Scopes for 2021 WA Muzzleloader season?

[BigTines]

I don’t see anybody complaining about using 209 primers anymore. I think after a year or two people will get used to the idea and realize that hardly any more hunters switch to muzzleloading. People are way overreacting I think on this topic. 

[Wizekrakr]

One thing I think is a legitimate concern is if this is a slippery slope.  Or should I say just the next step on the slippery slope.  Reality is, the slippery slope has been happening all along just one step at a time. Modern in-lines, 209 primers, closed breech,etc.  Take a look around the country.  I won't name the forums but if you look at other states you will find the same thing happening. Wisconsin allowed 1x scopes quite a while back.  About 10 years ago they changed that to adjustable power. Utah did that too I believe.  South Dakota is another one that went from 1x to more power.  WDFW said they received a lot of requests to allow low power scopes.  Those letters are probably why we are talking about this today.  If WDFW approves 1x scopes in March.  So be it. But to keep it from being changed to allow variable power scopes down the road some years.  Letters from us, lots of em, is what is going to keep that from happening. WDFW is responding to letters received asking for a change.

[Mr Mykiss]

But my 1x doesn’t work for me anymore and it’s fuzzy and I need more magnification to make it easier. Not much just 3x.

[actionshooter]

This is really the same argument for every platform... big picture time.
Look at archery... not even going to discuss a single advancement, but when I started   40 yards was far, now 90yds isn't uncommon.

Modern.... 15 years ago 400yds was pushing "ethical", I'll go shoot 900 now and if I I don't shoot MOA, I am pissed.

When I started muzzleloader, Knight was new and everyone was screaming that it wasn't "primitive".   Every time there is an advancement in anything, there are always a bunch of guys going insane screaming that its the end of the world....

 Should it stop??   Maybe.... but it's not going to.

[dilleytech]

I don’t see anybody complaining about using 209 primers anymore. I think after a year or two people will get used to the idea and realize that hardly any more hunters switch to muzzleloading. People are way overreacting I think on this topic. 

209 seem to be a step sidewise not a step forward. Just another  way to make the gun go pop. Friends I know have had more issues with 209 then caps. I don’t plan to ever shoot 209. What’s the point. But a scope? Ya I would. And more rifle guys would make the switch. I bet rifle guys would love for this to get passed. Spread out the hunters a little more.

[M_ray]

This is really the same argument for every platform... big picture time.
Look at archery... not even going to discuss a single advancement, but when I started   40 yards was far, now 90yds isn't uncommon.

Modern.... 15 years ago 400yds was pushing "ethical", I'll go shoot 900 now and if I I don't shoot MOA, I am pissed.

When I started muzzleloader, Knight was new and everyone was screaming that it wasn't "primitive".   Every time there is an advancement in anything, there are always a bunch of guys going insane screaming that its the end of the world....

 Should it stop??   Maybe.... but it's not going to.

Yep there was a day there weren’t scopes on rifles or compound bows but muzzleloading isn’t allowed to have  advancements.

[full choke]

Honest question: Why does muzzleloading need advancements?

[Jonathan_S]

This is really the same argument for every platform... big picture time.
Look at archery... not even going to discuss a single advancement, but when I started   40 yards was far, now 90yds isn't uncommon.

Modern.... 15 years ago 400yds was pushing "ethical", I'll go shoot 900 now and if I I don't shoot MOA, I am pissed.

When I started muzzleloader, Knight was new and everyone was screaming that it wasn't "primitive".   Every time there is an advancement in anything, there are always a bunch of guys going insane screaming that its the end of the world....

 Should it stop??   Maybe.... but it's not going to.

Yep there was a day there weren’t scopes on rifles or compound bows but muzzleloading isn’t allowed to have  advancements.

  except sabots, jacketed bullets, fiber optics, 209s, inlines, pelletized powder, magnum charged etc... 

[JimmyHoffa]

First rifle scopes were on muzzleloaders in the 1840's, compound bow didn't come about until the 1960's.

[BULLBLASTER]

To me it isnt about “advancements” or technology. It is about having different methods for different seasons. There isnt much traditional or old or not advanced about a modern muzzle loader with rifle primers, jacketed bullets, pellet powder, and fiber optic sights. It is a different season with a different set of rules. Nothing more nothing less. Imo a scope brings it too close to what a modern firearm is and at some point it should just be absorbed into modern season and to me that cut off is with scopes  the main limiting factor with current muzzy season is the sights. 

[paguy]

 

[M_ray]

Honest question: Why does muzzleloading need advancements?

First of all I didn’t say they needed them, it’s the natural evolution of things. Just like I pointed out that rifles also started with iron sights back in the day and bows weren’t compound with fiber optics. Also I’m not advocating for them inplayimg devil’s advocate and if they approve it then I’ll still use my #11 caps and my loose powder and lead bullets. I have a set up also with jacketed bullets and a scope I can use in any weapon seasons in other states. If they approve it and someone gets into muzzleloader hunting then great, if a current muzzleloader guy changes his stuff and puts on a 1x I’m not going to begrudge him for doing so.

 I think everyone is too up tight about it, these herds have survived many advancements from other methods and yes including jacketed and 209 from muszy’s (thanks Johnathan_s) And they are still here and will not be wiped out because a guy puts a 1x on his muzzy or a few more hunt the already shortest 1 week season out there.

So far bullblaster brings up the best opposing point without the threat of the sky falling and I can say that it’s hard not to agree with his view. The only problem with it that I can see is The Dept will never do an any weapon season and loose the revenue of a dedicated muzzy season and all those Application fees.

So we’re right back to do we fight between us or accept it may actually bring new hunters into the sport because of it? There are people out there that heard horror stories of opening day modern seasons that can’t or are not interested in bows that might do a muzzy season because of it.

And then there is one of the Biggest reasons I can get behind and that is if this extends s few more seasons for an old guy and gets him out of his easy chair then it’s a good thing. The closer some of us get to that easy chair it’s hard to argue against that too. You young guys aren’t thinking about that yet cause you don’t have to but someday your going to be happy to still be able to get out there even if it means a little technology to do so.

[M_ray]

This is really the same argument for every platform... big picture time.
Look at archery... not even going to discuss a single advancement, but when I started   40 yards was far, now 90yds isn't uncommon.

Modern.... 15 years ago 400yds was pushing "ethical", I'll go shoot 900 now and if I I don't shoot MOA, I am pissed.

When I started muzzleloader, Knight was new and everyone was screaming that it wasn't "primitive".   Every time there is an advancement in anything, there are always a bunch of guys going insane screaming that its the end of the world....

 Should it stop??   Maybe.... but it's not going to.

Yep there was a day there weren’t scopes on rifles or compound bows but muzzleloading isn’t allowed to have  advancements.

  except sabots, jacketed bullets, fiber optics, 209s, inlines, pelletized powder, magnum charged etc... 

Johnathan I get it And yes they have had technology advancements. I wasn’t trying to say they haven’t. I was pointing out more of the fact that everyone freaks out when it comes to one of these proposed changes especially for a method they do not even use. All the while forgetting that they have had the luxury of improvements and reap the rewards of but get very territorial If another method seeks improvements. 

Probably should have ended that with a ? mark to emphasize that!

[Mtnwalker]

This is really the same argument for every platform... big picture time.
Look at archery... not even going to discuss a single advancement, but when I started   40 yards was far, now 90yds isn't uncommon.

Modern.... 15 years ago 400yds was pushing "ethical", I'll go shoot 900 now and if I I don't shoot MOA, I am pissed.

When I started muzzleloader, Knight was new and everyone was screaming that it wasn't "primitive".   Every time there is an advancement in anything, there are always a bunch of guys going insane screaming that its the end of the world....

 Should it stop??   Maybe.... but it's not going to.

Yep there was a day there weren’t scopes on rifles or compound bows but muzzleloading isn’t allowed to have  advancements.

  except sabots, jacketed bullets, fiber optics, 209s, inlines, pelletized powder, magnum charged etc... 

Johnathan I get it And yes they have had technology advancements. I wasn’t trying to say they haven’t. I was pointing out more of the fact that everyone freaks out when it comes to one of these proposed changes especially for a method they do not even use. All the while forgetting that they have had the luxury of improvements and reap the rewards of but get very territorial If another method seeks improvements. 

Probably should have ended that with a ? mark to emphasize that!

The alternative being what... a free for all? If we don't want what Utah has which is zero regulation and basically just another rifle season, then lines have to be drawn somewhere. Scopes or no scopes is a very logical place to draw a line to keep things somewhat "primitive"

[M_ray]

This is really the same argument for every platform... big picture time.
Look at archery... not even going to discuss a single advancement, but when I started   40 yards was far, now 90yds isn't uncommon.

Modern.... 15 years ago 400yds was pushing "ethical", I'll go shoot 900 now and if I I don't shoot MOA, I am pissed.

When I started muzzleloader, Knight was new and everyone was screaming that it wasn't "primitive".   Every time there is an advancement in anything, there are always a bunch of guys going insane screaming that its the end of the world....

 Should it stop??   Maybe.... but it's not going to.

Yep there was a day there weren’t scopes on rifles or compound bows but muzzleloading isn’t allowed to have  advancements.

  except sabots, jacketed bullets, fiber optics, 209s, inlines, pelletized powder, magnum charged etc... 

Johnathan I get it And yes they have had technology advancements. I wasn’t trying to say they haven’t. I was pointing out more of the fact that everyone freaks out when it comes to one of these proposed changes especially for a method they do not even use. All the while forgetting that they have had the luxury of improvements and reap the rewards of but get very territorial If another method seeks improvements. 

Probably should have ended that with a ? mark to emphasize that!

The alternative being what... a free for all? If we don't want what Utah has which is zero regulation and basically just another rifle season, then lines have to be drawn somewhere. Scopes or no scopes is a very logical place to draw a line to keep things somewhat "primitive"

A 1x is hardly a free for all