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Author Topic: wondering the ratio of archery shots taken at elk vs elk recovered  (Read 11378 times)

Offline Magnum_Willys

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Re: wondering the ratio of archery shots taken at elk vs elk recovered
« Reply #15 on: September 20, 2016, 09:50:01 AM »
Depends on area. Dense western washington with rain - at least 20% lost I would guestimate.  Open dry eastside colorado 15%.  Big difference between cows and big bulls too.  Cow may lay down right away while a big bull mite not.  Ive searched wet reprod for half an hour just to find an animal that went 40 yards.


Offline pianoman9701

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Re: wondering the ratio of archery shots taken at elk vs elk recovered
« Reply #16 on: September 20, 2016, 09:58:30 AM »
No one knows the ratio. Hunt archery, don't hunt archery. Lose an elk and punch the tag, don't punch the tag. No one's going to change their hunting methods because of someone else's opinion of what or how they hunt. Now, if the thread were about "What do you do to minimize the chance of Losing an archery elk?", there might be something helpful to discuss.  I foresee a lock within 40 posts. Really, no offense to the OP meant. But, this won't end well.
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Offline Mr Mykiss

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Re: wondering the ratio of archery shots taken at elk vs elk recovered
« Reply #17 on: September 20, 2016, 10:10:02 AM »
 :yeah:
It's really up to the hunter...I debated this with a buddy recently. He said, know the risks of archery hunting and accept them. If you hit a animal with an arrow make THE GREATEST EFFORT POSSIBLE to recover it. That pretty much sums it up.
I've been tearing my hunting soul up over this one for years...I know many guys, many guys, who practice daily and take only what people would call "ethical" shots only to have something go wrong or miss by and inch or two and ... well you know the rest. I think the "it happens" factor is much greater with archery gear but it is without question that every hunting method has it's drawbacks.
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Offline pianoman9701

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Re: wondering the ratio of archery shots taken at elk vs elk recovered
« Reply #18 on: September 20, 2016, 10:48:29 AM »
I've lost 2 elk and 1 deer in 20 years. Yes, it tore me up each time. But nothing goes to waste in nature. If the coyotes and cougars don't find dead or injured animals, they'll kill healthy ones. I'm far more worried about the impact of furry predators on our game than archery losses.
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Offline TheHunt

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Re: wondering the ratio of archery shots taken at elk vs elk recovered
« Reply #19 on: September 20, 2016, 11:18:06 AM »
This will be a great thread.  When my eyes were great in my youth I would pull back on 60 - 70 yards all day and felt comfortable.

Now...   I would shoot out to 50 with out an issue but without my glasses on.  With glasses I would go 60 but I cannot hunt with glasses on.  It is just me. 

Now I have seen people post up elk with 93 yard kill shots.   Man that is a long ways. 
275 down 2

Offline treeclimber2852

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Re: wondering the ratio of archery shots taken at elk vs elk recovered
« Reply #20 on: September 20, 2016, 11:34:57 AM »
This can be a touchy subject for me. I have taken 9 or 10 record book Roosevelt elk, over the years, and have never shot at one from over 35 yards. That is the limit I set myself to back in the '80's. I have wounded two bulls. One from less than 15 yards that turned to run as soon as I released and the arrow hit, I think, jaw bone. The first one I wounded was a small 5 point that was 30 yards away. My arrow hit the tiniest of twigs hanging down. I saw the twig before I shot and I thought that there was no was my arrow would hit it. It did! The arrow deflected and hit him right in the arse. My Dad and I tracked him until dark and then, that night, it poured down rain. The dead bull was stumbled upon by other hunters four days later, bloated. They gave my the antlers, I tagged it, and was thanked by the local game warden for doing so.

The reason it is touchy for me is that I read about all these long shots. Some successful, some not. My thought, in the latter years of my hunting, was/is don't shoot unless you know you can make a perfect shot. Too much stuff can happen when shooting past 50 or 60 yards, way too much! Too me, it is not worth it. It is a sick feeling knowing that you stuck a animal and it is a hopeless feeling when you start to realize what you have done.

I will, probably, be labeled self-righteous for saying this stuff, but I cannot stand reading about 70 and 80 yard shots, and sometimes longer. To me that is just selfish and, yeah, stupid! But, it will never stop.

Let my lashing begin...

I agree with you almost 100%.  I do believe there are guys that can take that 70 yard or maybe even 80 with extreme confidence.  Unless you have ice water in your veins though you toss a little adrenalin in and it could be easy to miss the mark.  Any doubt, I just won't shoot myself, I have too much respect for the animal.

I think the most important part you stated and the same goes for me is it makes me sick to see an injured animal go off knowing it will likely die slow and miserably.  There are people who have the "oh well, cant find it" and go stick another one as if it was no big deal.  That makes me sick personally.

To romaknows,  It happens, it sounds like you tried hard to recover her and that's the best you can do.   As far as giving up on archery, that's nuts.  It could have been a rifle shot and you could have lost her too.  Lots of people can tell stories of elk that were lost to a well placed rifle shot and didn't recover their animal, they can be tough as nails and they can drop like a ton of bricks.  You just never know.

I had a perfect 70 yard broadside shot across a little lake opening day on a big cow.  There was nothing in my way, but I knew my limit was 45 yards.  Past that, I wasn't comfortable.  So I started a slow crawl trying to get in range.  She was gone by the time I got to my comfort zone.  I thought a lot about that opportunity and to be honest, there's a part of me that wishes I had let one fly.  But then reality kicks in and I'm grateful I didn't risk it.  I'd rather kick myself for maybe a missed opportunity than live with myself knowing I injured an animal because of my overconfidence.  I agree...some people may be comfortable out to 70 yards, but I'm not...and maybe never will be. 

Offline Buzz2401

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Re: wondering the ratio of archery shots taken at elk vs elk recovered
« Reply #21 on: September 20, 2016, 04:17:05 PM »
I do know a hunting story of the "one that I didn't get a shot at"  is a lot better then the one "I shot but couldn't find".

Offline Mudman

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Re: wondering the ratio of archery shots taken at elk vs elk recovered
« Reply #22 on: September 20, 2016, 04:29:57 PM »
Yes I have a few I couldn't get shot at.  I don't recommend shots past 60y and prefer under 45y.  Depends on hunter and equipment and weather terrain etc.  I could not resist my 65 yard shot at that bull.  It was in my Gma's pasture on flat ground on a calm sunny day.  It was only chance I was going to get and I took it.  I was dialed in to 80y that year.  Adrenaline from calling him in at a dead run to me was too much.  I missed because I was too excited to use rangefinder.  Parted his hair under belly.  Very frustrating.  But I would pass today.  None of us are perfect and learn with age. I am not as good of shot-lack of practice. I don't judge others yet 100y shots aren't a good thing for anyone without gunpowder!  Pianoman is correct.  Nothing in nature goes to waste.  Bad shots feed nature regardless.
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Offline bwhntr350

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Re: wondering the ratio of archery shots taken at elk vs elk recovered
« Reply #23 on: September 21, 2016, 05:53:16 AM »
This can be a touchy subject for me. I have taken 9 or 10 record book Roosevelt elk, over the years, and have never shot at one from over 35 yards. That is the limit I set myself to back in the '80's. I have wounded two bulls. One from less than 15 yards that turned to run as soon as I released and the arrow hit, I think, jaw bone. The first one I wounded was a small 5 point that was 30 yards away. My arrow hit the tiniest of twigs hanging down. I saw the twig before I shot and I thought that there was no was my arrow would hit it. It did! The arrow deflected and hit him right in the arse. My Dad and I tracked him until dark and then, that night, it poured down rain. The dead bull was stumbled upon by other hunters four days later, bloated. They gave my the antlers, I tagged it, and was thanked by the local game warden for doing so.

The reason it is touchy for me is that I read about all these long shots. Some successful, some not. My thought, in the latter years of my hunting, was/is don't shoot unless you know you can make a perfect shot. Too much stuff can happen when shooting past 50 or 60 yards, way too much! Too me, it is not worth it. It is a sick feeling knowing that you stuck a animal and it is a hopeless feeling when you start to realize what you have done.

I will, probably, be labeled self-righteous for saying this stuff, but I cannot stand reading about 70 and 80 yard shots, and sometimes longer. To me that is just selfish and, yeah, stupid! But, it will never stop.

Let my lashing begin...

I agree with you almost 100%.  I do believe there are guys that can take that 70 yard or maybe even 80 with extreme confidence.  Unless you have ice water in your veins though you toss a little adrenalin in and it could be easy to miss the mark.  Any doubt, I just won't shoot myself, I have too much respect for the animal.

I think the most important part you stated and the same goes for me is it makes me sick to see an injured animal go off knowing it will likely die slow and miserably.  There are people who have the "oh well, cant find it" and go stick another one as if it was no big deal.  That makes me sick personally.

To romaknows,  It happens, it sounds like you tried hard to recover her and that's the best you can do.   As far as giving up on archery, that's nuts.  It could have been a rifle shot and you could have lost her too.  Lots of people can tell stories of elk that were lost to a well placed rifle shot and didn't recover their animal, they can be tough as nails and they can drop like a ton of bricks.  You just never know.

I had a perfect 70 yard broadside shot across a little lake opening day on a big cow.  There was nothing in my way, but I knew my limit was 45 yards.  Past that, I wasn't comfortable.  So I started a slow crawl trying to get in range.  She was gone by the time I got to my comfort zone.  I thought a lot about that opportunity and to be honest, there's a part of me that wishes I had let one fly.  But then reality kicks in and I'm grateful I didn't risk it.  I'd rather kick myself for maybe a missed opportunity than live with myself knowing I injured an animal because of my overconfidence.  I agree...some people may be comfortable out to 70 yards, but I'm not...and maybe never will be. 

It's hard to do but commendable!

In 1990 I was hunting my "hill" out of Forks. First thing in the morning, just 1/4 mile off the end of a road, I got a bugle.  I ended up in the herd after two cows spotted. They took off  angling up the hill quartering away from me. I just stood my ground knowing that the bull, who was out in front of me somewhere, would probably come by. Well, he did. He was at least a 7x8, tall, wide and heavy. The eye guards grew sort of downwards for about 16" then curved straight up for 4 or 5 inches more. It was massive. I estimated, and still do today, at 370 or 380 B&C, maybe even bigger. Never seen anything like it. My biggest Roosevelt scored 306 and it would have been dwarfed by this behemoth.

He walked perfectly parallel to me, 30 or 35 yards. He was above me and it was steep. I was ready and I just kept telling myself "Just stop", "Just stop", but he kept walking, not fast, but walking and I would not take the shot.

Never seen him again and there is not a day that goes by that I wonder if I should have just taken the shot, but I made the choice and it is what it is.

I am 52 now, got 11 bow kills in 20 years of hunting since 1982 and take years off at a time. In fact, I did not buy a tag this year. I once took 14 years off from '92 to 2005. Useless info but a little bit about myself. Also, I practice out to 80 yards. I can, generally, make a 12" group from that distance. But, I only do it because shooting at that distance will make you a better shot as all flaws are shown and for the reason of, well, if I get a 2nd shot at a wounded animal.

True story what people say here. Rifle hunters wound animals, as well. And yes, stuff just happens. I am just of the belief that the odds go up, exponentially, with the greater distances. It's a chance I choose not to take. Others feel differently but I feel that I owe it to the animal to be as clean and  precise that I can be.


Offline trophyhunt

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Re: wondering the ratio of archery shots taken at elk vs elk recovered
« Reply #24 on: September 21, 2016, 05:59:17 AM »
I don't think I know a Archery hunter who hasn't lost an animal.  Guys I know who have been doing it for more then 30 years have all lost multiple animals.
:yeah: answer, a lot of animals are not found.  I know guys that go to the worlds end to find their elk and they still lose animals. Just part of the hunt.
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Offline kentrek

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Re: wondering the ratio of archery shots taken at elk vs elk recovered
« Reply #25 on: September 21, 2016, 06:38:19 AM »
I believe 1 out of 3 animals are lost is the statistic uses by Oregon fish and game....I could be wrong tho

Offline Buzz2401

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Re: wondering the ratio of archery shots taken at elk vs elk recovered
« Reply #26 on: September 21, 2016, 12:59:35 PM »
My mom shot a bull two years ago and it had a 45 cal pistol bullet stuck against the pelvis.  Completely healed over.  Some ******* shot it in the *** with a 45 ACP.  Luckily it lived.
« Last Edit: September 21, 2016, 02:28:12 PM by Rainier10 »

Offline JDHasty

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Re: wondering the ratio of archery shots taken at elk vs elk recovered
« Reply #27 on: September 21, 2016, 01:09:18 PM »
My guess is that the worst for wounding w/o recovery is probably buckshot. 

Here is a study done on deer wounding w/o recovery rate http://www.marylandqdma.com/files/Download/Pedersen-31-34.pdf

Offline Magnum_Willys

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Re: wondering the ratio of archery shots taken at elk vs elk recovered
« Reply #28 on: September 21, 2016, 01:43:27 PM »
My guess is that the worst for wounding w/o recovery is probably buckshot. 

Here is a study done on deer wounding w/o recovery rate http://www.marylandqdma.com/files/Download/Pedersen-31-34.pdf
Right about what I thought - 18% hit but not recovered on deer. 

Offline lokidog

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Re: wondering the ratio of archery shots taken at elk vs elk recovered
« Reply #29 on: September 21, 2016, 09:21:59 PM »
My guess is that the worst for wounding w/o recovery is probably buckshot. 

Here is a study done on deer wounding w/o recovery rate http://www.marylandqdma.com/files/Download/Pedersen-31-34.pdf

Some states don't allow buckshot for deer, WI is one example. 

 


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