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Was told by 2 different locals this year that there was a 60% die off in the Winston
Quote from: MADMAX on October 31, 2025, 08:11:41 PMWas told by 2 different locals this year that there was a 60% die off in the WinstonOver how many years?
You're moving too much. The days of cruising the tree farm and seeing elk in every third or fourth cut is long gone. Elk in the tree farm live in the areas where they cannot typically see vehicles or be seen. If you pull into a cut and park and you cannot see the entire tree line around the cut, you can bet the elk are in the section you have to walk over to look at. To really get a good idea if elk are around you need to walk the entire tree line/timber edge and look for sign. no sign, move over one draw and repeat. It takes time. That is why scouting is so important. Once you find them you find them and you can bet they will be in the general area next year and the year after etc. I know exactly where to go to find elk and it still can take me two or three days to pin them down to a specific timber patch or specific 50 yard section of a cut in the am/pm.
1st off, the worst thing you can do is try to hunt elk where there aren't any. Spending a week traipsing around the woods during one of the hardest seasons to hunt elk hoping to bump into a bull is almost impossible. It can take men many years to figure out where they live during November. They aren't anywhere you will see Sept and Oct sign. Think remote, steep and deep.
Quote from: HntnFsh on October 31, 2025, 08:20:25 PMQuote from: MADMAX on October 31, 2025, 08:11:41 PMWas told by 2 different locals this year that there was a 60% die off in the WinstonOver how many years?He really didn’t say, but it made sense after seeing the amount of well defined elk trails that had zero track in themI’m not saying there’s no elk there but far less than I recall I started hunting the Winston in the 80s when they used to give you a Weyerhaeuser map with tree damageI’ll be hunting spikes from now on the east side
At the OP if your finding elk trails 100 percent follow them in and see where they lead. This will get ya started on learning how they move and where the are moving to and from. Elk don't mind some noise, just make noise naturally not sneaking noise. They know the difference. Plus you might figure out other ways to approach with less chance of being detected. You are definitely looking for bull sign, but getting started by just searching elk sign is a win and will help get you in the ballpark.
Probably one of the most challenging things about hunting bull elk during modern season is you really want to be hunting where there are not many elk around, just the right elk. The majority of the elk we have killed during Washington modern season have been a) alone and b) in places where there was no real indication elk had been hanging out. You might get lucky and find some sign of the one elk hanging around there but a lot of times you see nothing until you find tracks so fresh that he is standing in them.Sometimes, you will still find a bull hanging out with a herd, especially young bulls. Even a herd bull will sometimes hang with the herd until they get pushed once or twice and the shooting starts. But once they get separated, the older bulls have lost their drive to stick with the herd. If I went somewhere where I was starting from scratch right now, I would potentially look for any elk sign to start. And then once I found it, if it looked like herds of elk, I would be seeking out the deep, dark and nasty stuff in its vicinity. Actually leaving the signs of many elk to go look for the few. The last several years it's not uncommon for me to see very few elk or even zero elk other than the one I end up killing. But it can be discouraging to hunt days and days seeing nothing, just looking for that one.
Quote from: blackveltbowhunter on Yesterday at 08:12:05 AMAt the OP if your finding elk trails 100 percent follow them in and see where they lead. This will get ya started on learning how they move and where the are moving to and from. Elk don't mind some noise, just make noise naturally not sneaking noise. They know the difference. Plus you might figure out other ways to approach with less chance of being detected. You are definitely looking for bull sign, but getting started by just searching elk sign is a win and will help get you in the ballpark.Probably one of the most challenging things about hunting bull elk during modern season is you really want to be hunting where there are not many elk around, just the right elk. The majority of the elk we have killed during Washington modern season have been a) alone and b) in places where there was no real indication elk had been hanging out. You might get lucky and find some sign of the one elk hanging around there but a lot of times you see nothing until you find tracks so fresh that he is standing in them.Sometimes, you will still find a bull hanging out with a herd, especially young bulls. Even a herd bull will sometimes hang with the herd until they get pushed once or twice and the shooting starts. But once they get separated, the older bulls have lost their drive to stick with the herd. If I went somewhere where I was starting from scratch right now, I would potentially look for any elk sign to start. And then once I found it, if it looked like herds of elk, I would be seeking out the deep, dark and nasty stuff in its vicinity. Actually leaving the signs of many elk to go look for the few. The last several years it's not uncommon for me to see very few elk or even zero elk other than the one I end up killing. But it can be discouraging to hunt days and days seeing nothing, just looking for that one.
Quote from: Dark2Dark on Yesterday at 08:56:44 AMProbably one of the most challenging things about hunting bull elk during modern season is you really want to be hunting where there are not many elk around, just the right elk. The majority of the elk we have killed during Washington modern season have been a) alone and b) in places where there was no real indication elk had been hanging out. You might get lucky and find some sign of the one elk hanging around there but a lot of times you see nothing until you find tracks so fresh that he is standing in them.Sometimes, you will still find a bull hanging out with a herd, especially young bulls. Even a herd bull will sometimes hang with the herd until they get pushed once or twice and the shooting starts. But once they get separated, the older bulls have lost their drive to stick with the herd. If I went somewhere where I was starting from scratch right now, I would potentially look for any elk sign to start. And then once I found it, if it looked like herds of elk, I would be seeking out the deep, dark and nasty stuff in its vicinity. Actually leaving the signs of many elk to go look for the few. The last several years it's not uncommon for me to see very few elk or even zero elk other than the one I end up killing. But it can be discouraging to hunt days and days seeing nothing, just looking for that one.I was going to PM you, but figured some questions I have might help others. First, I've hunted the west side for the last 5 seasons. I killed a 4 point a few years ago by walking up on the right clear cut extremely early. There had been elk around that area consistently for the prior 3 days, so I just figured it was my best bet and was right. However, this isn't a recipe for repeated success imo. Too many people roaming clear cuts, bulls don't seem to like coming out very often. So, I've heard the deep and steep discussion, but haven't seen anyone really explain it well. I hunt the timber/nasty areas more than most and have only come across a bull once in an area that was so dark (in mid-day) that I didn't see him until he was running away. That was in a smallish saddle area, old growth without trails. There aren't many places like that in the unit I now hunt, which is private timber with roads everywhere. Questions!!: is how do you define deep/steep and what characteristics are you looking for as multipliers for process of elimination? Are you hunting creek bottoms, old growth timber, rerod you can't see through... I've found elk in all these areas, just not bulls and rarely would I have been able to shoot one. Are you hunting clear cuts at all, or just getting into these spots early then still hunting mid-day before hanging at your location again late? Without going into clear cuts, what are the bulls eating? Without sign, or trail cam confirmation, how do you know you're not just wasting your time?
Quote from: Badsmerf on Yesterday at 10:41:36 AMQuote from: Dark2Dark on Yesterday at 08:56:44 AMProbably one of the most challenging things about hunting bull elk during modern season is you really want to be hunting where there are not many elk around, just the right elk. The majority of the elk we have killed during Washington modern season have been a) alone and b) in places where there was no real indication elk had been hanging out. You might get lucky and find some sign of the one elk hanging around there but a lot of times you see nothing until you find tracks so fresh that he is standing in them.Sometimes, you will still find a bull hanging out with a herd, especially young bulls. Even a herd bull will sometimes hang with the herd until they get pushed once or twice and the shooting starts. But once they get separated, the older bulls have lost their drive to stick with the herd. If I went somewhere where I was starting from scratch right now, I would potentially look for any elk sign to start. And then once I found it, if it looked like herds of elk, I would be seeking out the deep, dark and nasty stuff in its vicinity. Actually leaving the signs of many elk to go look for the few. The last several years it's not uncommon for me to see very few elk or even zero elk other than the one I end up killing. But it can be discouraging to hunt days and days seeing nothing, just looking for that one.I was going to PM you, but figured some questions I have might help others. First, I've hunted the west side for the last 5 seasons. I killed a 4 point a few years ago by walking up on the right clear cut extremely early. There had been elk around that area consistently for the prior 3 days, so I just figured it was my best bet and was right. However, this isn't a recipe for repeated success imo. Too many people roaming clear cuts, bulls don't seem to like coming out very often. So, I've heard the deep and steep discussion, but haven't seen anyone really explain it well. I hunt the timber/nasty areas more than most and have only come across a bull once in an area that was so dark (in mid-day) that I didn't see him until he was running away. That was in a smallish saddle area, old growth without trails. There aren't many places like that in the unit I now hunt, which is private timber with roads everywhere. Questions!!: is how do you define deep/steep and what characteristics are you looking for as multipliers for process of elimination? Are you hunting creek bottoms, old growth timber, rerod you can't see through... I've found elk in all these areas, just not bulls and rarely would I have been able to shoot one. Are you hunting clear cuts at all, or just getting into these spots early then still hunting mid-day before hanging at your location again late? Without going into clear cuts, what are the bulls eating? Without sign, or trail cam confirmation, how do you know you're not just wasting your time?If you're hunting private timber with key access, most of my tactics are tough.What I usually am looking for are areas far away from easy road access (difficult when the roads are open and bisect the entire area) and old growth timber (difficult when they log it as soon as the trees are a harvestable size).I hunt those areas for deer- as when the rut hits, the bucks are where the does are and that usually means in clearcuts at some point during daylight hours.Don't get me wrong- quite a lot of bulls are shot in those areas out in the cuts, but there are thousands of people competing for those bulls and getting one is like winning the lottery. Again, I know people that spend 150 days a year driving around in the woods there and they do well consistently, but that's what it takes. And so you're not only going up against a bunch of randoms (probably half of them with thermals), you're going up against those people, too.So, I rarely, if ever, hunt clearcuts. Maybe once or twice every few years I will check one or spend a day driving and checking them but it's usually just when I don't have time or energy to do a real hunt. It's never been my lucky day when I have done it. I hunt timbered areas from dawn to dusk. Just in little areas where the trees have been blown down there are openings enough that a variety of feed grows enough to sustain an elk or two. But in Western Washington, even in heavy timber, it seems that they don't have much problem finding nutritional feed. I rarely spend much time in creek bottoms and have not had a lot of luck finding bulls there, but it could happen, probably in certain areas, for sure. I like steep hillisides with lots of ridges. And the bulls can often be found high on ridges where they can watch below them. I used to see rocky cliffy areas and think the elk wouldn't want to be in there. Now, those are some of the areas I'm searching out. Working side hills checking each ridge and the little shelves/pockets they create has worked out well for us. But you're right, if you haven't seen them on cameras or you see ZERO sign, it's hard to know if you're wasting time. We hunt a lot in areas that we have become familiar with over the years and we know where bulls like to hide in season- like I said- close to where herds of elk hang out and breed, but not in those exact areas. Reprod definitely holds elk but it's very difficult to hunt it. Same with thicker, younger timber that's marginally huntable. I like hunting in the vicinity of those pockets but hanging out in the old growth, instead. Often, you can catch elk coming in and out of there early in the morning or late in the evening. I used to see a lot more elk in season based on where I hunted but did not see many bulls or kill many bulls. Now, I see far less elk but we harvest far more. Hope that helps!
Awesome. Most of the time being persistent can be the factor.
So luck 100% played into it. I would watch an area/clear-cuts that had elk sign near it every morning and evening and then in between I would try to go and follow trails. I followed one trail that was very obvious elk trail. A lot of poop and beds so once again it confirmed that elk are in the area. I also knew it was most likely herd of cows because of how many beds there were but I just wanted to see some elk and figured there's a chance that a younger bull might stick with the cows, I know blacktail spikes and forkys like to do that. Sunday - my first day. A lot of people driving around. No elk. Monday - still some hunters but much less. Tuesday - saw only 2 trucks driving around the area I was focusing on. Tuesday evening saw nobody else there.Wednesday morning weather is nasty, on and off rain, dark with very low visibility. I decided to just drive around my route one last time and then go check out some other areas near Pe Ell. While driving around I was stopping to glass the reprod hills whenever I could. I spotted something around 1200-1500yards, not sure what it was, possibly a bush, couldn't tell because of the rain but looked interesting. I have been constantly saying to my self "it just takes one" so figured I would go back, take the other road to get to that clear cut to check it. Well while driving there looked to my left and saw a group of cows on top of a clear cut just looking at me. About 150-200 yards. Binos on, yep there's a legal bull with them. Heart rate jumps like crazy. I start shaking. Get out the car. Get my rifle, shaking so bad I can't aim. Finally let a round fly, not the best shot, didn't drop him instantly, he just standing there I thought I missed, shot him again. He drops down. This was at around 830am. I was able to get my car about 20 ft from him which was a blessing because boy they are heavy. Finished quartering him at around 130. That whole day I haven't seen or heard a single hunter driving. Most people seem to give up. Lessons learned. First of all I need to practice shooting and learn to calm myself. I decided I won't shoot again until I am calm and clear minded, I'm very disappointed in my shots and because of poor shooting some meat was lost. Second, like you guys said, younger bulls still do hang out with cows. Third, they were in clear-cuts after a full night of dumping hard rain and wind, possibly because they were hunkered down the whole night without wanting to move much? Forth, a lot of hunters seem to give up after couple days so staying longer than the other guys is good. Like I said, i was very lucky. It definitely wasn't me figuring out something, it was just me being in a right place at the right time. In fact I still don't know what would be "bull signs" in comparison to regular elk sign. Nonetheless I am extremely grateful for the meat and I'll remember this bull forever.
