Are there just not any deer in Western Wa?

[Coastal_native]

Been saying this for years. We need some major changes on the west side to help the herds rebound. Been a steady decline since 96. Hmmm what happened in 96? Who'd of thought Hound hunting was so important?

I've been spending some volunteer time with our wildlife bio out here looking at cougar predation (deer and elk).  We all know how good they are at killing, but it really puts it into perspective when you get to see almost every kill over the course of a year from several different cats as well as their home ranges.  Last July one adult female killed three elk calves, within 500 yds of each other, in a span of about 3 days, all from the same herd of elk.  The same female has killed 3 adult deer from the same clearcut in the last 6 months.  With multiple westside tribes documenting cougar predation, I hope it leads to some depredation hunts.

[bobcat]

I believe that, at best, we have only 25% of the blacktail deer we had 15 to 20 years ago. (In the areas I hunt- 501, 663, 672)

And it could be closer to 10%.

[headshot5]

From what I've seen in the costal lowlands Bobcat is pretty well correct.  The hairloss syndrome really hammered them, and the increase in predators have kept the population from rebounding.  I still see a few deer with the hair loss every year but not like it was the first few years with it.  The deer population has recovered quite a bit in the areas I hunt in the last 5 years or so, but definitely not like it was before.  I'd say 25% is an accurate estimate population wise.   

[bullcanyon]

Sorry but not doing it right isn't the problem in the east side of the 667 unit. Lived here my whole life and have seen a steady decline since 96. I worked for the local timber company in high school picking up shredded tires off the road.  So we had keys to the gates.  We would drive the road after school most nights seeing 35+ deer in an hour and 12 to 15 bucks. You show me anywhere in Western wa where that is possible on a daily basis.  Not just the one perfect weather day of the year that coincides with the rut. I know several guys with Vail keys that would see 30+ deer a day and maybe 2 bucks.
There may be a few areas in Western Washington with decent Blacktail populations but they are not in Lewis County.
One of my best friends is a big Blacktail killing machine and he could of killed 2 small bucks this year.  He don't hunt from his truck.  He covered more ground this year seeing less deer than any year prior.  If he isn't finding them than we have an issue.

[deltaops]

I have been out scouting and have seen lots of sign from 653, 654, and over in Mason County. This next year I will be deep in the forest to test a theory I have. I shot a 2 point, tracked it for some time, bumped it and it ended up down a hill on a road and some one pulled up and loaded it up and took off.  It sucked but it is what it is I guess.

I know we have them around and I am certain we have more than we think, but I do not have the facts to back it up so this is just my guess. After some scouting and some well placed cams next spring through summer should give me some kind of results. Good or bad, we will see.

[DoubleJ]

We have a cut over near my house with very prime deer habitat.  The problem is it's over run with dogs and there was a cougar sighting there last week.  I have invited many a forum member to come out and take care of the problem and many have said they were interested and yet, they predators remain.  The last guy I believe has intentions to shoot some dogs but has had some family issues.  The dogs are there for the taking and this cougar has been seen off and on for about 3 months now.  I don't hunt predators.  Don't know the first thing about it.  They are a problem in this single cut that I know though.

[furiouzgeorge]

After I fail to kill a deer this year I may take you up on that good sir!

[Special T]

Sorry but not doing it right isn't the problem in the east side of the 667 unit. Lived here my whole life and have seen a steady decline since 96. I worked for the local timber company in high school picking up shredded tires off the road.  So we had keys to the gates.  We would drive the road after school most nights seeing 35+ deer in an hour and 12 to 15 bucks. You show me anywhere in Western wa where that is possible on a daily basis.  Not just the one perfect weather day of the year that coincides with the rut. I know several guys with Vail keys that would see 30+ deer a day and maybe 2 bucks.
There may be a few areas in Western Washington with decent Blacktail populations but they are not in Lewis County.
One of my best friends is a big Blacktail killing machine and he could of killed 2 small bucks this year.  He don't hunt from his truck.  He covered more ground this year seeing less deer than any year prior.  If he isn't finding them than we have an issue.

I don't doubt there are LESS deer. What i am saying is that if you go hunting and are seeing NOTHING its likely your actions and tactics are not right for black-tails in our current situation. I don't claim to be a hunting god, but i have seen more animals of all kinds when i slowed my hunting way down and focused on certain kinds of terrain. 

[7t9cobra]

Have you been doing any pushing? I haven't seen many deer at all this year until we started doing more pushing through short timber and nasty swamp bottoms. We finally got on them and now I've been seeing them everywhere. Its pretty crazy how well they can hide. Find yourself some fresh sign and start pushing the worst areas to hike through. Just stay on the game trails to keep quiet. If there are no trails, no reason to go in.

[deadwoodbuck]

I agree with Bobcat and many other on the cat issue.  but up here there are so many locked gates compared to 10-20 years ago that access is the problem.  in town there is all measure of bucks and doe...they are bold and feed on everything...nice racks where they grow old.  in the county there is so much ag. that a deer hasn't got a chance for being shot.  so out in the woods...locked gates or the few open areas concentrate the hunters.  i'm all for giving it a rest or make it a 3-4point or better hunt.  the gates need to open, someone can take note and monitor for damage.  they own the timber but I think our tax money buys the land.

[fordpowerforever]

there is more factors in play then people are thinking about....
Ive been hunting blacktails exclusively for the last 18 years in gmus 601,602,603,607,612 and 615.
We use to log everything right into the creek draws, no rmz area for them to hide in and no place to sneak out as easy, we also use to slash burn our units which got rid of all the brush so the units were much easier to see into and the feed was much much better sooner. I know the cats have definately hurt the population and locked gates have slowed people down a lot. I hunt behind locked gates mostly. covering up to 15 miles a day on foot on logging roads, you can spend all day in the timber and brush holes looking for an elusive blacktail but thats not my cup of tea. I like to cover ground, i do alot of glassing better dont spend hours in the same spot. I average 6-12 deer a day usually at least a buck or two. The bucks out here arent as big as the more inland bucks. Most of my deer have been shot under 100 yards. I have a saying that goes well with blacktails, "you cant find them if you aint looking." In my opinion you cant pattern blacktails, especially in brushy country where its hard to see them. I say cover ground and keep your head on a swivel. Blacktails are spook and shoot not so much spot and stalk.

[REHJWA]

  unless you can get trail cam pictures coving ground is the best way to find core areas. Then it is bump and shot.

there is more factors in play then people are thinking about....
Ive been hunting blacktails exclusively for the last 18 years in gmus 601,602,603,607,612 and 615.
We use to log everything right into the creek draws, no rmz area for them to hide in and no place to sneak out as easy, we also use to slash burn our units which got rid of all the brush so the units were much easier to see into and the feed was much much better sooner. I know the cats have definately hurt the population and locked gates have slowed people down a lot. I hunt behind locked gates mostly. covering up to 15 miles a day on foot on logging roads, you can spend all day in the timber and brush holes looking for an elusive blacktail but thats not my cup of tea. I like to cover ground, i do alot of glassing better dont spend hours in the same spot. I average 6-12 deer a day usually at least a buck or two. The bucks out here arent as big as the more inland bucks. Most of my deer have been shot under 100 yards. I have a saying that goes well with blacktails, "you cant find them if you aint looking." In my opinion you cant pattern blacktails, especially in brushy country where its hard to see them. I say cover ground and keep your head on a swivel. Blacktails are spook and shoot not so much spot and stalk.

[Evoac05]

I've been seeing a deer or two pretty regularly now on my way home each day. Now that the gmu I have been hunting is closed I researched and found out who owns the land. I contacted them and of course it is not open to public access, they are working on converting it to fish habitat. All I want is doe, but it looks like I'll be eating tag soup yet again (4 years now). The kicker is that on my way home today I saw 8+ deer in the same area.     

[FLIZZ]

ALL OF US. Seriously, Everyone needs to dedicate more time to predator hunting in the off season. I never really have done the predator thing, but after this season I'm doing it. I'm sick of struggling to find a deer, even whilst practicing disciplined BT tactics. Summer is even more depressing not seeing the tons of deer feeding on the side of country roads like I remember in the 90's. Easier said than done to kill cats I know, but we're all capable of dusting a yote here and there. IT'S GO TIME.

[STIKNSTRINGBOW]

I know if I had a ML tag for deer, meet would be on the ground in 501, too bad I have to drive for open archery unit...