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Author Topic: Seeking advice from experienced winter campers  (Read 7670 times)

Offline Toptwo

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Re: Seeking advice from experienced winter campers
« Reply #15 on: November 08, 2013, 05:37:17 PM »
What a GREAT thread, have learned a LOT! Special thanks to Wild Bill for such an excellent write-up!  I copied and pasted to a separate file on my comp so I can pull that up again fast when needed!

Offline 12Gauge

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Re: Seeking advice from experienced winter campers
« Reply #16 on: November 08, 2013, 05:48:10 PM »
Propane Heater Buddy does the trick to heat your tent. 
Progressives are coming for your guns. 
What are you going to do?

Well me, I do not have any guns, gave away or sold them 15 years ago.

Offline BKMFR

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Re: Seeking advice from experienced winter campers
« Reply #17 on: November 08, 2013, 06:10:12 PM »
I tell you guys, I really appreciate the input, no smartazzes or anything, just the type of info I joined this site for....
Hats off to you guys!
Very Refreshing- Thank You!

Offline bigmacc

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Re: Seeking advice from experienced winter campers
« Reply #18 on: November 08, 2013, 06:22:21 PM »
Just so happens most of my camping seems to involve a negative in the temperature talk.

Ive done a TON of arctic camping.
From -45 out on the North slopes, to Rainier, Whitney, to late muley hunts. Ive done several weeks in the snow with very little....

- ALWAYS bring a sleeping pad. 2 if you can afford it (weight/ space wise). If you dont, make a bow bed, grass bed, stick bed... Whatever bed, just GET OF THE GROUND. The best bag in the world wont keep you warm if you dont.

- I prefer to avoid a bivy if its real cold. They condensate. ALL OF THEM (to some degree).
                   - If its not real cold (I use below freezing as a measure), i use a bivy as the rain becomes a factor.

- Putting a warm liquid container in bed with you is not a bad idea (do it myself), but a risk. Kinda a big one. If it leaks/ opens...... You may not wake up.

- Synthetic bag.... No down. People will chime in, your call who to listen to. I have lived off my back for 28 straight days, in sub zero temps. with a quality synthetic bag. No drama.
                    - Spent 7 days on a 72 mile voyage with a Mt Hardwear phantom 0. Great bag. I burn hot, and condensation was present as I slept. Down loses all insulation value when wet. I slept the last 3 days on a fire bed in all my cold gear. Not worth the risk!!!! Dont trade compression/weight for safety/comfort.

-Hit up a surplus store, and get a old Army camo blanket. Throw it in the bottom of your bag. It will help keep your feet warm. If the bottom falls out of the temp, pull it up to your vitals. It will raise the temp rating on your bag 10-15 degrees.

- If you bag is improperly fit (yes, there is a bag design for each body), fold the excess under your feet at night. Your body will try to warm up all the excess, and your warmth will be reduced as a result.

- Place your shoes OUTSIDE but under your sleeping bag at night. Learned the hard way that boot laces are capable of freezing to the point they are like a coat hanger or a phone pole (had some i could place on the ground and laces were paralell the ground  :o). This also helps (though very, very little) with drying your boots.

- Socks, Socks, Socks. If your socks (or any clothing item) is the slightest bit damp. Change it out. It will pull the heat straight out of you. A bag will not slow it down much either.

- Put your battery powered items in your bag at night. I wrap them in a dry jacket, and use them as a pillow. Batteries are fine in cold weather UNTIL they have been activated. Then a little satanic *censored* known as cold soaking WILL creep up on you while your not looking. Dead batts...

- Kinda a debatable topic. Some say sleep as close to naked as possible. Some say wear all base and thermal layers. I would start the coldest and find out what works for you. If you wake up cold, put a thermal top on. Then bottoms etc... Dont go hot all at once or your bag will start to condensate.

- If you choose to rock a bivy, put all your outer garments between your bivy and your bag (if they're dry). It will keep them from freezing, and its much nicer to put on a kinda warm top then a freezing top.

- Water freezes from the top down. Think rivers lakes etc... So if you use a nalgene, or canteen (suggested) turn it upside down before bed. The top (really the bottom as you drink) will be frozen but the threads will not be. During the day do the same thing, unless you have a insulator. If you use a camelback..... Brave! Ive done it, but it sucks. Typically your hose freezes. If you route it under your armpit, and stow the mouth valve in a pocket you stand a chance of not freezing your line.

- Always bring spare socks.

- A way to intake HOT liquids is almost a must. Unless your harder than woodpecker lips, you'll appreciate it. Even if its water.

- Chapstick. A MUST!!!!!!!!!

- If your using a tent instead of a bivy, make an effort to keep the snow outside. It will warm up, melt, and make life hell. (this is mainly if your cooking in the tent as well. Not preferred, but at times necessary).

- If the bottom washes out of the temp, and your face is cold, place a t shirt around your head. Or bring a scarf. Your body will burn a ton of energy, water, and heat trying to warm your breath as you take in air. This will help a ton. It is very noticeable. A neck gator by smart wool is one of my favorites.
           - If its real cold and your a restless sleeper (most new winter campers are), dont use the hoody in your bag for anything more than a pillow case. Instead, wear a nice thick beanie, and a face wrap/ neck gator. You will breath all over your sleeping bag making the face hole an ice box. It doesn't seem to freeze folks up as much as its uncomfortable and keeps them awake. Kinda funny.

- As already mentioned, dehydration in winter is way more common than most other seasons as you do not "feel" the need to drink. Just know that. Your fuel consumption will skyrocket. Carbs are not a bad thing for a winter camper.

- Eat just before bed. As your core digests food, it creates heat. :twocents:

- If you can help it, pitch a bivy under a large STURDY tree. If snow hits, it will help keep you from being buried. The down fall, if the wind hits  you may get buried in a even less desirable way!

- Then all the normal stuff applies. Fire starter, knife, yadda yadda yadda......

Remember this. Condensation kills. Its better to be slightly cool (not cold) while sleeping/ hunting at than toasty. If you have a wall tent or a camper... Different story....

A cold camp is a mans camp!

Eitherway, you will likely learn something about yourself which is always a good thing. I have seen the toughest SOB's reduced to nothing from being cold and wet for days on end, so dont feel bad if your motivation starts to waiver a little. I'd bet it will, but just drive on man. If you leave because it's "kinda sucking", you'll wish you never had, and you most definitely will wish you were "back in the suck"....

 :twocents: :twocents:
WB

Sounds familiar..are you SF. My brother was an instructor down at Bragg...If not,its still spot on advice!
« Last Edit: November 08, 2013, 06:53:13 PM by bigmacc »

Offline TheHunt

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Re: Seeking advice from experienced winter campers
« Reply #19 on: November 08, 2013, 06:52:49 PM »
Wild Bill,

Have you any experience with the Kifaru Tipis?  They have a floor and a stove. 
275 down 2

Offline Skyvalhunter

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Re: Seeking advice from experienced winter campers
« Reply #20 on: November 08, 2013, 06:58:19 PM »
Floor no but you can purchase a stove separate
The only man who never makes a mistake, is the man who never does anything!!
The further one goes into the wilderness, the greater the attraction of its lonely freedom.

Offline Wild Bill

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Re: Seeking advice from experienced winter campers
« Reply #21 on: November 08, 2013, 07:03:43 PM »
Another thing on the snow melting....
10:1. Thats the ration of snow=water. 10 parts snow, 1 part water.
Ice is 1:1.

You do NEED to start with water in the pan if you use a jet boil or hot burning camp stove, or it will evaporate it faster than it will melt it. If you use a slow burning stove, or the fire it should be fine with no water to start.

Love this topic... Lots and lots of hard lessons learned here. Keep up the tips, questions....
WB

Offline Wild Bill

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Re: Seeking advice from experienced winter campers
« Reply #22 on: November 08, 2013, 07:04:40 PM »
Wild Bill,

Have you any experience with the Kifaru Tipis?  They have a floor and a stove.

Sure dont.
Mainly bivy/ pack tent and wall tent experiences.

WB

Offline Toptwo

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Re: Seeking advice from experienced winter campers
« Reply #23 on: November 08, 2013, 07:16:15 PM »
WB, out of all the bags you have tried, what brand/model did you like best? I had a down bag all picked out for myself, The Feathered Friends: Swift UL20. However, since you said what you did about down bags, and since I live on the wet side of the state, I am rethinking that pick.

Thanks!

Offline Easy-E

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Re: Seeking advice from experienced winter campers
« Reply #24 on: November 08, 2013, 08:12:00 PM »
I wish I would've posted the original question on this topic before heading into my opening weekend wilderness deer hunt! Great info here. Love it!

Cheers!
Cheers!

Don't try to win over the haters. You're not the Jacka$$ Whisperer. ~Scott Stratten

Offline PA BEN

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Re: Seeking advice from experienced winter campers
« Reply #25 on: November 08, 2013, 08:26:45 PM »
I hunted the Blues in Late Nov. one year. I took a Parachute ridge pole in the center like a tee-pee. Had our tent under it and camp fire. It snowed everyday there the snow built up around the sides and it stayed very worm and dry under it.

Offline MLHSN

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Re: Seeking advice from experienced winter campers
« Reply #26 on: November 08, 2013, 08:51:25 PM »
Make sure you have chapstick with an SPF value.  Snow reflects the sun, so you get it twice.  I forgot sunblock and my chapstick once on a dawn untill dusk snowshoe trip.  My lips turned into my solid set of blisters they were so fried.  It took two weeks for them to heal.  Not to mention the raccoon sunburn.

I differ with others on down bags.  The new ones have a pretty good water resistant layer so it takes quite a good soaking for it to affect the down.  That being said, you need to make sure whatever you are wearing is dry when you get in the bag.

Offline Wild Bill

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Re: Seeking advice from experienced winter campers
« Reply #27 on: November 08, 2013, 08:59:49 PM »
Make sure you have chapstick with an SPF value.  Snow reflects the sun, so you get it twice.  I forgot sunblock and my chapstick once on a dawn untill dusk snowshoe trip.  My lips turned into my solid set of blisters they were so fried.  It took two weeks for them to heal.  Not to mention the raccoon sunburn.

I differ with others on down bags.  The new ones have a pretty good water resistant layer so it takes quite a good soaking for it to affect the down.  That being said, you need to make sure whatever you are wearing is dry when you get in the bag.


I have heard this about the newer bags. I have scars for life now though!!! Especially since a lot of the new synthetic stuff is so light.
What down bag you run?
WB

Offline Wild Bill

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Re: Seeking advice from experienced winter campers
« Reply #28 on: November 08, 2013, 09:03:14 PM »
WB, out of all the bags you have tried, what brand/model did you like best? I had a down bag all picked out for myself, The Feathered Friends: Swift UL20. However, since you said what you did about down bags, and since I live on the wet side of the state, I am rethinking that pick.

Thanks!

I run an Mountain hardwear bag thats about 6. I cannot for the life of me recall the name or model. That being said, find a bag that fits your size, temp range, and weight desires. If its a quality name, you wont be disappointed.

I really hate to steer folks to my liking in gear. I am pretty picky. I do stand by the synthetic comment though.

WB

Offline MLHSN

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Re: Seeking advice from experienced winter campers
« Reply #29 on: November 08, 2013, 09:53:39 PM »
WB,  I have a Golite Adrenaline 20 deg bag.  I love me some 850-fill down.

I will say this though, there are more bags then not that are 650-fill down bags.  650-fill is the cutoff where synthetic insulation saves as much weight as down.  I managed to buy my bag for $150 when they were clearing them out for next year's model.  But if you want an 800 or 850-fill down bag then you might be paying $250-400 and up.  If the down bag you can afford is only 650 then I suggest getting a good synthetic bag because they aren't really saving any weight.

I ended up having some rain blowing in sideways under my tarp one night and got my bag pretty good while I was sleeping.  The water just beeded on the outside of the bag and didn't affect the down loft at all when I woke up in the morning, the ground was soaked around me.  That being said, I sure wouldn't want it in standing water.  The fabric on the inside is different then the outside though so what you want to protect is getting water or sweat on the inside.

 


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