new bow problems

[pianoman9701]

Other things to check: what kind of release are you using and how are you using it? You may have had a more forgiving bow before and small issues with your technique have now become bigger issues. Is the timing correct? I also like the stabilizer suggestion and from what you've told us, your arrows are not the correct spine for the bow.

[sakoshooter]

Try shooting the 350 spine arrows. I know you've got a short draw length but with a 125 gr tip you're pushing it with that 450 spine and if it's a spine problem, it'll be magnified more yet with a broadhead. Today's bows are a bit harsher on the draw/shot, hence the advancements in speed, than yesteryear's bows. Many times they require a stiffer shaft.

[RadSav]

Maxima 450's at 26" would not reach optimal spine from that bow until you hit about 85 pounds of draw weight!!!  You are WAY over spined.  Carbon Express sizes do not represent spine weight.  The CE 450 is a 300 spine arrow.  Their 250 is a 400 spine arrow and the one you should be shooting out of that bow at that draw length.  Carbon Express shafts are amazing arrows, but throw away the nocks and switch to Easton Super-Nock, Micro-Lite or Bohning nocks.  That should go for anyone shooting CE arrows - their nock throats are way too tight!!

I think D-Rock might be on the right track with the timing comment.  That bow has a very narrow timing window.  Once set correctly it should shoot better than you, me, D-Rock and just about anyone out there.  Assuming everything is matched well...arrow spine for instance!

Secrets to shooting Hoyt bows well = Timing, Back tension, Very Loose Grip, Back tension, Draw length, Back tension, balance, Back tension, matched arrow spine and Back tension.

Way too many guys try to buy more accuracy these days.  Especially when they have a bargain bow.  Todays bargain bows are amazing shooters.  Tuned properly with matched components they should out shoot the shooter.  Charger is the same as the high end Hoyts just with a cheaper manufacturing process used to produce the riser and grip.  It would actually be my choice over many of the high priced, more expensive to produce, Hoyts.  It's a very good shooter!!!  Buying more consistency is probably a pipe dream

[RadSav]

Find someone who really knows how to tune a Hoyt bow properly.  "Come Get Some" comes to mind of someone rather close to you and he has offered to help others on this forum.  He may be one of those annoying "Target Guys"   But it's obvious he not only knows how to shoot and knows the Hoyt ins and outs better than a hired bow tech at some random shop.  I'd send him a PM and try and work out a get together.

You could always box it up and ship it down to me.  My work loads are crazy right now and it might take me a week to get to it.  But I could run it through the Hooter Shooter and make sure there is not some sort of mechanical issue.  Besides making sure your cams are tuned properly.  I can also review photo or video of your shooting and analyze your form too.  Same thing I expect you could get from "Come Get Some".  But, I seriously doubt you need all that.  Just someone who can get you tuned and then switch your arrows to proper spine.  Get that done and I bet you will be shooting lights out in no time.  That's a great bow!

[beastmodebowhunter]

Can any of your bow nut buddies shoot it to see how it shoots for them? If they shoot it well then you know its not the bow...
Just an idea.

they have shot it through paper and get bullet holes perfect but none of them have actually shot at a target. im sure it might be me in some way, just confused on how this bow has made my form inaccurate and the other bows i had i was money. its frustrating! i have always had my hand at the 45 degree with index and middle finger resting on the front of the grip with little to no pressure and had awful groups so i dug through the archery box found the old wrist sling and tried the complete open hand and still didnt make a difference. maybe i will take it and shoot it through paper.. they kept telling me it was good because they were shooting bullet holes but i guess everyone shoots a little different and if my form varies to theirs it would make the difference. i will do some tweaking today and report back. see if i cant figure this problem out! And HUGE typo mistake i just saw now.. arrows are 350 spine.

[RadSav]

350 spine is still a little stiff for that length and poundage on that bow.  Optimal spine of the 350 doesn't come into effect on that bow/arrow/point/length until you hit 78# of draw weight.  But it's a whole heck of a lot better than the 450

I despise shooting through paper to tune.  Too often you get good holes in paper but arrow flight is poor.  Then other times you get a good flying arrow that won't paper tune at all. Think of paper tuning as bore sighting a rifle.  It get's you close, but there is still plenty of fine tuning yet to do. 

Hoyt, probably more than any other bow/cam, benefits from a good creep tuning.  Tuning to maximize the amount of error you can get away with is essential with the Hoyt cam system.  Sometimes as little as 1/16" advancement in the upper cam can open up a world of forgiveness you otherwise wouldn't know you have.  I'd hate to have you give up on this great bow for something so easy to fix by someone with a little advanced Hoyt knowhow.

[RadSav]

Could you do me a favor and measure the insert to crotch of nock on those 350 Manheim Hunters?  Got your pictures and something is not matching up to my profile for you.

[Come Get Some]

Annoying target guy's?  Actually I am just a very picky bowhunter. Perfect is close enough.

  Remember all types of shooting make you a better bow hunter. Anyway. Thanks for the referral. I would love to help if I can. I agree, you are over spined. I set my rest at 3/4" from riser to center of arrow. Good starting point. Set your arrow a slight bit nock high. Throw the paper tuner in the burn barrel. A bullet hole will only get you exactly that, a hole in the paper. If and when I were to shoot a bullet hole(years ago) I would then go to 20 yds and sight in your 20 yd pin. Go to a blank bale at 20 yds, Shoot an arrow, go back to 30 yds and shoot at the same arrow with your 20 yd pin. Since you went back another 10 yds you should hit below your first arrow. If you feel you made a good shot and your arrow is slightly left, move your rest Very little to the right to bring the arrow under the other one. Same if you hit to the right. That should get you a perfect center shot set up. Given that you do not have a form issue(Grip can kill good arrow flight.)I usually set my top cam a little faster than my bottom cam (timing). If all of this does not work after changing arrows of course. Let me know your results.

[RadSav]

Annoying target guy's?  Actually I am just a very picky bowhunter. Perfect is close enough.

 

Come Get Some - Are you advancing your upper cam on those Hoyts with tiller or twists?

I got some pictures from Beastmode' and his left arm and hand look reasonably good!  Release hand looks to be floating so we are working on trying to figure out that cause right now.  Trying not to change his preferred anchor if at all possible but it may come down to that.  My first reaction is the 26" draw length isn't actually 26".  Should know that by this evening. 

You guys should really get together though.  That bow is too good not to be stacking arrows!

[dinker]

i have the same bow at 65# and a 27 inch draw (but im only like a 261/2"),  but i shoot good with it my wiskerbisket is being changed soon going to a drop away  because its getting to worn out.

[h20hunter]

"Dinker, out of the truck!"

"Oh owie ow ow!!!"

Hows the ankle Dinker?

[D-Rock425]

i have the same bow at 65# and a 27 inch draw (but im only like a 261/2"),  but i shoot good with it my wiskerbisket is being changed soon going to a drop away  because its getting to worn out.

shoot good with it   you got the same group as my shotgun at 40 yards.  You are hardly minute of elk at 40 yards. 

[D-Rock425]

"Dinker, out of the truck!"

"Oh owie ow ow!!!"

Hows the ankle Dinker?

looked like a beached whale flopping on the ground crying for his mommy.

[h20hunter]

Yeah...we give him crap but he sucked it up pretty good and got some hunting in.

[D-Rock425]

Yeah he sucked it up right along with his twinkies.