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Author Topic: Help! Which boat do I want?  (Read 11906 times)

Offline Crunchy

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Re: Help! Which boat do I want?
« Reply #15 on: March 09, 2018, 11:09:02 PM »
This model although older is a solid boat.  Fished in Neah Bay,.Port Angeles, proving it can handle a decent chop.

16' open tiller PA special "New Bay."
2016 Yamaha 40hp tiller 80ish hours still several years of warranty left
Scotty electric DR
Lowrance 5" with RAM mount
19 gallon in bow gas tank
Lights, bilge, fuse panel
Great shape EZ Loader trailer
Flat fiberglas floor
2 captains chairs with arms rests like new purchased from Uitlander out of his NR
Ill throw in some crab pots

$5500 ****New Price****obo all offers considered

Offline Alchase

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Re: Help! Which boat do I want?
« Reply #16 on: March 10, 2018, 08:16:27 PM »
Tiller all the way in a boat that size.  A wheel wastes so much room and reduces overall utility, imho.  Ride is WAY better in the back in rougher water, far less amplification of movement.  Been there.

Get whatever floorplan you like, you're not going to be busting through an honest 2' chop in either.  In a light sub 1' wind chop that will still allow you to plane, the hull form of the 15' will ride significantly better.

LMAO
My wheel and controls mounted to the side of the boat forward and above the right side split seat.
No floor space taken up at all.
Smokercraft boats are very light boats. Having all the weight in the back, allows the bow to be caught by the wind, more than a balance load would.

I had the boat in both configurations, there is no comparison.

This is the same console I had on my 15 ft, but on a 13 ft Smokercraft.

http://ymarina.channelbladelive.com/searchengine/print.aspx?diid=2428078&Type=A&indid=1&bvdid=19681

I will make a correction, the vertical support takes up a small bit of floor space. But not significant.
« Last Edit: March 10, 2018, 08:33:16 PM by Alchase »
Only 2 defining forces sacrificed themselves for you:
The American Soldier and Jesus Christ. One died for your freedom, the other for your soul.

My rock,
He trains my hands for war and my fingers for battle.
Psalm 144.1

Offline j_h_nimrod

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Re: Help! Which boat do I want?
« Reply #17 on: March 10, 2018, 09:20:58 PM »
Sorry Alchase, I will still disagree with you.  On a boat of that size reaction time is much more important and having to turn a wheel 3-4 turns lock to lock is a huge hindrance when you need to make quick corrections. I have always preferred having an anchor and rode in the bow and fuel amidships. Ride is smoother in the stern with a tiller and you have more flexibility on how you trim the boat. There is also the consideration that if you put on a console you typically gain weight in an already load limited boat with the addition of a console, battery, hydraulic trim/tilt, and electric start.  You can run without all that with a console but it is a pain, or have the same stuff with a tiller unnecessarily. When seas are really nasty and I need to react quick there is no comparison between a console and a tiller, and having the ability to get the bow up easier when necessary is big. A console on a small 15’ or less boat is more of an affectation or a way to feel like your boat is bigger than it really is. My .02...

Offline KFhunter

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Re: Help! Which boat do I want?
« Reply #18 on: March 10, 2018, 09:34:56 PM »
ditch the wheel and get a stick control, they're quick as a tiller and you can sit forward and enjoy the better visibility over the bow.

http://www.boatstoreusa.com/steering/ezy-glide-stick-iii-boat-steering-model-870/

Also not all steering wheels have a lot of turn lock to lock,  I've driven a 14 foot aluminium jet boat over 500hp and the wheel didn't make a full turn lock to lock, it was about 3/4 turn.   You did not take your hands off that wheel when driving to "spin the wheel around" like a typical pleasure boat.  Your hands stayed put at the 10 and 2 position lock to lock (they had too, or you'd loose your grip).   It's all about the ratio and many steering systems have different ratio's available. 

edit
I see he's talking about salt water though, so I agree with a tiller.   I watched those Alaskans out of Seward go in pretty rough water with a small tiller that left me shaking my head but I suspect it was pretty normal for them.   I don't have a lot of salt water experience. 

I'm used to rivers with logs in them so I like to see.  My favorite is a stick control with stand up center console with grab bars.  Your legs are shock absorbers and you can see everything.
« Last Edit: March 10, 2018, 09:50:05 PM by KFhunter »

Offline j_h_nimrod

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Re: Help! Which boat do I want?
« Reply #19 on: March 10, 2018, 10:05:32 PM »
ditch the wheel and get a stick control, they're quick as a tiller and you can sit forward and enjoy the better visibility over the bow.

http://www.boatstoreusa.com/steering/ezy-glide-stick-iii-boat-steering-model-870/

Also not all steering wheels have a lot of turn lock to lock,  I've driven a 14 foot aluminium jet boat over 500hp and the wheel didn't make a full turn lock to lock, it was about 3/4 turn.   You did not take your hands off that wheel when driving to "spin the wheel around" like a typical pleasure boat.  Your hands stayed put at the 10 and 2 position lock to lock (they had too, or you'd loose your grip).   It's all about the ratio and many steering systems have different ratio's available. 

edit
I see he's talking about salt water though, so I agree with a tiller.   I watched those Alaskans out of Seward go in pretty rough water with a small tiller that left me shaking my head but I suspect it was pretty normal for them.   I don't have a lot of salt water experience. 

I'm used to rivers with logs in them so I like to see.  My favorite is a stick control with stand up center console.  Your legs are shock absorbers and you can see everything.

A lot of east coast working boats run the stick controls. From what I have heard the take a bit to get used to, but mega overkill on a 15’ skiff with less than a 40hp outboard.

I have never been able to find a cable option with quick lock to lock ratios. Those 1/2-1 turn systems are usually commercial hydraulic units that would near double the cost of a 15’ skiff and are not commonly available.

Visibility amidships when you need to be on the wheel and throttle is only marginally better that sitting at a tiller, and standing at a tiller is easier than at a side console. There is a reason the majority of jet sleds are tiller.

Offline KFhunter

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Re: Help! Which boat do I want?
« Reply #20 on: March 10, 2018, 11:03:48 PM »
It  can be done, I helped make one. 

but like we agreed for the salt I'd just stick to tiller.

Offline Alchase

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Re: Help! Which boat do I want?
« Reply #21 on: March 11, 2018, 07:27:31 AM »
Sorry Alchase, I will still disagree with you.  On a boat of that size reaction time is much more important and having to turn a wheel 3-4 turns lock to lock is a huge hindrance when you need to make quick corrections. I have always preferred having an anchor and rode in the bow and fuel amidships. Ride is smoother in the stern with a tiller and you have more flexibility on how you trim the boat. There is also the consideration that if you put on a console you typically gain weight in an already load limited boat with the addition of a console, battery, hydraulic trim/tilt, and electric start.  You can run without all that with a console but it is a pain, or have the same stuff with a tiller unnecessarily. When seas are really nasty and I need to react quick there is no comparison between a console and a tiller, and having the ability to get the bow up easier when necessary is big. A console on a small 15’ or less boat is more of an affectation or a way to feel like your boat is bigger than it really is. My .02...

J_H_Nimrod, You obviously make valid points, but he is not talking about a skiff to be used in rough water out on the salt. He is talking about a riveted lake boat to be used for occasional crabbing.
Both the models he asked about the only room for a gas tank is in the rear in the well next to the motor. The floors are ribbed and curved. Our neighbor on Hood Canal Put his tank under the middle bench. He loves it. Both models Switchback is talking about, do not have the middle bench. The consoles I bought from Smokercraft for small boats, are aluminum, with the wheel and throttle. One hydraulic line and one throttle cable.
No battery, hydraulic trim/tilt, or electric start necessary.

Switchback, either of your choices will do. I would go for the biggest you can afford.
One add on I have added to all of my small boats are "Smart Tabs", they are a piece of cake to install and help a small boat and get you on a plane quickly and reduce cavitation.

http://nauticusinc.com/smart-tabs/
Only 2 defining forces sacrificed themselves for you:
The American Soldier and Jesus Christ. One died for your freedom, the other for your soul.

My rock,
He trains my hands for war and my fingers for battle.
Psalm 144.1

Offline KFhunter

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Re: Help! Which boat do I want?
« Reply #22 on: March 11, 2018, 08:05:13 AM »
I'd want a wide boat for crabbing in good water conditions, obviously we'd all hope he's not pulling pots in rough water with a 14' boat. 

I have a Kalamath 14', it's made for cutting through bigger water (for a small boat) but it's not suitable to hanging over the side pulling pots as it's tippy.  I've never pulled crab pots with it, but I have pulled crawdad pots with it in lakes and they weigh a lot less than a crab pot and still I tip the boat even doing that, a loaded crab pot might get hairy. 


Speaking of davits, if a guy had one mounted between the seats in the center of the boat stuck in a pedestal mount and it had enough arm to swing over the side and yard up a pot that'd really help keep things safer.

Actually,  I use a Columbia river anchor system on my Dad's boat, it's slick.   You stick an anchor ball on the rope then drive, the ball float slides down the rope and submerges until it pops the anchor off the bottom then you keep on driving until the ball float smacks the anchor, then you just pull in slack line.   You could do that with a crab pot in a small boat and save your arms and not tip the boat pulling a stuck pot.  Drop the pot in outgoing tide, fish during the slack, then pick it up in the incoming tide (or vise verse) - the anchor ball float would be perfect for that.
« Last Edit: March 11, 2018, 08:23:52 AM by KFhunter »

Offline Alchase

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Re: Help! Which boat do I want?
« Reply #23 on: March 11, 2018, 08:27:43 AM »
Any deep-V small boat can get dicey leaning over the side, especially trying to pull a heavy crab pot.
We use our 13 ft Boston Whaler with a manual crank usually for crab. You get a pretty good workout hauling a couple pots, LOL.
It stays up at our cabin on Hood Canal year round.
Only 2 defining forces sacrificed themselves for you:
The American Soldier and Jesus Christ. One died for your freedom, the other for your soul.

My rock,
He trains my hands for war and my fingers for battle.
Psalm 144.1

Offline KFhunter

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Re: Help! Which boat do I want?
« Reply #24 on: March 11, 2018, 08:30:08 AM »
This is what I use



You want to make sure you get a rope lock that you can use on multiple lines, a lot of anchor pullers stay on one line..but the orvals ez pull snaps on and off so you can use it on multiple lines.   The rope lock I use stays on the anchor line and would be difficult to switch from line to line, I haven't tried the orvals ez pull but it has good reviews I wouldn't hesitate to try it on crab pots.

Offline j_h_nimrod

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Re: Help! Which boat do I want?
« Reply #25 on: March 11, 2018, 09:28:32 AM »
I used a similar unit and it worked very well for an anchor but I did not have great luck using it with pots. I used it on shrimp pots in 400’ of water and the pot just has too much drag for the systems I have tried. For small pots it would probably work fine, but I would just prefer to hand pull with light pots under 100’. One way I did use it pulling pots was as a brake so I could rest.

Whatever you do, don’t try one of these line pull systems tied off to the stern!  Always pull tied to the bow.

Offline Alchase

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Re: Help! Which boat do I want?
« Reply #26 on: March 11, 2018, 01:44:41 PM »
This is what I use



You want to make sure you get a rope lock that you can use on multiple lines, a lot of anchor pullers stay on one line..but the orvals ez pull snaps on and off so you can use it on multiple lines.   The rope lock I use stays on the anchor line and would be difficult to switch from line to line, I haven't tried the orvals ez pull but it has good reviews I wouldn't hesitate to try it on crab pots.

Pretty slick! Sure beats our old knuckle busting hand crank, LOL
Only 2 defining forces sacrificed themselves for you:
The American Soldier and Jesus Christ. One died for your freedom, the other for your soul.

My rock,
He trains my hands for war and my fingers for battle.
Psalm 144.1

Offline KFhunter

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Re: Help! Which boat do I want?
« Reply #27 on: March 11, 2018, 04:27:06 PM »
I used a similar unit and it worked very well for an anchor but I did not have great luck using it with pots. I used it on shrimp pots in 400’ of water and the pot just has too much drag for the systems I have tried. For small pots it would probably work fine, but I would just prefer to hand pull with light pots under 100’. One way I did use it pulling pots was as a brake so I could rest.

Whatever you do, don’t try one of these line pull systems tied off to the stern!  Always pull tied to the bow.

 :yeah:


even on the bigger boat we use the bow and just follow the line back to the anchor keeping it to the starboard side where the driver can see it so it's clear of the prop, then over the anchor, then keep going in the same direction and it's always popped up.  We do break a zip tie once in a while if the anchor gets hung on a rock and trips, flipping over to release.

Offline Switchback

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Re: Help! Which boat do I want?
« Reply #28 on: March 12, 2018, 09:23:19 AM »
Thank you guys for all the input! I think I'll definitely stick with tiller steer, I want to keep the layout as open as possible. And I'm not going to be pulling crab pots (or doing anything besides head to the shore) in rough water – just not worth it.

I do have two more questions, because I'm new to saltwater. Is it best to get a saltwater trolling motor? I'd mostly use it in lakes, but I imagine myself having a sweet squid setup at some point, and it would be nice to have it instead of an anchor. Maybe people use it for salmon too.

Also, is a handheld VHF radio something I should get? I really don't think I'm ever going to be out in the actual ocean, but I'm not sure if I need one for weather updates or something. Doesn't seem necessary but figured I'd check.

Offline Crunchy

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Re: Help! Which boat do I want?
« Reply #29 on: March 12, 2018, 09:50:22 AM »
Many of the newer motors have electronically controlled throttles, so you can probably get by without a kicker motor.  For a 14 ft boat you probably don't need anything bigger than a 25-40 hp motor.  So make sure you find a motor that has that ability to throttle down and you will be good to go. 

From Honda website
The BF40 and BF50 are an outstanding combination of Honda’s legendary four-stroke engineering and our latest outboard innovations. The result? The lightest, most compact engines in their class. And because they are from Honda, they’re loaded with the unparalleled features and technology you want.

Like BLAST (Boosted Low Speed Torque). It’s activated by a quick movement of the throttle for vastly improved hole shots.

Programmed Electronic Fuel Injection, for easy starts, instant throttle response, slower trolling speeds, and overall better fuel economy.

 


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