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Author Topic: Pelosi Claims Future President Could Use “National Emergency” to Target Guns  (Read 10522 times)

Offline bigtex

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Well, Harry Reid didn't think that ending the filibuster for SCOTUS candidates would be an issue either. My personal opinion is that Trump has been sitting on his ass on this for two years and all of a sudden, it's an emergency. He'd have gotten the funding a year ago or the year before. But he didn't. He and the Republicans blew this and now they're going to set a precedent that's going to come back and bite us lowly citizens when the Ds have their ax to grind on guns.
:yeah:

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Offline bearpaw

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Maybe I'm wrong but didn't he try to congress to act? :dunno:
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I know it doesn't speak to the national emergency abuse and potential for its misuse in the future, but... who's gonna unbuild the wall? Lots of those kinds of moves are undone by the next administration, but who would unbuild the wall?

I agree, it lacked foresight, and might have been a "legacy" move for ego... but it may well get the job done. Score one more for the businessman vs the lawyers.

The future looks pretty sketchy on many fronts these days... this is just one of them. Murdering babies as they lie on the table next to their mothers... united socialist states of amerika…  we have many things to address, or decide how to live alongside in the future. In the big picture this is minor, and a win for a guy wanting to be remembered. I get the feeling that's the thought process behind it.
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Offline bearpaw

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Trump Wall...  :chuckle:
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Offline Fl0und3rz

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Quote
Monday’s vote marked the first time the House or Senate has tried to terminate a presidential declaration of a national emergency, using the provisions of the National Emergencies Act of 1976.

https://www.weaselzippers.us/412084-house-rejects-trump-emergency-declaration-setting-up-potential-veto-showdown/

Talk about unprecedented.

 :chuckle:

Offline pianoman9701

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Maybe I'm wrong but didn't he try to congress to act? :dunno:

Yes, he waited two years for an unfriendly House and then asked them to act.  :bash:

It's OK to call out our leaders on stuff they fail to do. I like a lot of what Trump's done. This? Not so much. It was his most repeated and important promise. He dropped the ball.
"Restricting the rights of law-abiding citizens based on the actions of criminals and madmen will have no positive effect on the future acts of criminals and madmen. It will only serve to reduce individual rights and the very security of our republic." - Pianoman https://linktr.ee/johnlwallace https://valoaneducator.tv/johnwallace-2014743

Offline Fl0und3rz

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OK, let's rewrite history.

How many CR's could Trump get through Congress without dem support or with dem obstructionism during the 2017-2018 fiscal years, when Republicans held the majority in both chambers?


0.0


The last CR battle, Rs put up a crapfest and skipped town leaving Trump holding the bag.  Thanks, Ryan.  He did get some wins out of if, such as a 3-4x normal allotment toward military spending.


But let's not pretend that Trump did not attempt to get wall funding when Rs held a majority in both chambers.

Quote
There are a few major things the Republicans can accomplish on their own without Democratic support, including dismantling many of the key elements of the Affordable Care Act using a byzantine budget process called reconciliation.

But Republicans will ultimately discover that it will be impossible for them to pass many other measures without Democratic support, because of the constant threat of a filibuster in the Senate that would require at least 60 votes to overcome.

http://www.thefiscaltimes.com/2016/11/18/Congress-Gives-Trump-Chance-Recast-Federal-Budget


Quote
The White House previously signaled it was backing down from Trump’s demand for $5 billion in wall funding and aides had privately offered assurances that the president plans to sign the bill.

Trump on Thursday morning also signaled he was poised to accept a funding measure without wall funding, tweeting that “with so much talk about the Wall, people are losing sight of the great job being done on our Southern Border by Border Patrol, ICE and our great Military.”

But the president’s frustration appears to have built as conservative commentators like Ann Coulter and Laura Ingraham accused him of caving on his demands for $5 billion in wall money.

The scenario resembles the fight in March over a $1.3 trillion omnibus spending package.

Trump begrudgingly signed the measure just hours after threatening to veto it, and vowed to never again sign similar legislation.

"I say to Congress, I will never sign another bill like this again,” Trump said during a press conference. “I'm not going to do it again. Nobody read it. It's only hours old. Some people don't even know what’s in it.”

https://thehill.com/homenews/administration/422261-trump-vents-frustration-over-wall-funding-fueling-uncertainty-over

Quote
Trump signs the $1.3 trillion spending bill after threatening veto

March 23, 2018


. . .

On Friday, President Trump confirmed that he signed the omnibus spending bill. Hours before, Trump considered vetoing the bill, citing a lack of support for his DACA deal and proposed border wall funding. "I say to Congress, I will never sign another bill like this again," he said during a press conference.

https://twitter.com/i/moments/977201282602749953


You wanted him to work through Congress.  He tried.  Twice. You faulted him for not holding fast on his pledge to shutdown the government this last CR.  He did. 

Now you fault him for not attempting to work with Congress during a time when he Rs had the majority, but still need Ds to support the agenda and $5B in border spending.  This assumption that he didn't attempt it earlier is mistaken.


I blame Trump for not holding fast on the shutdown, during a time when it appears that the pain felt by Americans would have increased, the media would have sided with Ds, and the President's support would have, as a result, eroded.  Is this an unreasonable assignment of blame?  Probably.

I mostly blame him for the unreasonable assumption that Congress Rs and Ds would not put politics above national security and the welfare of Americans.  Is this an unreasonable expectation to assume that Congress would put politics aside and work together to the benefit of Americans and national security?  Apparently so.


During that time, he also worked with Congress to attempt to repeal obamacare, a show vote and a betrayal of Americans for McCain, and a monumental waste of time.  He also helped deliver tax reform, which, by elimination of the obamacare penalty, may yet see the overturn of obamacare in the courts. There was also two SCOTUS confirmations, the least of which is the Kavanaugh show trial which consumed quite a bit of Congressional bandwidth.  The point being is that there were only a few instances in which the wall funding came up, and he did in fact attempt to work with Congress, despite needing some D support to pass the CRs.  That effort failed. 


You can't expect him to work with Congress, fault him for not working with Congress, when he did, then fault him for using existing statutory authority when the Ds prove intransigent and uninterested in national security and American's welfare throughout the process (in the minority, in the majority, and in the courts).  You can.  But it should be based in reality and not in a rewritten version of history.

 :tup:

Offline Fl0und3rz

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Quote
Don’t be surprised but Madame Speaker is being disingenuous. If Trump hadn’t declared a national emergency, it wouldn’t have reduced the likelihood of a future Democrat president declaring one for whatever he thought to be an emergency. As Barack Obama’s weaponizing of the IRS, the FBI, and other federal agencies demonstrated, power placed in Democrat hands is used whether doing so is in keeping with statesmanly tradition, is ethical, or is even legal. So, we can confidently predict, that like the sun rising tomorrow or Rep. Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez saying something nutty, a Democrat president will do whatever it takes to advance the Democrat agenda. But will a presidential declaration of a national emergency (hereafter, PDNE) by a Dem prez work for the causes Lefties find delightful?

Pelosi explicitly mentioned increasing gun control using a PDNE. Extending and improving border barriers that already exist and destroying a fundamental right enumerated in the U.S. Constitution aren’t, however, the same thing. Such an effort would bring a quick trip to the Supreme Court, where it would be unlikely to prevail. Additionally, over 326 million firearms are in private hands and it will be difficult to gather them up. A 2014 effort in California to confiscate 21,249 guns owned by convicted felons and domestic violence offenders collected just 3,770 guns. The guns were registered so the collecting officers had the names of the owners, their addresses, and the number of weapons they owned. They spent nearly $10 million of a $25 million appropriation or about $2500 per gun and left 17,479 of the targeted weapons uncollected. Imagine a similar effort to collect all American guns. The cost would be enormous and we haven’t mentioned the costs of hunting down guns less readily found nor of imprisoning those who resisted confiscation nor of diverting law enforcement from their normal duties nor of the costs of crimes that would otherwise be prevented by those officers and gun owners lawfully using their guns. The needed police intrusion into millions of lives would be an incredible imposition on America. While anti-gun voices might protest that no guns would mean no gun deaths and that confiscation would thereby be justified, it’s hard to imagine a gun confiscation effort that would collect all guns and keep criminals from obtaining a firearm. At best, it would make guns a highly valuable black market item to smuggle into America or to make in an ordinary machine shop.

https://spectator.org/the-bogeyman-isnt-real/

Offline RJW

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So how many here are old enough to remember the Berlin wall? That one was ineffective and we will never have one here as well armed. I know he say walls work, but they don't.  There are far more effective was to secure the wall these days using technology.  What bothers me is that conservatives used to believe in fiscal responsibility, that seems to have gone by the wayside.  I miss the Grand old party of the 70's and 80's.
Everyone is superman behind the keyboard

Offline bobcat

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The wall is only part of the total package for border security. Our own border patrol says a fence/wall would be beneficial and is needed in certain areas. They would know. Give them what they need to keep people from coming across our border illegally. A change in laws/policy is also needed so that people caught could be immediately deported. Also ending birthright citizenship would go a long way in reducing the number of people trying to illegally get into our country.

Offline pianoman9701

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So how many here are old enough to remember the Berlin wall? That one was ineffective and we will never have one here as well armed. I know he say walls work, but they don't.  There are far more effective was to secure the wall these days using technology.  What bothers me is that conservatives used to believe in fiscal responsibility, that seems to have gone by the wayside.  I miss the Grand old party of the 70's and 80's.

I remember the Berlin wall and it was very effective. Escapes from E. Berlin were far from massive, certainly not anywhere near the scope of illegal entries by our southern border.. The few that succeeded were big news. The many that didn't were even bigger news. As far as our southern border is concerned, everywhere a wall has been built, illegal entry at that point has decreased by a significant and measurable amount - El Paso, San Diego - big successes. You may say "yeah, but they just go somewhere else to cross." That's why we need a completed border wall and enhanced security. Walls do work and every single member of Congress who has one around their property has one for a reason
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Online SuperX

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So how many here are old enough to remember the Berlin wall? That one was ineffective and we will never have one here as well armed. I know he say walls work, but they don't.  There are far more effective was to secure the wall these days using technology.  What bothers me is that conservatives used to believe in fiscal responsibility, that seems to have gone by the wayside.  I miss the Grand old party of the 70's and 80's.

 :yeah:

Offline JimmyHoffa

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So how many here are old enough to remember the Berlin wall? That one was ineffective and we will never have one here as well armed. I know he say walls work, but they don't.  There are far more effective was to secure the wall these days using technology.  What bothers me is that conservatives used to believe in fiscal responsibility, that seems to have gone by the wayside.  I miss the Grand old party of the 70's and 80's.
How many would've defected to the west if there wasn't a wall and all that accompanied it?  All of Eastern Europe?
 

Offline timberfaller

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Don't know what all the uproar is!!!

Ever since I've been able to VOTE the DSPA aka:DNC,  they've been Anti-2A and now endorse murder of children born alive, HAVE been bringing anti-gun bills before the American people!!

Where have you been?   Nancy is just being Nancy!!

YOU own a firearm,  YOU vote for any "D" YOU ARE dumber then a box of rocks!!!
The only good tree, is a stump!

Offline wolfbait

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Don't know what all the uproar is!!!

Ever since I've been able to VOTE the DSPA aka:DNC,  they've been Anti-2A and now endorse murder of children born alive, HAVE been bringing anti-gun bills before the American people!!

Where have you been?   Nancy is just being Nancy!!

YOU own a firearm,  YOU vote for any "D" YOU ARE dumber then a box of rocks!!!

 :yeah:

Former Federal Prosecutor: America Is Growing Into A "Civil War" - "I Vote & I Buy Guns”


https://freedomoutpost.com/former-federal-prosecutor-america-is-growing-into-a-civil-war-i-vote-i-buy-guns/

 


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