High strung GWP

[Bigshooter]

I think anyone who says the retrieving aspect is not very important for a bird dog either hasn't hunted that much, waste a lot of game, or is a good swimmer themselves. I shot several pheasants, lots of quail, and a ton of ducks that I would not have gotten without a retrieving dog this year. I would get rid of a hunting dog that would not retrieve or turn them into a pet only and get a real hunting dog. Take it for what you payed for it.

I think anyone with the name Shannon shouldn't be able to hunt.  This statement is almost as dumb as the one you made above.

[Shannon]

Well Bigshooter, what do you do when you shoot a pheasant along a river and it folds on the other side of a river in 20 degree weather? Ah its just a bird dog, retrieving isn't that big of a deal but he looked good on point.

[Bigshooter]

Well Bigshooter, what do you do when you shoot a pheasant along a river and it folds on the other side of a river in 20 degree weather? Ah its just a bird dog, retrieving isn't that big of a deal but he looked good on point.

I wouldn't have shot it if I thought it would have ended up on the other side of the river or in the river.  Anymore questions.

[hornhunter]

I think anyone who says the retrieving aspect is not very important for a bird dog either hasn't hunted that much, waste a lot of game, or is a good swimmer themselves. I shot several pheasants, lots of quail, and a ton of ducks that I would not have gotten without a retrieving dog this year. I would get rid of a hunting dog that would not retrieve or turn them into a pet only and get a real hunting dog. Take it for what you payed for it.

SPOT ON SHANNON.

[Bigshooter]

I think anyone who says the retrieving aspect is not very important for a bird dog either hasn't hunted that much, waste a lot of game, or is a good swimmer themselves. I shot several pheasants, lots of quail, and a ton of ducks that I would not have gotten without a retrieving dog this year. I would get rid of a hunting dog that would not retrieve or turn them into a pet only and get a real hunting dog. Take it for what you payed for it.

SPOT ON SHANNON.

Yea you guys are right.  If a dog want retrieve you "either haven't hunted that much, or you waste a lot of game.

Give me a break.

[Shannon]

Well the dog you are describing is not for me. In this state you may hunt all day and only see the one rooster. Your telling me you would not shoot it? We all know how they don't always drop dead at the shot! What happens if you wing it over land and it coast over the river? You would lose the bird. I guess you could limit where you hunt but I want to go anywhere the birds are. I am not going to get in a pissing match with you but a non-retrieving pointer is not for me. Its to easy to train a dog that doesn't like to retrieve to retrieve so why would you settle for a dog that wouldn't?

[hornhunter]

My GSP retreives ducks geese quail chukar pheasant huns and tennis balls.  I worked with him when he was very young and taught him first  how to retrieve.  He is a pointer its in his blood, I didnt need to teach him that, it could come later.  Retreiving and swimming were the thiings focused on when he was a pup.  If you think your dog is gonna Magicaly start retreving when hes three youve got another thing coming.  2-8 months your dog will be the easiest to train, pound it in his head. I guess I like a dog to retreve because where I hunt in the USA I want a pointer who retrieves, because I like to shoot lots of birds rather than look for them.  BTW saying that you wouldnt shoot a bird because you knew it would land accross a pond or River is a load of *censored*, birds, (ALL) are very unpredictable once they are hit. Unfortunatley I shot a chkar that flew off a 400 ft cliff this last weekend I was 100 yrds away and was picking up the bird I had shot 10 seconds before that. You dont NEED a retrieving dog but if you trained your dog to retrieve you would go without one.

[Bigshooter]

BTW saying that you wouldnt shoot a bird because you knew it would land accross a pond or River is a load of *censored*, birds, (ALL) are very unpredictable once they are hit.

Do you shoot at birds that are flying across roads?  I don't I let them fly.  Because of two reasons: 1. I don't want to shoot a car or person; and 2. I don't want my dog to run through traffic.  I pass up a few shots like this every year no *censored*.  Passing up birds is not a problem for me.

[Lee Root]

Once force fetched a dog should retrieve whatever you ask it to.  This is Addy retrieving a raccoon getting ready for her VGP or utility test.  The raccoon was dragged out of her sight for 300 meters, then she was brought up to the start of the drag and released to track the racoon's scent trail.  She brought it to me and presented it with manners. (ie. she sat and waited until I told her to give.)



This is Cass just about to sit after retrieving a fox that was placed on the other side of a log.


Addy again, this time she was asked to retrieve a fox from the box or the barrier she is jumping out of with the fox.



And this is Cass retrieving a chukar, you will note that the bird is still not dead.  Cass will work tirelessly to get a wounded bird to the bag.  The bird only had a wing tip shot. 

[NW-GSP]

Bigshooter:  I think you missed my "point".  A GWP should retrieve as well as a Golden Retriever.  If you are talking about English Pointers, then yes they have been bred to find and point birds, some do retrieve well, others could give a rip.  That is the nature of that breed; but not the nature of a GWP, they come from 100 years of breeding to be sure that they retrieve, at least DD's do.  And yes, DD's and GWPs both point, but they do so much more.  They will do great water work with waterfowl, they will track wounded animals by tracking the blood trail, they will retrieve fur (rabbits etc.), they will bay pigs if you wish.  Very versatile, and very reliable.  They do sometimes come with high prey drive, but once established as a subordinate in the pack they are loyal to the "nth" degree.

Every hunter should care about the retrieval of shot game.  If one does not, then I think that one should reconsider what it is to be a hunter, and become concerned.  My dogs usually find other people's lost game on a regular basis on both public and private land that I hunt on.  I realize that not every bird comes back to the bag, but to be cavalier about it is not a philosophy that I, as a hunter, can adopt with an attitude of acceptance. 

My original point to make to the author of this thread, is still force fetch the dog, or have a pro trainer do it.  The dog will be a different dog, because the relationship between the owner and the dog will be different.  The dog may still be high drive, but at least the dog will be controllable.  Lee

I agree! 
the force fetch is not all about fetching, It teaches the dog that it has to do what you want it to do no matter what! wich will make some dogs not think for themselves for a while and will look to you for guidance

[RPM]

it's hard to justify the force fetch to some one who has'nt seen the results and benefits of it. you're pics should help lee. you're correct about it not being all about the retrieve. i've never got as much out of any other training than  it. it's hard to explain bond and partnership that comes out of it. but its a huge comitment for an ametuer trainer, i had a couple of great mentors with my first one, we started three pups at the same time and i stayed one step behind them now i'm 2 weeks into my 5th one and still go back for advice from time to time. good luck however you go