tall order

[JackOfAllTrades]

While I don't knock the .300win mag at all. It is a fine belted magnum cartridge. But I assume he's got issue with recoil. Plus, if he hand loads, the .308 norma will do what the .300win mag will with 30% less powder. Thus, a little less recoil and cheaper to hand load for. Also on a short action, saving weight of the rifle. That's kinda why I suggested the 30-06Ackley, (can shoot factory rounds, then reload the fireformed brass). We might be able to talk him into a .338 Win Mag.

To do this right, He's going to have to define cartridge before he settles on hardware build.

-Steve

[C-Money]

Browning A-bolt composite stalker, in a .270 win or 30-06. Look at a Burris or leupold 3x9

[jdb]

WOW this thread went way farther and faster than I imagined! let me tell ya what I think then you guys tell me what you think how s that? I think I want a remington model 7 in 300 wsm stainless synthetic, I think I want a 180 grain accubond pushed to about 2900 fps, sighted in 3" high @ 100. I also think I want a leupold vxIII 3.5x10. I have no idea really what this would weigh but I hope it would come in around my 7.5 lbs mark any thoughts?

[wrangler]

get a .340wby in a mark v stainless and put a brake on it. one of the sweetest 'production' rifles ever made in the best 'production' elk/ north american big game caliber ever made. your on the right track with the vx-3 and the accubonds... if you hand load look at the swift a-frames and the barnes tsx's. if you're building something and not a tight budget that completely changes things... 8mm/.338 anyone??? 

[jdb]

I recognize the greatness of weatherby cartridges but have no desire to own one I am also leaning toward a short action cartridge. but have givin some thought to the 280 ai

[wrangler]

I recognize the greatness of weatherby cartridges but have no desire to own one

  uhhh ok? short action and you want a 400yd elk stoppin rifle? huh... well anyhow i have a standard .280, its FANTASTIC deer cartridge! good luck!

[jdb]

  uhhh ok? short action and you want a 400yd elk stoppin rifle? huh... well anyhow i have a standard .280, its FANTASTIC deer cartridge! good luck!
[/quote]do you think the 300wsm inadaquate for elk to 400 yards?

[Bob33]

Tikka T3 fits your description very well.  Light, relatively inexpensive, and accurate out of the box.  Get a 270 WSM or 30-06.  It will kill elk at 400 yards, but be reminded that it requires someone behind the stock with practiced expertise to ethically do so.

[jdb]

Tikka T3 fits your description very well.  Light, relatively inexpensive, and accurate out of the box.  Get a 270 WSM or 30-06.  It will kill elk at 400 yards, but be reminded that it requires someone behind the stock with practiced expertise to ethically do so.

agreed and today I am probably not up to the challenge if I were I would have killed a elk this year. Now dont think I am one of those guys who wants to sit on ridge tops and snipe animals from a distance, nothing could be further from the truth, I want a nice handy rifle that carries well but if I want to shoot something at long distance I want to feel I have enough rifle to do so

[JackOfAllTrades]

I'm just not a fan of the WSM cartriges -with a saami spec of 65,000psi. That shorter cartridge develops a bunch of 'quick' velocity while battering the rifle as much as a belted .300win mag, yet doesn't produce equal velocity. And, you just can't get a good heavy bullet for Elk for that distance for the .270/.280. Sure, the accubond is a good bullet, but it's even better in .30 or .338cal. (expensive bullet that you really don't need to pay that much for)  To be fair, the .270wsm with the same bullet weight, velocity and weight of rifle has an unmessurable difference in the amount of weight delivered recoil. But everyone I've ever known says the WSM even for a slightly smaller caliber says they kick more. A sharper snap, if you will...

If you're buying brass, or factory cartridges, the 30-06 costs about half as much as any WSM. I just don't see any advantage of the .270wsm over the proven 30-06 that has a plethora of bullet selection, is also on a short action, is also not a belted case yet the saami pressure standard is 5,000psi less.

Even if you open your eyes to a .300wsm, there is also no advantage over the 30-06 Ackley. (the ackley does develope a bit more pressure)

If you had to buy ammo off the store shelf, finding the 30-06 available would be more likely than any of the wsm's in most areas.

Some people love'm. Doing the math.. I don't see any real advantage.

Look at the reload tables. The lighter bullets of .30cal perform the same as the heavier bullets in .270cal.

-Steve

[jdb]

the only advantage I see is that I can buy a 300 wsm in a short action rifle. but maybe I am too hung up on short action I just know that my son has a ruger 77 ultralite .243 thats WAY nicer to carry than my model 700 270 that I put a laminate stock on. I was really hopeing to get a rifle that hit harder than my .270 but carried as easy as his .243.

[JackOfAllTrades]

Well, hell! If you like how the 77 Ultra light carries, then buy one!

http://www.ruger-firearms.com/products/m77HawkeyeUltraLight/models.html

HKM77RLFP 17136 .243 Win. 4 Black
Synthetic Stainless Steel/
Hawkeye Matte Stainless 20.00" 40.00" 6.50 lbs. 1:9" RH

HKM77RLFP 17138 .30-06 Sprg. 4 Black
Synthetic Stainless Steel/
Hawkeye Matte Stainless 20.00" 40.62" 6.25 lbs. 1:10" RH

The 30-06 weighs a bit less, and is only just over a 1/2" longer! It should carry very much the same.

One of the challenges is finding what "YOU" like. What feels good in the hand in the field. To 'build' a rifle, I'd always determine the cartridge first, then find an action/barrel/stock that fits that action and you. But if you like the Ultra Light, then you've got half the battle won.

That 700 (BDL?) weighs nearly a pound more, has a wider/thicker/deeper stock. -and to me is a beast in the hand.

You need to go to a gun store and put an Ultra light chambered for something larger, in your hand and see whether you're sure you like that.  Buying something you like, off the shelf, will always be cheaper than 'building' a rifle.

Now, all that said, I suggested 30-06 since you wanted less recoil than a magnum. (it appeared) I think that most hunters that would shoot out to 400yds on Elk use more than even a 30-06. Yes, I know there are a bunch of you that use .270's and such with good success, (I don't want to hear it), then we get into the whole 7mm vs .30cal argument.

There's a reason the 30-06 is the second most popular centerfire hunting cartridge in the world. It is the most versital performer.

-Steve

[carpsniperg2]

go with a tikka in 7mm or 300 win great price great gun

[jackelope]

why don't you spend $250 and get a 300 win mag barrel for your encore and call it good? mine with the bull barrel and a 4-12 vortex scope weighs 8.6lbs on my bathroom scale....it carries really nicely. you could get a pro hunter barrel which is fluted and loose a few ounces.

[jdb]

why don't you spend $250 and get a 300 win mag barrel for your encore and call it good? mine with the bull barrel and a 4-12 vortex scope weighs 8.6lbs on my bathroom scale....it carries really nicely. you could get a pro hunter barrel which is fluted and loose a few ounces.

that my friend is a good idea! I could even get the flex stock and still be money ahead! hmmmm back to the drawing board!