done

[stevemiller]

got what i wanted thanks

[jay.sharkbait]

I used varget and shot 69 and 77 grain matchkings. I used commercial .223 brass and full length sized.

I also ignored the internet drama queens..

[szairborne]

I reload for mine in 6.8 spc. Never had any problems. Just make sure you measure and trim your cases, they will stick if not correctly sized. Only other issue is OAL for putting rounds into mags.

Shayne

[h20hunter]

Agreed on varget...get a case gauge and check them.

[Hilltop123]

For autoloaders, full-length size everytime.............IMHO

[Hilltop123]

You have an AR, but not a autoloader (semi-auto)?

[jay.sharkbait]

I would avoid any brass that has been fired in a beltfed machine gun FYI. You can re-size using a small base sizing die, but it's a pain and removing the crimp isn't fun either.

I always full length sized for the auto loaders. Neck sizing the  just wasn't as reliable for me.

[stevemiller]

Ok thanks for the heads up. 

[6.8mmARHunter]

I reload for mine in 6.8 spc. Never had any problems. Just make sure you measure and trim your cases, they will stick if not correctly sized. Only other issue is OAL for putting rounds into mags.

Shayne

+1 

A couple of addition things to consider:

1. Some use a bullet with a cannular and crimp the bullet (to avoid setback).
2. Some also use small base dies (resizes MORE to facilitate smoother autoloading).

I'm not sure if you wouldn't be wasting your time. Some swear by it, some say it's a waste of time.


sam

[Heredoggydoggy]

The main thing I've found with .223 cases is to trim them constantly.  I've never seen cases "grow" as much as .223/5.56 cases do.  I've gotten into the habit of trimming all my cases, because some are mine, and some I've picked up.  Some guys get a special Swager to remove the primer pocket crimp in some cases.  Me, I just use a countersink bit in my cordless drill to remove the crimp.  A quick buzz and it's done.  I used to think I was being an animal doing this, but I looked at some of the Black Hills reloads, and some of them are chamfered so deeply I don't know how the primer stays in!  I've always full-length resized my AR brass.  .223 cases are so plentiful that it doesn't really matter to me if the case life is shorter.  I always find more than I lose anyway.  I use Ramshot Xterminator for bullets up to 55 grain, and Tac for heavier bullets.  That IMR 8208 XBR might be good too, but I've not tried it in my .223s.  In my 20 LBC and 6mmX6.8 SPC it's great!  I've got to get on the IMR (Hodgedon) site and get the latest load data for it.  There's more now than there was when it was newly reintroduced.  When I started reloading for my .17 Fireball, all the data said that IMR 4198 was the powder that gave the best accuracy in that round, and after trying several powders, I found that they were right!

[jay.sharkbait]

ALLRIGHT STOP!

NOBODY MOVE!.........What is 6mmx6.8?  Who? and are reamers available?

The main thing I've found with .223 cases is to trim them constantly.  I've never seen cases "grow" as much as .223/5.56 cases do.  I've gotten into the habit of trimming all my cases, because some are mine, and some I've picked up.  Some guys get a special Swager to remove the primer pocket crimp in some cases.  Me, I just use a countersink bit in my cordless drill to remove the crimp.  A quick buzz and it's done.  I used to think I was being an animal doing this, but I looked at some of the Black Hills reloads, and some of them are chamfered so deeply I don't know how the primer stays in!  I've always full-length resized my AR brass.  .223 cases are so plentiful that it doesn't really matter to me if the case life is shorter.  I always find more than I lose anyway.  I use Ramshot Xterminator for bullets up to 55 grain, and Tac for heavier bullets.  That IMR 8208 XBR might be good too, but I've not tried it in my .223s.  In my 20 LBC and 6mmX6.8 SPC it's great!  I've got to get on the IMR (Hodgedon) site and get the latest load data for it.  There's more now than there was when it was newly reintroduced.  When I started reloading for my .17 Fireball, all the data said that IMR 4198 was the powder that gave the best accuracy in that round, and after trying several powders, I found that they were right!

[Heredoggydoggy]

ALLRIGHT STOP!

NOBODY MOVE!.........What is 6mmx6.8?  Who? and are reamers available?

The main thing I've found with .223 cases is to trim them constantly.  I've never seen cases "grow" as much as .223/5.56 cases do.  I've gotten into the habit of trimming all my cases, because some are mine, and some I've picked up.  Some guys get a special Swager to remove the primer pocket crimp in some cases.  Me, I just use a countersink bit in my cordless drill to remove the crimp.  A quick buzz and it's done.  I used to think I was being an animal doing this, but I looked at some of the Black Hills reloads, and some of them are chamfered so deeply I don't know how the primer stays in!  I've always full-length resized my AR brass.  .223 cases are so plentiful that it doesn't really matter to me if the case life is shorter.  I always find more than I lose anyway.  I use Ramshot Xterminator for bullets up to 55 grain, and Tac for heavier bullets.  That IMR 8208 XBR might be good too, but I've not tried it in my .223s.  In my 20 LBC and 6mmX6.8 SPC it's great!  I've got to get on the IMR (Hodgedon) site and get the latest load data for it.  There's more now than there was when it was newly reintroduced.  When I started reloading for my .17 Fireball, all the data said that IMR 4198 was the powder that gave the best accuracy in that round, and after trying several powders, I found that they were right!

It's a fairly new wildcat cartridge--a 6.8 SPC case (.270) necked down to 6mm. (.243)  I got the barrel from Black Hole in Moses Lake and after 8 months I sent them a nasty email, and a week later I got it.  Ammo is available commercially, but it's over a buck a round, so I made my own.  I had a 6.8 SPC anyway, so brass wasn't a problem.  IT'S A SCREAMER! 

[crazysccrmd]

There's the 6x6.8 spc by Black hole, the 6DTI by DTI, the 6WOA by White Oak, maybe some others too. All variations of the 6.8mm case necked down to 6mm. You can also do a 6x45 which is a necked up 5.56. I'm sure there's more out there too.

[Heredoggydoggy]

Yup, It's a fun round.  So far I've only shot the 58 grain Hornadys, but at 300 yards I was getting a 4 to 5 inch group.  Not bad for a shaky old man, and a dead coyote for sure...

[jay.sharkbait]

Thanks everyone

Any numbers on 105-107 vld's?

[Heredoggydoggy]

I have some Sierra 107 grain bullets, some Speer 85 grainers, and Barnes 62 grain Varmint Grenades, but haven't tried any of them yet.  You can get the barrel in 1 in 10 or 1 in 9 twist.  I specified 1 in 9, so it should stabilize the heavier bullets OK.  If it does, I may snap up the Berger VLDs at the gun shop...

So far, the 58 grain Hornadys with IMR 8208 XBR powder seems to be the ticket!

[Fisherdave10]

For plinking ammo, I used to trim every casing as a part of my case prep routine.  That sucked.  Removing crimps from the primer pocket sucks too, but is pretty quick.  5.56 spec ammo will usually have a ring crimp at the primer pocket.  Federal .223 also has crimped in primers.  Other than that, I do like Federal .223 brass because the brass length is short from the factory and you can have several firings before thinking about trimming it.

Now I size my brass in an RCBS X-die and I don't have to trim.  The longer cases stay at least .010" below the maximum case length now. 

Get a Lee Factory Crimp Die.  Case length does not matter and it is extremely easy to setup.  It is a fantastic product.

Varget is a great powder, but is a little slow for 55gr bullets.  The extruded shape of the powder can make progressive loading a little bit bumpy...

I like Ramshot TAC.  Because it is spherical, it meters well and is relatively economical.  I really need to find a few more pounds...

[Blacklab]

cfe-223 is a great powder for your ar. Fast burning, stable and easy on the barrel. You might also look into mag primers for the thicker walls. To lessen the chance of slam fires. 

[Fl0und3rz]

How important is cup pressure in the ar's for cycling.better to be higher or lower?

About the best I have seen on the topic to answer your question. 

http://www.ar15barrels.com/prod/operation.shtml

Short answer is it depends and neither.  There tends to be a sweet spot that depends on rifle configuration.

[stevemiller]

thanks a lot of info there. 

[Heredoggydoggy]

You might also look into mag primers for the thicker walls. To lessen the chance of slam fires. 

I've never had a slam fire.  Shot many rounds with CCI and Wolf primers.  Sometimes get a mark in the primer of an unfired chambered round due to the "floating firing pin", but oddly enough, never a slam fire.  I've seen the #41 primers that are designed for the AR but haven't used any.  They probably have an extra thick primer cup. 

[jay.sharkbait]

You might also look into mag primers for the thicker walls. To lessen the chance of slam fires. 

I've never had a slam fire.  Shot many rounds with CCI and Wolf primers.  Sometimes get a mark in the primer of an unfired chambered round due to the "floating firing pin", but oddly enough, never a slam fire.  I've seen the #41 primers that are designed for the AR but haven't used any.  They probably have an extra thick primer cup. 

I've never had a slam fire either

[Heredoggydoggy]

no slams yet but did have one jam (sideways)crushed the case and when mag emptied bolt stayed forward.this did not happen when firing hornady 55gr. vmax.what would you say the prob. may be? 

Not enough pressure to make the bolt carrier/bolt go back far enough to eject the empty and activate the lockback.  The .223 was designed around the 55 grain bullet.  Lightest bullet I've loaded is 50 grain, and they functioned fine. 

[Fl0und3rz]

no slams yet but did have one jam (sideways)crushed the case and when mag emptied bolt stayed forward.this did not happen when firing hornady 55gr. vmax.what would you say the prob. may be? 

Not enough pressure to make the bolt carrier/bolt go back far enough to eject the empty and activate the lockback.  The .223 was designed around the 55 grain bullet. 

That'd be my guess as well. My data shows that to be about 3150 fps out of a 20" 1/7 barrel, which is mid-range for the Sierra data.  Also, as a point of reference, the velocity for M193 is around 3150 fps for a 55 grain bullet, so I would expect those specs to produce a higher pressure than what you are using.  I'd consider bumping up the charge before I would consider any other causes.

[stevemiller]

Ok,will do.Thanks for the replies. 

[Blacklab]

Hey Steve your 9th addition Hornady has that powder for the 6.5 Grendel  Copper fouling eliminator 223 is manufactured by Hodgedon. Faster cleaner cooler and stable.

[brokenvet]

Lots of info here.  Yes of course trim cases, full length size the cases that's to ensure that round go into full battery. 

I shoot the AR, m14 & the M1 garand and I have only one slam fire and that was due
To a primer not fully seated.

Hornady reloading manual 7th or 8th Edition has specific loading data for the service rifle.

[gasman]

Well. i just loaded up 150 rounds of .223 for some plinking with my AR.

Used Hornady V max, in 55gr and 24.7 grains of TAC powder.

We will see how it works 


I did have to Swagger some of the brass, the Tula and Rem brass were Ok but the others I had need to be swagged. It was first time swagging primer pockets and a learning experience for me 

[Blacklab]

from hodgdon web page

55 GR. BAR TSX FB    Hodgdon    CFE 223    .224"    2.180"    24.7    3065    44,600 PSI    27.4    3317    54,000 PSI          
55 GR. SPR SP    Hodgdon    CFE 223    .224"    2.200"    26.0    3133    43,300 PSI    27.8    3329    51,300 PSI          
(Click on any icon below to return to that product)

[Heredoggydoggy]

I've heard that the pressures are higher in the military 5.56 ammo to make sure they cycle the action in an AR type gun in battle.  I load for accuracy, and that's usually about the middle of the load table.  Even loads at the bottom of the load table have never failed to cycle in my AR rifles. 

[Fl0und3rz]

I've heard that the pressures are higher in the military 5.56 ammo to make sure they cycle the action in an AR type gun in battle.  I load for accuracy, and that's usually about the middle of the load table.  Even loads at the bottom of the load table have never failed to cycle in my AR rifles. 

That's a good point of reference.  What are the specs of the rifle?  With tolerances (or possible out of spec parts) at the buffer, buffer spring, bolt, carrier, key, gas tube and gas port stacking in the wrong direction, a weak load - speculating - might provide insufficient pressure to cycle the AR.

I'd like to say that mine have been 100% reliable with 45-55 grain bullets with mid to lower end loads, but that is not the case for me, and it was exacerbated at lower temperatures (e.g., a load that cycled reliably in mid-day, mid-summer heat failed to cycle in early morning temperatures). With M193 level loads tested concurrently, they cycle fine. Just another data point.

[Heredoggydoggy]

Another thing to check is that your collapsible buttstock tube isn't screwed in too far-it needs to be screwed in JUST far enough to hold the spring/detent from coming out.  One turn further, and your bolt might not go back far enough.  They are a simple rifle in operation, but there are a few subtle things that can cause them to be finicky....

[Brownie28]

I use 26 gr varget with 60gr hornadySP and get Awesome groups.
I always FL resize and check case length.

lC brass, win SR primers, varget, hdy SP , loaded to .010 under mag length and I get this

[Hilltop123]

I use 26 gr varget with 60gr hornadySP and get Awesome groups.
I always FL resize and check case length.

lC brass, win SR primers, varget, hdy SP , loaded to .010 under mag length and I get this

Barrel specs.? Just curious..

[Blacklab]

Have you chronyed you load? Nice group btw 

[Brownie28]

Don't have a chrony so I'm not sure of velocity but if I remember correctly that's towards the high end of the charge weight. Rifle is a RRA lower with NM 2 stage trigger, YHM upper with 18" CMMG .556 barrel 1:8 twist cheap $10 walmart see through rings and a bushnell trophy XLT 3x9 scope. Groups were at 100 off sand bags

This is Marie laveu

[fowl smacker]

I have some Sierra 107 grain bullets, some Speer 85 grainers, and Barnes 62 grain Varmint Grenades, but haven't tried any of them yet.  You can get the barrel in 1 in 10 or 1 in 9 twist.  I specified 1 in 9, so it should stabilize the heavier bullets OK.  If it does, I may snap up the Berger VLDs at the gun shop...

So far, the 58 grain Hornadys with IMR 8208 XBR powder seems to be the ticket!

I would not use the heavier bullets with a 1 in 9" twist, max bullet weight for that twist should be 73 gr.  You would want a 1 in 7" or faster for anything 90gr and up.
I've reloaded a lot for my AR's both 1 in 9 and 1 in 7.  I highly recommend the Lee fl die for the AR platform.  You also want to stay a couple grains lighter on the powder from max load on a bolt action .223. My best load for 1 in 9" is 55gr Hornady vmax pushed by 24.6 gr of varget, and my best for 1 in 7" twist is a 69gr sierra match king hpbt (not a hunting round) pushed by 25.3 gr of varget.  Hope this helps.

[Heredoggydoggy]

I have some Sierra 107 grain bullets, some Speer 85 grainers, and Barnes 62 grain Varmint Grenades, but haven't tried any of them yet.  You can get the barrel in 1 in 10 or 1 in 9 twist.  I specified 1 in 9, so it should stabilize the heavier bullets OK.  If it does, I may snap up the Berger VLDs at the gun shop...

So far, the 58 grain Hornadys with IMR 8208 XBR powder seems to be the ticket!

I would not use the heavier bullets with a 1 in 9" twist, max bullet weight for that twist should be 73 gr.  You would want a 1 in 7" or faster for anything 90gr and up.
I've reloaded a lot for my AR's both 1 in 9 and 1 in 7.  I highly recommend the Lee fl die for the AR platform.  You also want to stay a couple grains lighter on the powder from max load on a bolt action .223. My best load for 1 in 9" is 55gr Hornady vmax pushed by 24.6 gr of varget, and my best for 1 in 7" twist is a 69gr sierra match king hpbt (not a hunting round) pushed by 25.3 gr of varget.  Hope this helps.

This is a 6.8SPC necked down to 6mm.  Standard load for the 6.8SPC is 110-115 grain bullets.  I agree with the .223 info.

[Jekemi]

Lots of good comments here. I would watch www.ultimatereloader.com video's on reloading for the .223. Some of the best information available.