NEW CVA Accura V2 - Intermittent success w/ Percussion caps

[brianmtsinc]

I went for my final shooting today before my WR Muzzy hunt - just to make sure I'm all set.  It's a good thing I did because my first first shot...well, didnt go off.   

I pulled the hammer back a second time, and it fired just fine.  Shots 2-4 all went well.  But then, unfortunately, several more episodes of the caps not firing.   

So, what could it be?  I stopped on the way home and bought some more caps (German Vorderlader No. 1081)  These are the same type I had been shooting (shot over 35 shots my first day without a single fail to fire)  and all the store had.  I brought it home and shoot 5 caps all were good to go so I thought, problem fixed!     ... Decided to go back out and try a couple more, and attempt # 6 - no fire!   

Any ideas or suggestions would be greatly appreciated.  Keep in mind - I am not a muzzy guy, nor a rifle guy.  The was the first gun I ever cleaned, so maybe I did something wrong the first time I cleaned it??   

My hunt starts Saturday, but I head for camp on Wed, so I am basically out of time.  Hoping someone has a quick easy answer. 

Thanks in advance! 
Brian C.

[medic6]

Does the hammer slap the cap ( entire cap) or punch the cap ( single point of contact). Cva muzzle loaders that punch the cap have been an issue for them for a couple of years.

[brianmtsinc]

To be honest, I am not sure.  I had one that did not fire that I pulled off the nipple, that had like a "half arc" across the top of the cap ??

I just spent 1.5 hours cleaning it.  Should I go try another dozen caps or will that just cost me more cleaning time? 

[carpsniperg2]

The first ones that came out had a bad batch of hammer springs. It has been posted on the net on other sites, maybe even this one? They have since upped the power of the spring and the new guns hitting now, should have the problem fixed. You might give cva a call and maybe they will send you a new spring?

[trophyhunt]

that would make sense to me, I've never had a misfire on my muzzy.  The cap should go off every time shouldn't it? Even if it's dirty??

[brianmtsinc]

Here is a pic.   I tried it one more time and it did not fire.    The one on the left, was the misfire.  The one on the right, new. 

Maybe this will help ??   

This gun was just purchased about 2 months ago - brand new.

[trophyhunt]

We can use my gun Brian if you don't get this figured out, no problem.  I just don't want you to stress out too much, it will be a good hunt either way!

[h2ofowlr]

I had the same issue last week.  I purchased some new ones and it solved the problem.  I think my older ones must have attracted moisture or something.  A good sign is if it is not popping once fired, given you have good contact with the nipple and the cap is being striked.

[h2ofowlr]

Brian,

Flip the cap over and take a picture of the inside.  If it is not black in color from firing, I would look at some new caps.

[carpsniperg2]

Looks like it's hitting it pretty hard You might still call cva. A lot of the guns got bought up by cabelas/sportsmans etc. Even though you got it 2 months ago. It might be one of the older rifles that had the issues when it left the factory.

[trophyhunt]

He bought brand new caps today on the way home, I don't think it's the caps.   

[brianmtsinc]

Inside, both of the caps are green.  It did not fire. 

But like Carp said, it looks like it is striking pretty hard.   

[trophyhunt]

You call them yet?

[brianmtsinc]

I called Muzzle loader .com and CVA.  Both very friendly.  Unfortunately both were stumped as to what the problem is. 

CVA recommended that I loosen the breech plug and only lightly finger tighten it and try again.  Which I did.  5 perfect fires and I thought, problem fixed.  He suggest I shoot a few more so, number 6 - good to go!  ... number 7 - NO FIRE    number 8 - NO FIRE 

He suggests that I clean the firing pin again and repeat the above thinking maybe it is blow back    ... and that if I can at least be confident that I can get 5-6 shots before it fouls, I can go hunting with it      Not exactly the answer I was hoping for but I guess I understand the confusion since the firing pin is striking the cap properly   

NOT what I need to be dealing with 3 days before I am scheduled to leave....   

[Sabotloader]

Here is a pic.   I tried it one more time and it did not fire.    The one on the left, was the misfire.  The one on the right, new. 

Maybe this will help ??   

This gun was just purchased about 2 months ago - brand new.

OK - I am going to throw this out there for what it might be worth....

1. if you were shooting #11 caps I would bet the farm you would not have any problems with ignition!

2. Why.... a cap is not like a primer - punching the middle of the cap will not cause ignition - all you are doing is pushing the ignition material in the primer stack on the nipple.  Looking at your examples - I think it is obvious that you hitting the caps very hard causing the almost perfect depression in the middle of the cap.  The get a cap to fire you must jamb the ignition material in the cap into a hard object like the rim of the cap.  The compression then starts ignition...  If the DIAMETER of your firing pin were a little larger than the diameter of the cap you would certainly get ignition.

Knight often has/had the same problem and to solve the problem they are making and shipping a Musket nipple with an offset stack so the hammer/firing pin drives the edge of the cap into the leading edge/top of the nipple stack.

Again will a #11 you would not have this problem because the hammer covers the diameter of the cap.

Here are a couple of pictures to show the offset stack..





Hope some of this makes some sense...

[brianmtsinc]

Sabotloader - THANK YOU!!   Do you know where I can find # 11 caps?  And will they fit the same nipple in my CVA?  (That might be a dumb question  )     If so, I will run right now and try out a dozen or so 

Does it make any sense that cleaning out the firing pin could help with the issue I am having ?     Don't get me wrong, I will clean it 100 times if I need to, but time is now very short for me and I don't want to waste any if there is a better solution.   

[Sabotloader]

Sabotloader - THANK YOU!!   Do you know where I can find # 11 caps?  And will they fit the same nipple in my CVA?  (That might be a dumb question  )     If so, I will run right now and try out a dozen or so 

Does it make any sense that cleaning out the firing pin could help with the issue I am having ?     Don't get me wrong, I will clean it 100 times if I need to, but time is now very short for me and I don't want to waste any if there is a better solution.   

And there is the real problem...  I do not really know that much about CVA rifles.  You can not use the musket nipple for a #11 cap.  So does the nipple unscrew from the breech plug?  If it does then you need a 6x1 #11 Nipple that fit CVA breech plugs.  Then, because the gun is a break open really designed to shoot 209's the firing pin has a very limited reach so you will need a #11 nipple that is about the same length as the musket nipple.  from the top of the breech plug back  or when the #11 nipple is screwed in to the breech plug it needs to be the same length as the musket nipple when it is screwed in.

This picture shows a variety of nipples available of all different lengths - so I really do not know if you could find the correct length one.  I am sure CVA offers only the Musket nipple for your configuration.

[MountainDevil54]

I've had 2 RWS musket caps like that, they would not fire no matter what rifle I put them on.

Keep the musket cap shaft clean and seat the musket cap HARD with your thumb when loading up.

Musket caps is all you can use on your Accura NW, the nipple and breech plug is all one piece.

[brianmtsinc]

I've had 2 RWS musket caps like that, they would not fire no matter what rifle I put them on.

Keep the musket cap shaft clean and seat the musket cap HARD with your thumb when loading up.

Musket caps is all you can use on your Accura NW, the nipple and breech plug is all one piece.

Will do.  I am going to go clean it again now and see what happens.  Here is what I am using.  Should I change brands ?

[andersonjk4]

I purchased a CVA Accura V2 NW edition way back in March, but just finally got around to shooting it yesterday.  I am having the same issue the OP is having.  I called CVA this morning and the guy I talked to said that a lot of the early NW edition rifles had weak firing pin springs and that he would ship me a new firing pin assembly right away.  Hopefully this helps the problem.

I also agree with Sabotloader that part of the problem is the size of the firing pin in relation to the size of the musket cap.  I think if the firing pin were larger to cover the entire cap that the caps would fire more reliably.  My biggest complaint about the new CVA rifles is the fact the nipples are built into the breech plug.  One I would really like the option to switch the nipple out for #11 caps and two what happens if the nipple breaks?  I have seen ML nipple crack and break and if that happened on a hunt you would be SOL. 

But overall I really like the way the rifle handles and the way it shoots (on the few times I could actually get a cap to go off). 

[Sabotloader]

I purchased a CVA Accura V2 NW edition way back in March, but just finally got around to shooting it yesterday.  I am having the same issue the OP is having.  I called CVA this morning and the guy I talked to said that a lot of the early NW edition rifles had weak firing pin springs and that he would ship me a new firing pin assembly right away.  Hopefully this helps the problem.

I also agree with Sabotloader that part of the problem is the size of the firing pin in relation to the size of the musket cap.  I think if the firing pin were larger to cover the entire cap that the caps would fire more reliably.  My biggest complaint about the new CVA rifles is the fact the nipples are built into the breech plug.  One I would really like the option to switch the nipple out for #11 caps and two what happens if the nipple breaks?  I have seen ML nipple crack and break and if that happened on a hunt you would be SOL. 

But overall I really like the way the rifle handles and the way it shoots (on the few times I could actually get a cap to go off).

If you are so inclined at the end of the season I would like you to send that BP to me - I bet I or Lehigh
Dave could make it so you had a removable nipple... well maybe I should see a picture of it  before I go that far.

I am sure the stronger spring might help but still the nipple post has to act as and anvil and if the hammer does not cover the cap I think it will lead to intermittent problems.

mike

[andersonjk4]

If you are so inclined at the end of the season I would like you to send that BP to me - I bet I or Lehigh
Dave could make it so you had a removable nipple... well maybe I should see a picture of it  before I go that far.

I am sure the stronger spring might help but still the nipple post has to act as and anvil and if the hammer does not cover the cap I think it will lead to intermittent problems.

mike

I would be willing work with you this winter after hunting season is over to see if the BP may be modified to accept removable nipples.  CVA doesn't currently offer replacement BP's for these new NW legal rifle, but I just sent a rather long email to CVA making asking this question and several other questions regarding the issues with their new line of NW legal rifles.  If I can get a replacement BP from CVA then maybe I can get it sent to you for your opinion.   

[Sabotloader]

If you are so inclined at the end of the season I would like you to send that BP to me - I bet I or Lehigh
Dave could make it so you had a removable nipple... well maybe I should see a picture of it  before I go that far.

I am sure the stronger spring might help but still the nipple post has to act as and anvil and if the hammer does not cover the cap I think it will lead to intermittent problems.

mike

I would be willing work with you this winter after hunting season is over to see if the BP may be modified to accept removable nipples. 

Sounds good to me... just give me a shout...

CVA doesn't currently offer replacement BP's for these new NW legal rifle, but I just sent a rather long email to CVA making asking this question and several other questions regarding the issues with their new line of NW legal rifles.  If I can get a replacement BP from CVA then maybe I can get it sent to you for your opinion.   

That is weird that they do not offer a replacement BP

It would be interesting to see one

mike

[carpsniperg2]

The rifles are in such high demand right now that is why they are not doing replacement breech plugs right now. I have talked to them many times in the last number of months. When the demand slows they will offer a replacement plug.

[k88241]

A friend of mine had same issue with this gun.  I gave him some RWS 1075 and so far, he hasn't had another misfire. 

[andersonjk4]

Aren't the RWS 1075 caps a #11 sized cap?  I didn't know you could get the new CVA's with a #11 sized nipple.  Maybe I'm confused and they make 1075 in a musket cap size?    

[k88241]

The RWS 1081 and the 1075 seemed to fit the same on the nipple/breech plug that came with his gun.  The Instructions said use the RWS musket caps.  The book did not specify the model number of caps however.

His 1081 caps went off, but it seemed the energy of the cap blew out the 4 slots of the 1081 on the side instead of being concentrated into the breech hole to ignite the load.

Made the switch...so far no more issues.