={EF4A95AD-8E51-40CB-B2B0-B9F97681F1B9}

They work great, and are both solid and durable. Here on the west side of the mountains when you're often out in the weather they're really all you can write on in the field without your paper going to heck.  You could easily record your coordinates or waypoint number along with corresponding notes in your notebook and later record them on the computer.  I've never tried to write notes directly on the GPS, and though it may be possible, I don't think it'd be much fun trying to type into a touch screen GPS.

[BowForElk]

My dad got a Montana and he loves it. I was looking at refurbished Oregon units that were about $200 bucks on eBay which I though was very reasonable for that unit

[pope]

Exactly! I want to put together a map like Tom Ryle's (http://www.outdoorblog.net/pnwbowhunting/files/2011/04/Deer-Mapping-copy.jpg).

I've attended two of his seminars on hunting blacktail deer but I didn't ask him about what software he used to generate his maps.

[BowForElk]

That's a pretty sweet map. I guess my only thought would be is if you put in all the time and figured out every rub and trail  and bedding feeding area why do you need the map? 

I mean I've got an area that I'm scouting and got 4 cameras in. And it's probably all of 15 acres and I've got it almost mapped out in my head.   

I guess if you're workin an area that's bigger you would need it?

Anybody got insight I'm not seein?

[RadSav]

That's a pretty sweet map. I guess my only thought would be is if you put in all the time and figured out every rub and trail  and bedding feeding area why do you need the map? 

I mean I've got an area that I'm scouting and got 4 cameras in. And it's probably all of 15 acres and I've got it almost mapped out in my head.   

I guess if you're workin an area that's bigger you would need it?

Anybody got insight I'm not seein?

If you have yourself limited down to 15 acres you really are not scouting.  Sounds like you've already done that.  You're just collecting data for best stand locations. And getting to know your deer.

When we were guiding our scouting area was about 120 square miles.  We needed to know where our highest concentrations were, where our most huntable land was, where we were seeing the right quality animals Aug, Sept and Oct, if there were trends year to year between times of no hunting pressure and times of extreme hunting pressure, trends in time of food source changes, (since bear guiding) what bait worked best at each location, times that bait would change from sweets to protein etc, etc.  After a while the numbers would really start to jump off the page.  Wind blowing from X location one day = stand location "A", wind from Y location = stand location "B".  Harvested bear on stand "A" move next hunters to stand location "C" 50 miles away.

Though I did not guide deer hunters I would collect that data for myself at the same time.  And success was extremely high.  I agree if I had 100 acres of good land to hunt I'd probably forgotton about mapping.  But hunting public land you just can not regularly expect to have 15 acres all to yourself.  You need to have options.  Good scouting maps help you weed through all the areas you've scouted to give yourself a road map to the next best option. 

Possibly one of the best uses of scouting maps is to see trends of movement.  Back when we could actually hunt bulls on the east side each year CL and I did a lot of scouting the Manastash area.  We had narrowed our hunting areas down to about a half dozen options.  Opening day we bounced from option to option just to call in other hunters.  By the second day you couldn't buy a glimpse of an elk.  We laid our scouting map out during a lunch break and asked ourselves, "Where have all these elk gone?  Where are all of these hunters coming from?"  We isolated a steep drainage with no road access and no easy walking access.  There was a thin strip of level ground down along a creek bottom about a mile in.  And a few benches easily capable of holding a nice herd of elk.  We had never scouted that exact area, but had scouted most of the areas around it.  Because of our detailed scouting maps there was no doubt at all where these elk had gone!  For the next three years we had some of the best elk hunting of our lives.  In an area we had all to ourselves while surrounded by constant vehicle travel.  A lot of the meat didn't hit the tailgate of the truck until 3 or 4 in the morning after long nights of humping out of what we called "The Hell Hole"  But it was worth every ounce of sweat until they took away our bull hunting.

Had it not been for good maps and good scouting we would probably have driven right past that elk spot like all the rest.  Had it not been for good maps and good scouting my guide business would not have experienced such success.  And had it not been for good maps and good scouting I would definitely not have as many horns on my wall and endless stories of the one(s) that got away.

I would love to have 15 or 100 acres of eternal animal producing land all to myself.  But like so many others I do not.  Plus I tend to get the itch from year to year to change things up.  Especially with the multiseason tag.  Last year was archery blacktail early, rifle muledeer early, whitetail late rifle and back to blacktail where I finally pulled the trigger on my buck.  That was a fun year!  Mostly because we saw a little bit of everything in our wonderful multiseason deer adventure!

[billythekidrock]

I'm getting to know the area I'm scouting well enough and I want to create maps on my computer which I can mark with trails, rubs, beds, info on animals observed, etc. What I've come up with is screen-capturing google-map images and pasting them into a program like Microsoft Paint (I'm sure Photoshop or Illustrator would work too). Is there a better way w/o spending money on digital topo maps? I thought what would be really cool is to insert icons into the map which would be hot-linked to files containing detailed notes (deer: two does, 7 p.m., SW wind, feeding on .....you get the idea), but I haven't figured that part out. Any ideas? Thanks in advance.

Google Earth will do everything you are wanting to do.
GMap4 http://www.mappingsupport.com/p/gmap4.html will also do what you are looking for.
Just be aware that Google Earth does not always have the most current aerials and note that the photo dates are often not correct as well. You can usually find the most current aerials on the county's assessor site.

[BowForElk]

Aw okay I feel you Rad. That makes sense my little hunting spot isnt even secret it just doesn't seem to have very much pressure and other hunters don't go off the trail or the logging road. But it's getting me all excited cause you can't walk 30 yrds in any direction without seeing a different rub. I've found probably 25 so far a few elk rubs and a herd of elk about 10 or so that hang out too. Hopefully it's gonna be a good year.


Side note. Gmap4 is pretty sweet it's very easy to use and navigate through. For me I can't find stuff with the topo so I switch to aerial images to get to where I want the switch back. Pretty sweet program

[pope]

Guys, I sure appreciate your responses and help. Billthekidrock....in what little down-time I had today, I read a bunch of info about gmap4 and clicked through the examples. The high-res topos are great and I found the aerial images are more current than Google maps. Maybe I'm missing something but it seems the only way to mark trails is to use GPS data stored on a website? I didn't find a way to draw trails manually...maybe I'm missing something.

Also, the maps you create are not saved on your PC but are saved within the gmap4 website. Are the maps you create private/secure? I know you can share them by sharing the map's URL, but are they otherwise private?

Sundance, thanks for offering to contact Tom Ryle. I'm a big fan of the deer pages on his blog and have made a couple of special trips to hear his presentations.