Gross Misdemeanor

[ICEMAN]

Alot of guys on here would benefit from a ride along with law enforcement.

[bobcat]

Chester- great post, I agree.

[grundy53]

i could get this guy 12 real arrests in just the first two hours of deer season, but he's cruising the butcher shops instead to pad his stats. had to vent sorry. as stated in an earlier thread, washington manages hunters, not wildlife.

WDFW is required by the state legislature to regulate the pet store, fish processor and distributor, fur dealer, taxidermist, butcher, and game farm business. They regulate them by checking them and making sure all of their fish and wildlife they are posessing are legal. Well guess what, the OP was in violation.

It's amazing how many people on here want more enforcement, but when someone on here gets cited for violating the law they complain about enforcement.

with all that responsibility it sounds like they shouldn't be wasting their time with this petty ante *censored*. go get a poacher. we all want more enforcement... of poachers.

[bigtex]

i could get this guy 12 real arrests in just the first two hours of deer season, but he's cruising the butcher shops instead to pad his stats. had to vent sorry. as stated in an earlier thread, washington manages hunters, not wildlife.

WDFW is required by the state legislature to regulate the pet store, fish processor and distributor, fur dealer, taxidermist, butcher, and game farm business. They regulate them by checking them and making sure all of their fish and wildlife they are posessing are legal. Well guess what, the OP was in violation.

It's amazing how many people on here want more enforcement, but when someone on here gets cited for violating the law they complain about enforcement.

Most want more enforcement on things in the field. Catching people in the act, stopping further crimes from being commited, having a presence for the most part. we want more enforcement there. Giving this guy a ticket isnt gonna keep save that deer. Enforcement seems to like to take a stance on things that arent that much in the big picture. they are just trying to line there pockets. And when a whole heard gets slaughtered they dont follow up on it. (im talking westside) but they will sure as hell run you down to count and recount 15 clams or get you for leaving a shell in your gun and leaning it on your bumper. Are those acts illegal? yes. But with few peop in in enforcement there time could be much better spent. 

Here is the thing that most people don’t understand; there is more to the job of a fish and wildlife officer then sitting in the hills looking for a poacher. There are over 200 different seasons and regulatory activities (such as taxidermy) that WDFW is required to work/enforce. It’s not just deer, elk, turkey and salmon. There are patrols for such things as sea cucumber enforcement, squid, pet sore regulation, lands enforcement, commercial crawfish, border operations, and so on. Each user group wants WDFW Officers to work their season. Go on a Fly Fishing website and see how many people want officers to work fly only lakes, go to a crabbing website and see how many people complain about a lack of enforcement.

You say giving this guy a ticket isn’t going to save the deer. Well what are the chances of a WDFW Officer actually preventing a deer from being poached? Most of the time the animal is already dead by the time the officer contacts the individual.

There have been many big poaching cases made by WDFW routinely inspecting taxidermists and butchers.

WDFW is required to do things that most people probably wouldn’t think is “right”. Such as the requirement for WDFW to work over 3,000 hours of enforcement time enforcing the federal Lacey Act related to wholesale fish dealers and buyers, cold storage facilities, retail markets, restaurants, SeaTac Airport, and the Canadian Border. The requirement to work about 2,000 hours of enforcement time enforcing commercial and recreational ground fish and halibut regulations. And the requirement for about 9,000 hours spent on enforcing the Endangered Species Act in regards to Salmon and Steelhead. If WDFW doesn’t meet those requirements then they lose federal funding from NOAA. And with the additions of Puget Sound Rockfish and Columbia River Smelt to the ESA this year WDFW will be required to work even more ESA enforcement in the years to come.

What one individual thinks is the “right” thing for a WDFW Officer to do might be the “wrong” thing for another person.

Most of us were alive when there was a Wildlife Dept and a Fisheries Dept. Back then Wildlife Officers did spend most of their time in the woods and Fisheries Officers on the water. During busy times they would help each other out. But when WDFW was formed it was now everybody’s job to do the joint enforcement of ALL fish and wildlife regulations. If you were an old wildlife officer you were now tasked with doing crab enforcement, squid enforcement and so on. And guess what, the number of officers since that merger has dropped drastically.

[chester]

In this case the odds of them stopping future poaching of the individual? zero. he wasnt trying to poach in the first place. you listed alot  that they have to do. and what their job encompasses.

so my question to you, how do we go about streamlining the bull$hit. and have them focus on things that wont start a pissing match and maybe save face for the agency? right now it sounds like their superiors arent happy with what they are doing, and neither is the public. should we just *censored*can the whole deal and give it over to wsp? because they arent going in any useful direction.

[bigtex]

i could get this guy 12 real arrests in just the first two hours of deer season, but he's cruising the butcher shops instead to pad his stats. had to vent sorry. as stated in an earlier thread, washington manages hunters, not wildlife.

WDFW is required by the state legislature to regulate the pet store, fish processor and distributor, fur dealer, taxidermist, butcher, and game farm business. They regulate them by checking them and making sure all of their fish and wildlife they are posessing are legal. Well guess what, the OP was in violation.

It's amazing how many people on here want more enforcement, but when someone on here gets cited for violating the law they complain about enforcement.

with all that responsibility it sounds like they shouldn't be wasting their time with this petty ante *censored*. go get a poacher. we all want more enforcement... of poachers.

Whats the definition of a poacher? Is it somebody who violates WDFW laws? Is it somebody who hunts/fish without a license? Or simply somebody who shoots something out of  season? You make it sound like WDFW should only cite people who kill illegally. Loaded guns in vehicle, fail to tag, no hunter orange and so on are all ok and WDFW shouldn't be wasting their time on them. What are the chances that a WDFW Officer will be in the right place at the right time when a poacher shoots something? Is 10 hours spent looking at a clearcut waiting for a poacher but nobody showing up successful? Or would the officer better spend his time writing 15 tickets in 10 hours to hunters/fisherment?

[ICEMAN]

With the new consolidation of governmental agencies due to the budget crisis, you can only expect their jobs to cover more tasks with fewer enforcement officers.

[chester]

Well if they are not going to follow up on severe game law violations and keep pissing tax payer money away on petty *censored*. do we really need to have those jobs in the gov? if they cant do their job it seems useless to keep paying them 

[grundy53]

i could get this guy 12 real arrests in just the first two hours of deer season, but he's cruising the butcher shops instead to pad his stats. had to vent sorry. as stated in an earlier thread, washington manages hunters, not wildlife.

WDFW is required by the state legislature to regulate the pet store, fish processor and distributor, fur dealer, taxidermist, butcher, and game farm business. They regulate them by checking them and making sure all of their fish and wildlife they are posessing are legal. Well guess what, the OP was in violation.

It's amazing how many people on here want more enforcement, but when someone on here gets cited for violating the law they complain about enforcement.

with all that responsibility it sounds like they shouldn't be wasting their time with this petty ante *censored*. go get a poacher. we all want more enforcement... of poachers.

Whats the definition of a poacher? Is it somebody who violates WDFW laws? Is it somebody who hunts/fish without a license? Or simply somebody who shoots something out of  season? You make it sound like WDFW should only cite people who kill illegally. Loaded guns in vehicle, fail to tag, no hunter orange and so on are all ok and WDFW shouldn't be wasting their time on them. What are the chances that a WDFW Officer will be in the right place at the right time when a poacher shoots something? Is 10 hours spent looking at a clearcut waiting for a poacher but nobody showing up successful? Or would the officer better spend his time writing 15 tickets in 10 hours to hunters/fisherment?

Well maybe if he wasn't busy writing tickets for little *censored* he might have actually caught a poacher. and yes i feel that catching 1 poacher is worth more then 15 of these B.S tickets this guy got.

[bigtex]

so my question to you, how do we go about streamlining the bull$hit. and have them focus on things that wont start a pissing match and maybe save face for the agency? right now it sounds like their superiors arent happy with what they are doing, and neither is the public. should we just *censored*can the whole deal and give it over to wsp? because they arent going in any useful direction.

I will point out this. In the 2008 staffing study there were officer comments and many of them wanted to be doing things that many on here say they should be doing, such as night time poaching patrols and sitting in the hills "protecting" animals. In fact the Enforcement Program as a whole would rather be working on those things.

The problem is the legislature. They come up with new laws and say "WDFW, enforce this" but don't give any money or personnel for them to enforce it. In the past couple years the legislature has assigned the regulation of pet stores, aquatic invasive species, cold storage facilities, and deleterious wildlife to WDFW. But they haven't provided any additional $ or manpower to do so, in fact they have decreased the $. They really are doing more with less.

Moving WDFW enforcement to WSP would only worsen things. In the two states which have wildlife enforcement with the state patrol the wildlife enforcement division always takes the brunt of budget cuts. Do you really think the WSP chief who spent his entire career doing traffic enforcement and has never stepped a day in the woods  would really care if 5 wildlife officers were laid off? Probably not, but if 5 road troopers were to be laid off all hell would break loose.

[bigtex]

With the new consolidation of governmental agencies due to the budget crisis, you can only expect their jobs to cover more tasks with fewer enforcement officers.

 

Right now there is a proposal to move the 8 DNR Officers into WDFW Enforcement. Sounds great doesnt it, more WDFW Officers? Here is the catch, WDFW would now be the agency in charge of enforcement on DNR lands. So not only would a WDFW Officer be responsible for doing agency land patrols on WDFW lands but also DNR lands. DNR Enforcement does a lot of ATV and Snowmobile enforcement on DNR lands, that would now be the responsibility of WDFW. There are numerous ATV events at places like Reiter, Capitol Forest and the Beverly Dunes. DNR usually sends all of their officers to work it, WDFW might send one. Well guess what, that whole operation would now be WDFW's. If the shift of DNR Enforcement to WDFW happens you will see WDFW Enforcement doing a lot more ATV, Snowmobile, Forest Product thefts enforcement on state lands.

Oh ya. That shift would happen July 1, 2012. Effective July 1,2011 two WDFW enforcement positions are slated to be eliminated. That is on top of the 2.5 positions that were eliminated this October.

[ICEMAN]

Guys, the season is only so long. Do you want any hunter checked at all for anything? Crap, pretty soon nobody would buy a license or tag and alot of guys would skirt the laws.   The simple fact is that wildlife officers patrol and make field contacts with us because the are obligated to enforce laws and that the only time they will ever meet you is in the field, after you drop game off at a butcher, or at your friendly taxidermist. The year is 365 days long, your hunt is much shorter. What do you think wildlife officers are doing the other 300 days of the year?

How many poachers are out "poaching" during hunting season? I bet alot of field interviews/investigations turn into poaching cases....

[chester]

so my question to you, how do we go about streamlining the bull$hit. and have them focus on things that wont start a pissing match and maybe save face for the agency? right now it sounds like their superiors arent happy with what they are doing, and neither is the public. should we just *censored*can the whole deal and give it over to wsp? because they arent going in any useful direction.

I will point out this. In the 2008 staffing study there were officer comments and many of them wanted to be doing things that many on here say they should be doing, such as night time poaching patrols and sitting in the hills "protecting" animals. In fact the Enforcement Program as a whole would rather be working on those things.

The problem is the legislature. They come up with new laws and say "WDFW, enforce this" but don't give any money or personnel for them to enforce it. In the past couple years the legislature has assigned the regulation of pet stores, aquatic invasive species, cold storage facilities, and deleterious wildlife to WDFW. But they haven't provided any additional $ or manpower to do so, in fact they have decreased the $. They really are doing more with less.

Moving WDFW enforcement to WSP would only worsen things. In the two states which have wildlife enforcement with the state patrol the wildlife enforcement division always takes the brunt of budget cuts. Do you really think the WSP chief who spent his entire career doing traffic enforcement and has never stepped a day in the woods  would really care if 5 wildlife officers were laid off? Probably not, but if 5 road troopers were to be laid off all hell would break loose.

well this is what its coming too. they are acting like traffic cops. so what punishment would an officer get  if he nodded his head and just went out in the woods anyway? actually did something useful like say caught some guys shooting elk in a spotlight. would the dept come down on him because he didnt show up in the pet store that day? seems like they all said they wanted more time in the woods but did any of them step up and do it? if there isnt additional money to fund it, why cut into what their main job was in the first place? why not say we dont have time to do that either, add another guy to do that or put it on the back burner? if they cant do their job whats the point of their salary? all this boo hoo they want us to do this. but they can still find time to write a ticket over a tag being not fully notched?  Leos used to go off of protect and serve, not nickel and dime

[bigtex]

Guys, the season is only so long. Do you want any hunter checked at all for anything? Crap, pretty soon nobody would buy a license or tag and alot of guys would skirt the laws.   The simple fact is that wildlife officers patrol and make field contacts with us because the are obligated to enforce laws and that the only time they will ever meet you is in the field, after you drop game off at a butcher, or at your friendly taxidermist. The year is 365 days long, your hunt is much shorter. What do you think wildlife officers are doing the other 300 days of the year?

How many poachers are out "poaching" during hunting season? I bet alot of field interviews/investigations turn into poaching cases....

I think people on here should really read the WDFW Enforcement quarterly reports they put out. Many of them explain how simple casual field stops turn in to huge violations.

[chester]

Guys, the season is only so long. Do you want any hunter checked at all for anything? Crap, pretty soon nobody would buy a license or tag and alot of guys would skirt the laws.   The simple fact is that wildlife officers patrol and make field contacts with us because the are obligated to enforce laws and that the only time they will ever meet you is in the field, after you drop game off at a butcher, or at your friendly taxidermist. The year is 365 days long, your hunt is much shorter. What do you think wildlife officers are doing the other 300 days of the year?

How many poachers are out "poaching" during hunting season? I bet alot of field interviews/investigations turn into poaching cases....

I think people on here should really read the WDFW Enforcement quarterly reports they put out. Many of them explain how simple casual field stops turn in to huge violations.

Just because it looks good on paper doesnt mean much. Im sure the OPs case will show up as a great success on their part just for the charges brought. regardless if the judge throws them out or not.