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Author Topic: 28 Desert Unit bucks taken by Yakima Indian Nation rumor or truth?  (Read 82426 times)

Offline PlateauNDN

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Re: 28 Desert Unit bucks taken by Yakima Indian Nation rumor or truth?
« Reply #240 on: November 30, 2016, 05:13:24 PM »
I'm not sensitive to it and all I asked was how does anybody know the actual number if nobody tracks or reports? So some game dept. Employee said so? Is there a name and how do they know the actual number and did they actually know they were Yakama? A legitimate question was asked and then I asked a legitimate question myself?

C-money, thanks for providing your input as a person who sees a portion of the desert unit everyday. :tup:
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Offline boneaddict

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Re: 28 Desert Unit bucks taken by Yakima Indian Nation rumor or truth?
« Reply #241 on: November 30, 2016, 05:51:08 PM »
I think getting the ball rolling would be to track harvest.  It's impossible to know what the impact is other than heresay if the tribe doesn't self regulate and keep track of harvest and work with the WDFW.   Personally I think everyone should be under the same umbrella but....  The excuse my ancestors did this....doesn't fly with me.  Heck I can track everyone of my descendants back to earlier than 1600.  Not sure how that is relevAnt. 

Offline Tbar

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Re: 28 Desert Unit bucks taken by Yakima Indian Nation rumor or truth?
« Reply #242 on: November 30, 2016, 06:04:50 PM »
I kind of hate to weigh in here, but throughout my career, I've been faced with "problems" continuously that needed to be fixed.  The one thing I learned early on, and it has made me an effective problem solver, is to understand the goal of any solution.  To do that, one needs to understand what the PROBLEM is. 
Everyone states that problems need fixing, the treaties, the natives policing their own, the importance of wildlife vs. shellfish with the WDFW, penalties are not strong enough, the wolves, cougars, bobcats, coyotes, liberals wanting to shut down our public lands, on and on and on.  These problems will never be "fixed" unless everyone understands what impact these problems are creating today.  In other words, in the big picture, what is the problem???

So, start with the set of undesirable conditions that these "problems" are causing.  What is the big problem?  The answer is not "Natives hunt and kill a lot of animals".  If you want to look at it from the other direction, "What does something look like AFTER a solution is implemented?"  And the answer there is not "Natives must follow all the rules like everyone else". 
The answer is "What are you really pissed about?"  My guess is that it's not easy enough for you (and every other hunter) to go out and kill a tasty trophy every time you want to. 
There are MANY reasons for this, so get to work formulating the reasons.  Predators might be one.  The Natives enforcement policies might be another.  WDFW management strategies might be another.  Poachers might be another.  Develop a list of problems that are causing this "undesirable situation" that is making everyone complain.  This is the beginning of the development of a STRATEGY.  Impact analysis tells you what "problems" have the biggest impact on your desired outcome. 

Please remember that in the big picture, what something looks like AFTER the solutions are implemented to remedy the "problems" everyone has identified, it will NOT BE POSSIBLE for everyone to go out and kill a tasty trophy whenever they want.  So, BE REASONABLE and REALISTIC in what you would like to see AFTER the solutions to the problems you identified are implemented. 

Now, from experience, and I've been doign this for over 30 years, people are way too small minded to understand a "big picture" or "top down" approach.  Most are much more comfortable finding on and clinging to an emotional argument, one that they can yell and complain about, because face it, the big picture approach is HARD and takes a LOT OF WORK.  However, by making all Natives follow the same rules as the general public, YOUR FUTURE VISION of hunting in WA will NOT HAPPEN!  Why?  Because there are poachers, and there are predators, and there are hard winters that kill a lot of game, and there are BS policies that the WDFW implements, and of course, there isn't enough MONEY to fix all the problems you identify. 

So, to those who, like bradley, claim a paradigm shift is needed to solve the "problem" of the treaties, I say you need a bigger paradigm shift and start not with a problem, but with a vision of what you would like to see in the future.  THEN go out and find what is preventing that vision, and THEN understand the IMPACT of each thing that is preventing that vision, prioritize, and start knocking those things off.  Be prepared for a long, hard implementation of the solutions, be prepared to PAY to realize your vision, and go out and get it done instead of pointing out random things that "need to be fixed".

Now, small minded people that lack the mental capacity to understand what I just said, hold forth with your wisdom of what the real problem is. 

Dave
Excellent post Dave.
As a follow up, and this is an honest question, does anybody have any valid research to prove any of the problems?  Has any analysis been done in regards to trends in population? Have they then taken it a step further and found the causative effect?  The Yakima elk herd is stable,correct?  How has Yakama tribal harvest adversely effected overall herd numbers and harvest (overall)? How has predator management adversely affected ungulate herds and overall harvest  (please stick to science based answers)? How has WDFW wildlife management adversely affected ungulate herd trends and overall numbers? Please keep in mind that we live in the 3rd smallest state in the west with the 3rd highest human population and other western  states have experienced large scale ungulate declines.
Any science based answers would be appreciated These are real questions and may be in need of dedicated scientific studies, unless there are some available. 

Offline little_red_wagon

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Re: 28 Desert Unit bucks taken by Yakima Indian Nation rumor or truth?
« Reply #243 on: November 30, 2016, 06:13:17 PM »
Hi guys 😎😎😎

Offline MtnMuley

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Re: 28 Desert Unit bucks taken by Yakima Indian Nation rumor or truth?
« Reply #244 on: November 30, 2016, 06:19:12 PM »
Here we go :llam:

Offline boneaddict

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Re: 28 Desert Unit bucks taken by Yakima Indian Nation rumor or truth?
« Reply #245 on: November 30, 2016, 06:20:09 PM »
Hey Red. 8)


As logical as that is T, it's impossible to have all the correct data when one of the main problems is there is no data being documented or collected.   That's my point.  How can you differentiate what the problem is if there is a piece missing. 

Offline brew

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Re: 28 Desert Unit bucks taken by Yakima Indian Nation rumor or truth?
« Reply #246 on: November 30, 2016, 06:25:17 PM »
i've noticed that a lot of people in this world are more concerned about the condition of their neighbors house than are worried about cleaning up their own property...i can't comment on the actions of people (natives or not ) 200 miles away from me and what they may or may not be doing--but i can sure comment on things that i have seen locally in my hunting area.  i bought access to the vail tree farm that gives me hunting access to almost 200,000 acres.  that area only has 3 gates that my key can let me in.  i can tell you factually that i hunted modern firearm the last 5 days of October and the 4 days in November.  Of those 9 days that i was out i saw more vehicles heading up into the hunting area after legal shooting time was over, as i was driving out,  than i saw during the 9 days i was up in the woods hunting.  that is no b.s.  kinda concerning to me as i am driving out, in the dark well after legal shooting light, and truck after truck passes me headed up into the woods coming in from an access gate with the next closest access gate 30 miles away.  People talk about the eyes in the woods program and contact WDFW if you see something strange going on so they can investigate it...well i'm cruising down the road, pitch black coming out, windows up and the radio playing the football game---BOOM close enough i can hear it with all that going on---am i gonna try and find out where the shot came from and report what i see ?  Hell no---if someone is gonna shoot something that close to me where they know i am around there is no way in hell i'm gonna approach them to see what is going on...until we can monitor and enforce what is going on in our own home i think it is pointless to try and enforce things that are going on elsewhere
beer---it's whats for dinner

Offline boneaddict

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Re: 28 Desert Unit bucks taken by Yakima Indian Nation rumor or truth?
« Reply #247 on: November 30, 2016, 06:25:28 PM »
Hey Red, get anything big this year? Off year for many.

Offline Tbar

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Re: 28 Desert Unit bucks taken by Yakima Indian Nation rumor or truth?
« Reply #248 on: November 30, 2016, 06:26:27 PM »
Hi guys 😎😎😎
Where you been red?  :fire.:  :chuckle:

Offline little_red_wagon

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Re: 28 Desert Unit bucks taken by Yakima Indian Nation rumor or truth?
« Reply #249 on: November 30, 2016, 06:27:57 PM »
I have a question. how long does it take your family to eat a deer?
 And how long does it take your  family to eat an elk?

 Be honest you guys.😇

It's been awhile boys. I been around you know hunting season and all

Offline little_red_wagon

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Re: 28 Desert Unit bucks taken by Yakima Indian Nation rumor or truth?
« Reply #250 on: November 30, 2016, 06:33:31 PM »
I got one nice one and  the rest to fill the freezers.  What about you bone?

Offline h20hunter

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Re: 28 Desert Unit bucks taken by Yakima Indian Nation rumor or truth?
« Reply #251 on: November 30, 2016, 06:34:27 PM »
Bone only shoots a dink every few years. :bash:

Offline sled

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Re: 28 Desert Unit bucks taken by Yakima Indian Nation rumor or truth?
« Reply #252 on: November 30, 2016, 06:39:09 PM »
The difference is that my ancestors hunted,fished and gathered in all these places and your did not
god damn!  Why did you come back!

Offline MtnMuley

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Re: 28 Desert Unit bucks taken by Yakima Indian Nation rumor or truth?
« Reply #253 on: November 30, 2016, 06:39:32 PM »
Well, as I type I have the last of the '13 Idaho deer backstraps on the pellet grill. Ate the last "hidden pkg" of '12 deer a couple weeks ago. Still noticed I have a '11 Montana deer whole strap for the grill on top of the freezer that I should have grilled years ago. Sounds bad, huh? I guess when you give away prime elk/moose to your close friends and elders, you get stuck with what's underneath. Life is good and nothing goes to waste here. :tup:

Offline little_red_wagon

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Re: 28 Desert Unit bucks taken by Yakima Indian Nation rumor or truth?
« Reply #254 on: November 30, 2016, 06:39:45 PM »
Lol as long as the tender..

 


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