Reintroduced Wolves Killing Mountain Lions

[wolfbait]

I like to give Rich a call and ask him how many lions were killed by our new Canadian wolves. It's obvious that the wolves will be staying out of the picture as our game is depleted.


"Lucky" Libby relocated after suspected alpaca kill

 
Cougar trapped near Carlton tagged, collared and released within his rangeBy Joyce Campbell

A cougar captured and released on Friday the 13th was a lucky guy, unlike the alpaca he is accused of killing and feeding on.

He’ll need a lot of luck if he is to survive. The two-year-old cat is part of a decreasing population of cougars in Okanogan County. Hunting and territorial fighting among cougars has depleted the cougar population, according to Rich Beausoleil, the bear and cougar expert who has been studying cougars in Okanogan County for the Washington Department of Fish and Wildlife for five years.

“Our research has shown the cougar population in Okanogan County has been reduced. It’s been steadily declining for about the past four years,” said Beausoleil. A WDFW survey of Okanogan residents showed most people wanted fewer cougars. “That goal has been accomplished,” he said. http://www.methowvalleynews.com/story.php?id=1085



Tuesday, October 14, 1997 - Page updated at 12:00 AM

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Hunting The Hunters -- Reintroduced Wolves Killing Mountain Lions
By Martin Forstenzer

Special To The Seattle Times

Environment. The reintroduction of wolves in various habitats has prompted scientists to study animal behavior in altered ecosystems. One study of wolf-mountain lion interaction in Montana provided some surprises.

There are predators and there are the animals they prey on. But what happens when predators interact?

That is the question scientists are trying to answer through observation of gray wolves and mountain lions in northwestern Montana.

A just-completed study of predator interactions has opened a window onto their behavior. The study has yielded surprising results, particularly about the degree to which wolves affect mountain lions. The impacts may have ramifications for wildlife prey species and possibly for humans as well.

The study, conducted by the Hornocker Wildlife Institute, a nonprofit organization affiliated with the University of Idaho, was the first ever done of wolf and mountain-lion interactions.

In 1993, the Hornocker Institute, known for its work conserving tigers in Siberia and with mountain lions and other predators in North America, began a study of gray wolves that migrated naturally from Canada into the United States. The wolves recolonized an area of prime mountain lion habitat along the North Fork of the Flathead River in northwestern Montana, just west of Glacier National Park.

For the study, biologists put radio collars on 40 mountain lions in order to follow their movements and used snow tracking to study the interactions between the cats and the wolves.

According to Toni Ruth, the study project leader, wolves and grizzly bears tend to harass and cause the deaths of mountain lions to a greater degree than was previously understood. When wolf packs encountered mountain lions, the cats were generally chased off or killed, she said. The recolonized wolves commonly drove lions away from their prey kills - mostly white-tailed deer or elk. The lions were then forced to make additional kills in order to survive.

"In one tracking sequence in fresh snow," Ruth said, "wolves chased a lion from a kill site, in and out of cover, and treed the lion. The wolves went back up to the kill site, and later the lion went back to the site but there was nothing left."

http://community.seattletimes.nwsource.com/archive/?date=19971014&slug=2566106



Is there a deer shortage now? 


Yes, there most assuredly is. We have hunted deer in the Methow Valley for over 20 years. We have not seen a legal buck the last three seasons, and we hunt hard. The number of deer in the area is way down, overall. Many people I have talked to, including game wardens, attribute a large percentage of the decline to wolves. You may call that anecdotal evidence, but people who actually hunt in the area believe it to be fact.
__________________
http://www.thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=344456&page=3

[Slider]

Haven't Dogs always chased Cat's? Why would we have to pay for a study!!!? 

[DOUBLELUNG]

The interactions of carnivores when a new species is introduced is the wildcard with wolves, and why across the board decimation of prey populations is unlikely.  Effects are extremely affected by the density and composition of prey populations, and habitat variables.

Mule deer and mountain lions were rough, uneven terrain specialists precolonization; in remote, rural areas where they have broadened their niche to areas they were never abundant when wolves were around, and especially where whitetails are also abundant, mule deer will be thrashed.  Same goes for elk in heavily forested, rolling to flat terrains where whitetails are abundant.  

However, wolves also have the potential to reduce densities of coyotes and black bears, so in areas where fawn predation is very high, wolves may actually lead to higher deer densities, where higher fawn survival is only partially offset by lower adult survival.    

I'm not a wolf hater or a wolf lover, though I do hate the politics of wolf management.  It is a darned good thing that wolves are territorial and defend their territories by killing trespassing wolves, or we'd be well and truly screwed.  The history of wolves colonizing new territories, whether naturally or introduced, has shown effects on other wildlife populations to be extremely variable, and even good biologists staying out of the politics of wolves know that it is very difficult to predict what will happen as effects are very site-specific.

When the politics enter in, it gets even more messed up.  Political wolf-haters cherrypick their examples - so do wolf lovers.  Plenty of data for both to back their perspectives.

[boneaddict]

Well put.

[jackelope]

When the politics enter in, it gets even more messed up.  Political wolf-haters cherrypick their examples - so do wolf lovers.  Plenty of data for both to back their perspectives

[wolfbait]

When the politics enter in, it gets even more messed up.  Political wolf-haters cherrypick their examples - so do wolf lovers.  Plenty of data for both to back their perspectives

The wolf issue is fairly simple: The USFW and the environmentalists are using the wolf for self serving purposes. If anyone should be considered wolf-haters, they should be at the front of the line. They care nothing about the animal except what they can get done or the $$, using the wolf, spotted owl and the list goes on.

I think that most people like wolves. But these wolves were brought into the USA to serve a purpose, and they are doing a very good job. We don't like that these wolves are killing our wildlife and livestock, but that is what wolves do. Shoving these wolves down our throats with no management, unless it is killing how many? because they have to will not work for ever. Not only the people but the wolves will suffer from this lack of true responsibility. Does anyone have a positive side to bringing these wolves into the this country?.

[boneaddict]

Do you know anything about those dogs that mulehunter posted about?

[wolfbait]

What dogs?

[boneaddict]

http://hunting-washington.com/smf/index.php/topic,29619.0.html

[wolfbait]

Do you know anything about those dogs that mulehunter posted about?

First that i heard about it, I would sure like to put that on the M-BB. But I need to find out more about it first. It's just starting here. They are saying we have up to 3 packs in here but I kind of think thats bull, as each pack I have, read covers about a circle of 200 miles, that would be their range per pack. So if thats true, we might have a real big pack in here or we have a bunch of singles, and pairs, which by the way they don't count in their tally of how many wolves. The bunch they brought in this spring would account for more singles and pairs. People have seen plenty of pairs and singles in the valley in recent years. I have seen pairs and singles, all total 9 different wolves.