Loading Sabots

[gallion_t]

A few years ago a picked up a Traditions Evolution Muzzleloader and have primarily shot round balls just for fun and target practice. This year I was drawn for one of the Turnbull cow tags and because of their rule that you have to pack out the gut pile unless you use lead free bullets I have decided to pick up some sabots. I grabbed some Barnes Spitfire TMZ 50cal 290grain a bit ago and went out last night to shoot some. The First thing I noticed was that they were extremely difficult to load. It was taking all of my weight to get these down the barrel. Once they were in they shot great and very consistent, but I feel like it should not be this difficult to load. It was taking me several minutes to get these down the barrel.

Am I doing something wrong? Should I be using bore butter or some other kind of lube? Do I need to be using a starter or something else? I have never had these be so difficult with round balls. I started with a clean barrel so I am not concerned about build up that is causing it to be tough.

Could it just be these bullets? I also picked up some lead free Powerbelts I could try also.

Thanks in advance,

Travis

[CP]

Don’t use bore butter or any type of lubricant, it will affect your accuracy.

If the sabots are too hard to load you should change sabots.

[Magnum_Willys]

Had same issue. Ended up giving them away. Powerbelts loaded fine. Weird was they market them as the easiest loading but they are the hardest. I read guys swap out the plastic sabot for other brand black sabot.

[tikkahunter]

Try the Barnes Spit-Fire T-EZ.  They have the blue sabot not the yellow.  Weren't too bad loading in my cva.

[gallion_t]

Thanks for the advice guys. Next time I go out shooting Ill give the power-belts a try. Pretty disappointing because I have heard great things about the Barnes.

[kselkhunter]

Before abandoning Barnes, give the T-EZ a try.   They are easier loading in tighter bores than a TMZ, and use a thinner sabot.  TMZs sometimes don't load well in tighter barrels. 

Or just keep the TMZs and swap on a thinner sabot.  I've read that for folks that have the problem with the TMZs, they just order the Harvester crushed rib sabot, and swap off the TMZ sabots for those, and are fine.   

https://www.muzzle-loaders.com/harvester-crushed-rib-sabot-50-cal-h15045.html

[Sabotloader]

A few years ago a picked up a Traditions Evolution Muzzleloader and have primarily shot round balls just for fun and target practice. This year I was drawn for one of the Turnbull cow tags and because of their rule that you have to pack out the gut pile unless you use lead free bullets I have decided to pick up some sabots. I grabbed some Barnes Spitfire TMZ 50cal 290grain a bit ago and went out last night to shoot some. The First thing I noticed was that they were extremely difficult to load. It was taking all of my weight to get these down the barrel. Once they were in they shot great and very consistent, but I feel like it should not be this difficult to load. It was taking me several minutes to get these down the barrel.

Am I doing something wrong? Should I be using bore butter or some other kind of lube? Do I need to be using a starter or something else? I have never had these be so difficult with round balls. I started with a clean barrel so I am not concerned about build up that is causing it to be tough.

Could it just be these bullets? I also picked up some lead free Powerbelts I could try also.

Thanks in advance,

Travis

I have a bullet that would really be the ticket - stay away from Power Belts if you can....  Lehigh Defense is building a new line of copper bullets.  If you are hunting elk the new 452x265 is a great bullet - combine that with a MMP HPH-24 sabot or the HPH-3PEz load and you should be really set.

Since your bore is 1/28 you will not have a problem shooting them...





https://www.lehighdefense.com/collections/bullets/muzzleloader

If you order some of these try to load them with the sabot that came with the Barnes bullets - that should be an HPH-24.  If that doesn't work let me know and I will send you a sample of a couple of others - one of them will work fine...

[erk444]

Ive shot elk with both powerbelts and barnes and have seen others do the same. The ballistic perfomance from one to the other is like night and day. Powerbelts load easy and are accurate, but the barnes are far better performing and just as accurate. Like said before, get the TEZ with the blue sabot and it should load much easier. I know some people have had good luck with the PBs though. Im just going off what I've experienced. Good luck!

[gallion_t]

Thanks for all of the insight guys. I just remembered I have some Hornady SST sabots floating around. I might try swapping some of those out with the Barnes Bullets to see if they fit better. If not I'll look at getting some of the other bullet options. I just assumed that sabots were all the same size for a 50 cal.

[Sabotloader]

Thanks for all of the insight guys. I just remembered I have some Hornady SST sabots floating around. I might try swapping some of those out with the Barnes Bullets to see if they fit better. If not I'll look at getting some of the other bullet options. I just assumed that sabots were all the same size for a 50 cal.

I would bet that they are the same sabot -MMP HPH-24

[TC_outdoorsman]

Where is the best place to buy just sabots (without bullets)?

[Sabotloader]

Where is the best place to buy just sabots (without bullets)?

Sportsman will have them - probably Harvesters or and Ranch and Home - North Columbia Center....

Otherwise online from Harvester:  https://www.harvestermuzzleloading.com/index.php/products/sabots

Or MMP... http://mmpsabots.com/   Also remember the cost of shipping is included in the price - they also offer a volume discount with 5 or 10 packs can not remember for sure - that is where I get mine.

[carpsniperg2]

You might give the federal B.O.R lock a try they are supposed to be super easy loading to. I think I might try a pack this year.

[Sabotloader]

You might give the federal B.O.R lock a try they are supposed to be super easy loading to. I think I might try a pack this year.

Member this is just my opinion but from the tests and reports I have seen they are not worth the effort

[JakeLand]

Sorry to thread jack but I'm new to muzzle loading what is wrong with the powerbelts?

[meatwhack]

I'd just live with the hard loading of the Barnes for hunting because of their superior performance.

[Rem14]

I shoot the Federal B.O.R 270 gr. in a T/C Blackdiamond, very easy to load, shot after shot with no cleaning. Picture from one recovered from a deer. 

[meatwhack]

That looks like a good performing bullet as well. I don't think I've ever seen them before.

[carpsniperg2]

I shoot the Federal B.O.R 270 gr. in a T/C Blackdiamond, very easy to load, shot after shot with no cleaning. Picture from one recovered from a deer.

I remember the thread that you thumped a deer with one. I almost hit you up for a couple to try but I ordered some last night so we will see how they do in my optima and the new accura on the way

[PolarBear]

My Evolution hates Powerbelts. I almost had to stand on the ram rod to get them seated. I use the Barnes and have good luck and accuracy. A clean barrel will help a lot.

[Magnum_Willys]

My Evolution hates Powerbelts. I almost had to stand on the ram rod to get them seated. I use the Barnes and have good luck and accuracy. A clean barrel will help a lot.

Weird how one rifle one's tight the others loose and another rifle vice versa.  Are your barnes the yellow or blue sabots?

[Sabotloader]

some of the information here might help

http://barnesbullets.com/muzzleloader-tips-tricks/

[reelamin]

Every gun is different and for me requires a lot of testing and shooting to really know one will shoot with a particular combination.   LOTS and LOTS of testing unless you get a combination you are happy with early on.   

I have never shot and elk with a muzzle loader, but I have shot lots and lots with many different caliber/bullet combinations.  Add in all the guys I reload for and it is in the triple digits.   Just my opinion but you want decent expansion with the most important factor penetration.  I don't factor in deer because they are easy to kill with just about any bullet you choose again just my experience.

Based on reported data and my personal experience I tried some Hornady XTP and other copper bullets and settled on the Barnes 290 for my rifle.  I shot them in many different Sabots from Harvester and MMP.   For me mine liked the Yellow Factory 290 TMZ best but it loads like a MF'r on shot 2-3.  In fact it is so bad I plan on stuffing a windex soaked patch in my speed loader to wipe the first inch of barrel while hunting if I have to reload. 

[JL]

Reelamin, my B Diamond is the same way. By the third shot, I'm really ramming that sabot to get it down. It's that first few inches too. For me, it's a necessary evil, because the first shot (with a clean or swabbed barrel) is almost always a flyer but the second and third shot usually touch or are within an inch at 50 yds. I made a nice little palm saver out of some wood for this reason. I'll shoot it once before hunting and plan on a tough reload if need be. Shooting T/C 300 grain bonded super glide sabots w/ 110 volume of triple 7. I'll be honest too, the recoil w/ that load kicks like a mule and I really start feeling it after two groups of three. I must be getting "seasoned" though, because I shot four groups of three this weekend and it was the first time I didn't wind up w/ a nasty purple and yellow bruise.

[JL]

Every gun is different and for me requires a lot of testing and shooting to really know one will shoot with a particular combination.   LOTS and LOTS of testing unless you get a combination you are happy with early on.

... and just wanted to reiterate this. If I hadn't spent time this year really trying to get to know my setup, I'd have never of known that my first shot w/ a clean barrel was always flyer, that I definitely needed a palm saver for a followup shot, and also that the caps I'm using don't slide right on like they did when there was snow on the ground (temperatures/expansion, variances in nipple diameters, who knows)... It's not acceptable to lose wounded game for any of these reasons IMO.