Free: Contests & Raffles.
Quote from: Bango skank on May 24, 2018, 10:25:15 PMYou took a general zoology class a couple decades ago, and youre typing from your keyboard 300+ miles from the wolf problem. Maybe you should just shut your mouth.This just seems unproductive. What viable solution do you propose do deal with the wolves? I just pointed out that wolves are a native species, not an invasive species. If WDFW were introducing something like hyenas this would be a different issue since they're non-native.Quote from: bearpaw on May 25, 2018, 08:10:45 AMA cougar killed 1 calf and 4 lambs at a ranch near Colville. The lambs were killed in and drug out of the back yard! Same rancher had cattle chewed up by wolves last year!This massive increase in livestock predation over the last two decades is a direct result of a lack of predator management. I'm saying it again, this rests squarely on the shoulders of politicians and wdfw management who refuse to manage predators in Washington and pander to the anti-hunting groups.It's against forum rules for me to say what I what I think about some of the pathetic comments I've read in this topic! None of these ranchers had serious problems until predator numbers were allowed to explode. Maybe every business in America should have to allow thieves to roam their stores and take whatever they like, that would just be a change in society that all businesses should have to deal with! WOW I understand where you're coming from with this, but what do you propose as a solution? I agree that predator management is an issue and I get why ranchers and others, like yourself, who are financially impacted by the issue are so passionate about it. I fully support hunting as a method of controlling predator populations. Fairly often I'll here the "kill 'em all" line from folks though and that's an unrealistic perspective. The wolves aren't going to go away entirely and I think it's foolish to believe that will ever be a realistic expectation. So if there's always going to be conflict between ranchers and wolves, what's an acceptable percentage of loss that the ranchers should be expected to absorb? When I worked as a department head/buyer for a small grocery store I was responsible for monitoring "shrinkage" for my department, not including scrap loss from perishable items. The obvious goal was have that number come in at zero but that wasn't realistic. 1.5-2% was considered acceptable and anything over 2.5% was a serious issue. A certain percentage of loss was expected as a part of doing business. I'll admit to being ignorant when it comes to the finances of running a large cattle operation, so I really am curious what's the percentage of gross revenue being lost to predators (specifically wolves)? Does that number factor in reimbursement (if any) provided by the state to help offset some of the loss? More importantly, what are realistic profit margins for a cattle operation when averaged out over 5 years to account for market cycles? I assume they operate on a pretty low margin so a loss of 2% every year could be crippling if a good year is only a 10% profit to begin with. But if they're operating on something like a 30% margin under normal circumstances then that 2% loss is much easier to absorb if the owner is really serious about staying in the ranching business or "life style".
You took a general zoology class a couple decades ago, and youre typing from your keyboard 300+ miles from the wolf problem. Maybe you should just shut your mouth.
A cougar killed 1 calf and 4 lambs at a ranch near Colville. The lambs were killed in and drug out of the back yard! Same rancher had cattle chewed up by wolves last year!This massive increase in livestock predation over the last two decades is a direct result of a lack of predator management. I'm saying it again, this rests squarely on the shoulders of politicians and wdfw management who refuse to manage predators in Washington and pander to the anti-hunting groups.It's against forum rules for me to say what I what I think about some of the pathetic comments I've read in this topic! None of these ranchers had serious problems until predator numbers were allowed to explode. Maybe every business in America should have to allow thieves to roam their stores and take whatever they like, that would just be a change in society that all businesses should have to deal with! WOW
WDF&wolves and Washingtons WildlifeWhile we ponder what to do about wolf/livestock predation……. out in the brushsns=fb
Answer for Wolves: Allow Management Of The Wolves Like Other SpeciesAnswer for Cougar: Quit reducing the quotas, we are practically to the point that cats are not being hunted at all, and history shows that when more cougar hunting took place we did not have near as many predation problems.Since Idaho has started hunting wolves the problems have been greatly reduced. I never said a single word about killing every wolf, I don't think I've ever said that in my entire life, I have no idea where you come up with that.
We've all heard the catechisms "smoke a pack a day" "kill em all" "SSS" and that's all they are, catechisms. When it comes down to the brass tacks no one expects that they'll all be killed, or even could be killed, and if they truly do want 100% of the wolves killed then so be it, it's irrelevant, it won't happen, it can't happen. It's an empty argument to keep throwing this in all our faces.
Quote from: idahohuntr on May 25, 2018, 08:17:59 AMQuote from: bearpaw on May 25, 2018, 08:10:45 AMA cougar killed 1 calf and 4 lambs at a ranch near Colville. The lambs were killed in and drug out of the back yard! Same rancher had cattle chewed up by wolves last year!This massive increase in livestock predation over the last two decades is a direct result of a lack of predator management. I'm saying it again, this rests squarely on the shoulders of politicians and wdfw management who refuse to manage predators in Washington and pander to the anti-hunting groups.It's against forum rules for me to say what I what I think about some of the pathetic comments I've read in this topic! None of these ranchers had serious problems until predator numbers were allowed to explode. Maybe every business in America should have to allow thieves to roam their stores and take whatever they like, that would just be a change in society that all businesses should have to deal with! WOW No, it's more like some business owners recognize theft could be a factor in profits, and so they invest in ways to minimize those losses. Other businesses might turn a blind eye to theft and say its the governments responsibility to always protect them from any theft so they don't lift a finger. If theft becomes a major problem...who do you think remains in business?Cattlemen hardly want to look to the government for help. They're forced to because of the ridiculous regulations keeping them from protecting their assets. The government is hardly their protector in all of this. Rightfully, they should be able to shoot on site, trap, or poison those thieves without being required to obtain government intervention or permission.
Quote from: bearpaw on May 25, 2018, 08:10:45 AMA cougar killed 1 calf and 4 lambs at a ranch near Colville. The lambs were killed in and drug out of the back yard! Same rancher had cattle chewed up by wolves last year!This massive increase in livestock predation over the last two decades is a direct result of a lack of predator management. I'm saying it again, this rests squarely on the shoulders of politicians and wdfw management who refuse to manage predators in Washington and pander to the anti-hunting groups.It's against forum rules for me to say what I what I think about some of the pathetic comments I've read in this topic! None of these ranchers had serious problems until predator numbers were allowed to explode. Maybe every business in America should have to allow thieves to roam their stores and take whatever they like, that would just be a change in society that all businesses should have to deal with! WOW No, it's more like some business owners recognize theft could be a factor in profits, and so they invest in ways to minimize those losses. Other businesses might turn a blind eye to theft and say its the governments responsibility to always protect them from any theft so they don't lift a finger. If theft becomes a major problem...who do you think remains in business?
Quote from: pianoman9701 on May 25, 2018, 08:26:35 AMQuote from: idahohuntr on May 25, 2018, 08:17:59 AMQuote from: bearpaw on May 25, 2018, 08:10:45 AMA cougar killed 1 calf and 4 lambs at a ranch near Colville. The lambs were killed in and drug out of the back yard! Same rancher had cattle chewed up by wolves last year!This massive increase in livestock predation over the last two decades is a direct result of a lack of predator management. I'm saying it again, this rests squarely on the shoulders of politicians and wdfw management who refuse to manage predators in Washington and pander to the anti-hunting groups.It's against forum rules for me to say what I what I think about some of the pathetic comments I've read in this topic! None of these ranchers had serious problems until predator numbers were allowed to explode. Maybe every business in America should have to allow thieves to roam their stores and take whatever they like, that would just be a change in society that all businesses should have to deal with! WOW No, it's more like some business owners recognize theft could be a factor in profits, and so they invest in ways to minimize those losses. Other businesses might turn a blind eye to theft and say its the governments responsibility to always protect them from any theft so they don't lift a finger. If theft becomes a major problem...who do you think remains in business?Cattlemen hardly want to look to the government for help. They're forced to because of the ridiculous regulations keeping them from protecting their assets. The government is hardly their protector in all of this. Rightfully, they should be able to shoot on site, trap, or poison those thieves without being required to obtain government intervention or permission.Do you feel the same about deer and elk?
Quote from: Tbar on May 26, 2018, 07:49:46 AMQuote from: pianoman9701 on May 25, 2018, 08:26:35 AMQuote from: idahohuntr on May 25, 2018, 08:17:59 AMQuote from: bearpaw on May 25, 2018, 08:10:45 AMA cougar killed 1 calf and 4 lambs at a ranch near Colville. The lambs were killed in and drug out of the back yard! Same rancher had cattle chewed up by wolves last year!This massive increase in livestock predation over the last two decades is a direct result of a lack of predator management. I'm saying it again, this rests squarely on the shoulders of politicians and wdfw management who refuse to manage predators in Washington and pander to the anti-hunting groups.It's against forum rules for me to say what I what I think about some of the pathetic comments I've read in this topic! None of these ranchers had serious problems until predator numbers were allowed to explode. Maybe every business in America should have to allow thieves to roam their stores and take whatever they like, that would just be a change in society that all businesses should have to deal with! WOW No, it's more like some business owners recognize theft could be a factor in profits, and so they invest in ways to minimize those losses. Other businesses might turn a blind eye to theft and say its the governments responsibility to always protect them from any theft so they don't lift a finger. If theft becomes a major problem...who do you think remains in business?Cattlemen hardly want to look to the government for help. They're forced to because of the ridiculous regulations keeping them from protecting their assets. The government is hardly their protector in all of this. Rightfully, they should be able to shoot on site, trap, or poison those thieves without being required to obtain government intervention or permission.Do you feel the same about deer and elk?I believe orchardists can shoot deer if they are damaging their trees.
Quote from: bearpaw on May 25, 2018, 05:55:56 PMAnswer for Wolves: Allow Management Of The Wolves Like Other SpeciesAnswer for Cougar: Quit reducing the quotas, we are practically to the point that cats are not being hunted at all, and history shows that when more cougar hunting took place we did not have near as many predation problems.Since Idaho has started hunting wolves the problems have been greatly reduced. I never said a single word about killing every wolf, I don't think I've ever said that in my entire life, I have no idea where you come up with that.Sorry Dale, I didn't mean to imply that you've ever supported the elimination of wolves entirely. The Idaho model is pretty much what I'd expect to be a realistic management plan. Whether or not that will be applied in WA is tough to say.
Supporting KF and bearpaw. 2 individuals with much more experience than others.Ignore the trolls, good points. For the record, I am a capitalist[not sure what it matters here.] A good debater could argue either way, however there is only 1 right way. Thx for the info gentlemen.
