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Author Topic: It begins again, more wolf cattle kills 2018  (Read 3600 times)

Offline KFhunter

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It begins again, more wolf cattle kills 2018
« on: May 24, 2018, 08:49:56 AM »
http://www.capitalpress.com/Livestock/20180523/wolves-kill-calf-rancher-rethinks-grazing-plan

Wolves kill calf; rancher rethinks grazing plan
Cattleman says his grazing allotment in the Colville National Forest has been great, but wolves may drive him out.

A northeast Washington rancher says he may quit a U.S. Forest Service grazing allotment that hes had since the 1980s after wolves killed one of his calves Sunday in northern Ferry County.

Ron Eslick, 71, said the Black Angus calf, a week and a half old, was the first animal hes lost to wolves, as far as he knows. He said he will look into grazing on private pastures this summer rather than risk losing more livestock on an open range.

Its been a perfect range, Eslick said. I dont want to give it up, but Im not going to feed the wolves.

Several sources said the Department of Fish and Wildlife confirmed that the calf was killed by wolves. The department did not respond to requests for details and confirmation.

Its unclear which wolfpack attacked the calf, though the herd was close to the Togo packs territory in northern Ferry County. Togo was one of four new packs identified by Fish and Wildlife in 2017. It has not been officially blamed for any previous depredations.

Eslick has a permit to graze cattle on the Jasper allotment in the Colville National Forest.

Eslick said a neighbor saw the wolf over the calf. The wolf left, leaving the partially eaten carcass.

A lot of the quarters were eaten off, he said. If we had come two hours later, it would have been eaten and nobody would have known anything about it.

Eslick said the calf was killed about 600 yards from his brothers home and was found on federal land just inside the boundary with private land north of Orient, an unincorporated community that borders Stevens County.

Eslick said officials suggested he could put flashing lights on the 1,300-acre allotment to prevent wolf attacks. He said hes checking on the condition of fences on pastures about 12 miles away.

Fish and Wildlife has adopted a policy of releasing information about wolf attacks on its own delayed schedule.

I dont think WDFW has a lot of interest in telling people whats happening up here, Cattle Producers of Washington President Scott Nielsen said. Theres been less information, and its getting progressively worse.




Quote
I dont think WDFW has a lot of interest in telling people whats happening up here,
No, so I will.  We all need to share the information.

Offline jackelope

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Re: It begins again, more wolf cattle kills 2018
« Reply #1 on: May 24, 2018, 09:31:29 AM »
I'm curious how the rancher thinks putting his cattle on private pasture will help? Maybe it's in a different location?
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Offline boneaddict

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Re: It begins again, more wolf cattle kills 2018
« Reply #2 on: May 24, 2018, 09:34:08 AM »
Dang!   Good people too.   

Offline pianoman9701

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Re: It begins again, more wolf cattle kills 2018
« Reply #3 on: May 24, 2018, 09:43:10 AM »
I'm opposed to poaching. But when the state refuses to be forthright about the damage caused by wolves and continues to pander to DOW and CNW instead of protecting the livelihoods and safety of our NE residents, I would be completely understanding of those who would take matters into their own hands to do so for themselves. This program has gone so far off the tracks it's unbelievable.
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Offline Special T

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Re: It begins again, more wolf cattle kills 2018
« Reply #4 on: May 24, 2018, 10:17:44 AM »
Isn't this what the enviros want? Ranching off public land?

The irony should be thick that we will see more feed lots when these same kinds of people want free range grass fed beef.

I've heard ranching skeptics say that ranchers are on gov welfare because of thier cheep rent... If they stop renting is it really cheep enough? How does the USFS propose to make up the revenue? They certainly don't log enough...

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Offline Ridgeratt

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Re: It begins again, more wolf cattle kills 2018
« Reply #5 on: May 24, 2018, 10:32:11 AM »
Eslick said officials suggested he could put flashing lights on the 1,300-acre allotment to prevent wolf attacks. He said hes checking on the condition of fences on pastures about 12 miles away.



This is Brilliant!!  :yike: :yike:  Who is going to pay for the lights and just how did they propose to run them? And how many lights do you need on that much area? How far apart are they reccomending on spacing?


Offline Oh Mah

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Re: It begins again, more wolf cattle kills 2018
« Reply #6 on: May 24, 2018, 11:17:24 AM »
Obviously the wolves are smarter than these people,Wolves will study these flashing lights,test them no fear and then go right on by.this is as bad as a milk jug of water on property line will keep cats out.  :bash:
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Offline boneaddict

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Re: It begins again, more wolf cattle kills 2018
« Reply #7 on: May 24, 2018, 11:29:08 AM »
Is that why these wolves are deterred from crossing freeways. Lol.    (Sarcasm)

Offline idahohuntr

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Re: It begins again, more wolf cattle kills 2018
« Reply #8 on: May 24, 2018, 11:47:42 AM »
Isn't this what the enviros want? Ranching off public land?

The irony should be thick that we will see more feed lots when these same kinds of people want free range grass fed beef.

I've heard ranching skeptics say that ranchers are on gov welfare because of thier cheep rent... If they stop renting is it really cheep enough? How does the USFS propose to make up the revenue? They certainly don't log enough...

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I support capitalism and free markets...if a rancher determines the costs are too great to continue grazing on public lands then he is free to move or change his operation in any manner consistent with law to ensure he maintains a profit.  Part of the cost/benefit analysis needs to be expected losses as a result of predators if you choose to graze in areas where predators are present.   
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood..." - TR

Offline nwwanderer

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Re: It begins again, more wolf cattle kills 2018
« Reply #9 on: May 24, 2018, 12:24:44 PM »
A rancher is not 'free' to move.  He may choose to go stop, sell out, but move?  You do not just pick up new grazing for a herd and in the long run the loss is to all of us.  Those critters are food, supply down, cost up.  On top of that the value of the grazing allotment decreases as possible returns fall and the returns on public land collapses.  DNR, USFS and BLM all cry to you for more general fund money.  Not just a concept, has happened all over the west.  Be careful what you ask for.

Offline pianoman9701

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Re: It begins again, more wolf cattle kills 2018
« Reply #10 on: May 24, 2018, 12:46:55 PM »
Isn't this what the enviros want? Ranching off public land?

The irony should be thick that we will see more feed lots when these same kinds of people want free range grass fed beef.

I've heard ranching skeptics say that ranchers are on gov welfare because of thier cheep rent... If they stop renting is it really cheep enough? How does the USFS propose to make up the revenue? They certainly don't log enough...

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930A using Tapatalk
I support capitalism and free markets...if a rancher determines the costs are too great to continue grazing on public lands then he is free to move or change his operation in any manner consistent with law to ensure he maintains a profit.  Part of the cost/benefit analysis needs to be expected losses as a result of predators if you choose to graze in areas where predators are present.

You final statement ignores the facts of ranching history. Most of the people who started ranches in that area had already dealt with and controlled a majority of the predators who threatened their assets and livelihood. Bringing the wolves back came after they made their "choices" decades prior. It is a fact that many of the ranchers rejected the wolf plan exactly because of that - they'd built their ranches and homes for generations, understanding they had the government's support and indeed, their help in controlling wolves. You may go on to say that they have a choice to stay in the ranching business but that's not really a choice at all.
"Restricting the rights of law-abiding citizens based on the actions of criminals and madmen will have no positive effect on the future acts of criminals and madmen. It will only serve to reduce individual rights and the very security of our republic." - Pianoman

Offline idahohuntr

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Re: It begins again, more wolf cattle kills 2018
« Reply #11 on: May 24, 2018, 01:09:32 PM »
Isn't this what the enviros want? Ranching off public land?

The irony should be thick that we will see more feed lots when these same kinds of people want free range grass fed beef.

I've heard ranching skeptics say that ranchers are on gov welfare because of thier cheep rent... If they stop renting is it really cheep enough? How does the USFS propose to make up the revenue? They certainly don't log enough...

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930A using Tapatalk
I support capitalism and free markets...if a rancher determines the costs are too great to continue grazing on public lands then he is free to move or change his operation in any manner consistent with law to ensure he maintains a profit.  Part of the cost/benefit analysis needs to be expected losses as a result of predators if you choose to graze in areas where predators are present.

You final statement ignores the facts of ranching history. Most of the people who started ranches in that area had already dealt with and controlled a majority of the predators who threatened their assets and livelihood. Bringing the wolves back came after they made their "choices" decades prior. It is a fact that many of the ranchers rejected the wolf plan exactly because of that - they'd built their ranches and homes for generations, understanding they had the government's support and indeed, their help in controlling wolves. You may go on to say that they have a choice to stay in the ranching business but that's not really a choice at all.
So in an ever changing world it's the governments responsibility to support ranchers forever?  Again, I will defer to capitalism. 
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood..." - TR

Offline pianoman9701

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Re: It begins again, more wolf cattle kills 2018
« Reply #12 on: May 24, 2018, 01:13:22 PM »
Did I say that the government should support the ranchers? No, I didn't say anything even resembling that. What I said was those predators' protections weren't part of the equation when the ranchers' ancestors "made the choice" to settle there. Rightfully, wolves were being heavily controlled and that control was being pushed by the government with equal fervor as the cattlemen. It was the government which changed the rules of the game.
"Restricting the rights of law-abiding citizens based on the actions of criminals and madmen will have no positive effect on the future acts of criminals and madmen. It will only serve to reduce individual rights and the very security of our republic." - Pianoman

Offline KFhunter

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Re: It begins again, more wolf cattle kills 2018
« Reply #13 on: May 24, 2018, 04:28:31 PM »
Isn't this what the enviros want? Ranching off public land?

The irony should be thick that we will see more feed lots when these same kinds of people want free range grass fed beef.

I've heard ranching skeptics say that ranchers are on gov welfare because of thier cheep rent... If they stop renting is it really cheep enough? How does the USFS propose to make up the revenue? They certainly don't log enough...

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930A using Tapatalk
I support capitalism and free markets...if a rancher determines the costs are too great to continue grazing on public lands then he is free to move or change his operation in any manner consistent with law to ensure he maintains a profit.  Part of the cost/benefit analysis needs to be expected losses as a result of predators if you choose to graze in areas where predators are present.

You final statement ignores the facts of ranching history. Most of the people who started ranches in that area had already dealt with and controlled a majority of the predators who threatened their assets and livelihood. Bringing the wolves back came after they made their "choices" decades prior. It is a fact that many of the ranchers rejected the wolf plan exactly because of that - they'd built their ranches and homes for generations, understanding they had the government's support and indeed, their help in controlling wolves. You may go on to say that they have a choice to stay in the ranching business but that's not really a choice at all.
So in an ever changing world it's the governments responsibility to support ranchers forever?  Again, I will defer to capitalism.

Your argument is flawed, more livestock have been killed by wolves on private ground than on public grazing leases, you know this, we've discussed it, you don't care. This "capitalism" argument that your using now is as disingenuous as you are.

Offline jackelope

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Re: It begins again, more wolf cattle kills 2018
« Reply #14 on: May 24, 2018, 04:33:41 PM »
So my question is legit then....
 :dunno:

I'm curious how the rancher thinks putting his cattle on private pasture will help? Maybe it's in a different location?
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