Wolves' Effect On Other Wildlife (Study)

[Curly]

Final offer? You can do better than that. You wouldn't do it for a cool 100 grand?

[Fl0und3rz]

I got to hire 20 or more guys to go out and scout about for a few months for $50K/ea.  That's going to eat into my BS margins.

[Practical Approach]

Wolves only kill the weak and the old right?   I think more importantly the kill the young.  I don't see anything in the report that says they captured and collared fawns and calves to look at predation rates on recruitment.  Seems like that would be a big piece of the picture.   

[huntnphool]

Looks like 1.9 million dollars is what they have to spend. I wonder, is it really worth it? Wouldn't it be better to spend that money on wildlife habitat restoration?

 Before they can restore the wolf habitat, they must first know how much food the wolves will need within that habitat.

You'd think they'd be interested in restoring and/or improving mule deer habitat, since doing so would provide more deer for the wolves to eat.

 They don't need to though, there are plenty of mule deer to sustain a balanced wolf/prey natural order.

"Natural order" as in there aren't enough deer for us humans to hunt because the wolves' need to eat is more important than our need to hunt?

Correct

[Duckslayer89]

It will most likely be a complete and total waste of money.

OK, final offer. $1.7M.

I don't think they intend to do the survey by opening up their stomachs, Flound3rz. 

Either way, I'm good. I can make up BS as good as the next guy.

  1.7 million is a lot of bullets and traps

[trophyhunt]

What a waste of damn money, look at wyomings moose population, looks at idaho for god's sake.  Can't they pull some valuable info from the states that have already suffered from the wolf populations, how tough and expensive would that be?

[Duckslayer89]

What a waste of damn money, look at wyomings moose population, looks at idaho for god's sake.  Can't they pull some valuable info from the states that have already suffered from the wolf populations, how tough and expensive would that be?

Sad thing is these states are actually doing something about it and they are still having huge problems. Our state never will, going to be a mess.

[Cougartail]

  I don't see anything in the report that says they captured and collared fawns and calves to look at predation rates on recruitment.  Seems like that would be a big piece of the picture.   

And when they find coyotes and black bears are the big culprits when it comes to fawn/calf predation the wolf-haters will deny it.

I know, 200 wolves eat more fawns/calves than 25,000 bears and 200,000 coyotes. Makes perfect sense..to the great scientific minds on here.

[JimmyHoffa]

  I don't see anything in the report that says they captured and collared fawns and calves to look at predation rates on recruitment.  Seems like that would be a big piece of the picture.   

And when they find coyotes and black bears are the big culprits when it comes to fawn/calf predation the wolf-haters will deny it.

I know, 200 wolves eat more fawns/calves than 25,000 bears and 200,000 coyotes. Makes perfect sense..to the great scientific minds on here.

For the westside, some studies have been done that suggest bobcats get most the fawns and cougars the calves.

[Sitka_Blacktail]

  I don't see anything in the report that says they captured and collared fawns and calves to look at predation rates on recruitment.  Seems like that would be a big piece of the picture.   

And when they find coyotes and black bears are the big culprits when it comes to fawn/calf predation the wolf-haters will deny it.

I know, 200 wolves eat more fawns/calves than 25,000 bears and 200,000 coyotes. Makes perfect sense..to the great scientific minds on here.

For the westside, some studies have been done that suggest bobcats get most the fawns and cougars the calves.

Our neighborhood cougar takes deer and neighborhood cats and dogs.

[garrett89]

The wolves that they introduced here are not hunger only hunters. They kill for sport on top of that. They need to sell permits to fix the problem the wildlife people started.

[pianoman9701]

  I don't see anything in the report that says they captured and collared fawns and calves to look at predation rates on recruitment.  Seems like that would be a big piece of the picture.   

And when they find coyotes and black bears are the big culprits when it comes to fawn/calf predation the wolf-haters will deny it.

I know, 200 wolves eat more fawns/calves than 25,000 bears and 200,000 coyotes. Makes perfect sense..to the great scientific minds on here.

I have no doubt that's exactly what they'll report. There's a vast difference between just hating wolves for hating them and realizing that a wolf plan which is 50% more aggressive than a state with twice the land mass and 1/16th of the population density (MT), is ridiculous. 15 breeding pairs in our state and the refusal of the WDFW to de-list in the NE where the feds have already done so is a clear indication of their priorities. Meanwhile, the people and other wildlife there mean nothing as long as the great wolf plan succeeds. And it is succeeding, beyond their wildest dreams. I may not have a great scientific mind but I know numbers and know we were sold a rotten bill of goods by the USFWS and the WDFW. And, that's without even discussing echinococcus granulosus. Maybe your great scientific mind can enlighten us on the benefits of bringing in that disease.

[Practical Approach]

I guess I must be missing something.  The study is not looking at fawn and calf survival.  So no predation conclusions on the young will be made.  That will be an unknown.  Yes, I agree westside studies do show that bobcats, cougars, coyotes and bears have significant impacts on fawn recruitment, however wolves are very effective hunters and how much additive mortality will they add to potential recruitment? 

[pianoman9701]

How could an effective study of wolves' effect on other wildlife not include predation of infant and immature ungulates?

[JimmyHoffa]

Wolves tend to have a different hunting style than the other predators mentioned.  Occasionally yotes can run deer/elk, but usually they are just sniffing around for the bedded fawn like black bears.  Deer probably aren't used to being chased long distances on a regular basis.