Bearpaw Fall Season 2011

[bearpaw]

Well the waterhole was a bust, the only thing we saw this evening was the UTV driving through the waterhole. 

I sent Anthony over to check out another nearby area while we were sitting. We met back after dark and Anthony had great news and video to boot. He figured the bull he saw was at least a 330, I looked at the video and I think he is 330-340+ so we are going after him tommorrow. 

The bull is covering country, Anthony watched him chase a 4 pt off and he dogged a few cows trying to find a hot one. We are guestimating where he will be by morning and starting our search there.

It's late I'm heading to my sleeping bag under the stars. Thank god it's warmer tonight, I about froze to death a couple nights ago. 

[Machias]

Looking forward to the updates!!  I like these semi live updates!!!   

[True Sportsman]

I am liking this thread! I hope you guys get into elk, and I get the feeling you will have fun if you get an elk, or not...

[bearpaw]

Day 5
At least it wasn't as cold overnight I awoke and I wasn't shivering, but next time I will take my warmer sleeping bag no matter how warm we think it's going to be. 

We got ready to go after the 330 bull well before daylight. But Anthony and I had been discussing Myrons rifle, it had seen a lot of activity, carried over rocks, carried on ATV's, and we were worried about it being dead on in case we had to do some long distance shooting, the 330 bull was in pretty open country. I would post a photo of the 330 bull and where he was at, but it was too far away to take pics with our cameras, we do have video and when I edit video it will be on the video I make. So anyway we decided we better check the rifle so we waited for daylight to shoot. Just as I'm getting ready to shoot at a makeshift target, two other hunters pulled in to unload wheelers and they headed out hunting. It was tough to let someone ahead of us but as it turned out the rifle was 8 inches high at 50 yards.     

I thank god we had the determination to check the rifle before leaving on our wheelers. 

I bore sighted the rifle by looking at the target through the bore and scope and then shot 3 more shots with the last about 1 1/2" high at 100 yards. Myron had 9 cartridges left, we jumped on the wheelers and took a different route up the mountain to avoid our earlier competition. We stopped and thoroughly glassed every nook and cranny of the mountain. We took turns glassing various canyons and bugling in dozens of areas. We saw a rag 4x4 and some cows but by 11:00 am it appeared we were done for the morning, no answers back and no big bull. 

We were all hungry and thirsty but decided not to go back to the truck as we originally planned for lunch, instead we all wanted to keep hunting right through the heat of the day and make our limited water supply last the day. Boy was I wishing we would have brought lunch and more water with us. 

We glassed some more and then just before noon we decided to all go watch a canyon with water scattered in several spots. We were on the wheelers, Anthony who was leading at the time came around a corner of the trail in heavy cover and there was about a 320 bull in the road, the bull ran off the road and up the hill. I came around the corner and Anthony comes running down the trail to tell me what happened and that we needed to get a better look at that bull, "it's a pretty good bull at least 320" so we quickly headed up the trail to try and get to where we could see up the mountain. Anthony went around another couple corners in the trail and a cow and calf took off up the opposite ridge, then up jumps the biggest bull we had seen yet on this trip, everybody jumps off the wheelers, Myron is getting his scope on the bull and asks if it's the same bull we had just seen, Anthony replies "NO, But Shoot Him"... 

I was fumbling trying to get my video camera out, running, and on the bull for the shot and "BOOM" the bull falters, Anthony said "shoot again", Myron takes aim again "BOOM" and the bull goes down. Even though the bull was 308 yards, we can all clearly see it's the biggest bull we have seen during the hunt. We are all excited and congratulating Myron on the shooting and the bull manages to get into an upright bedded position. He tried to get up twice and we were going to shoot again, but twice he couldn't seem to get up, so I said "let's move in closer for a better killing shot".

The bulls antlers are better than I had predicted to Myron when he booked the hunt and I was feeling pretty darn good at this point. We quickly organized our gutting and packing neccessities and started up the hill to the bull. We made it about 80 yards, and suddenly Anthony who's leading says "He's getting up!" Myron takes a shot and misses over the back. The bull stumbles uphill and out of sight quickly before Myron can get another shot. 

I asked Quigly "nickname of a guide school student who has been doing a class with us for the last month" can you find that bull's bed and follow the bloodtrail, "Yes Sir, I'll find it". So Quigly heads up the ridge and the other 3 of us head back to the wheelers. We drove around the ridge to the other side where Anthony and Myron could watch this big hillside. I went farther up the canyon to watch just in case the bull had already gone farther up the canyon.

Seconds pass, more seconds pass, (Where's the bull?), a minute or two, and then probably ten minutes pass,   
Finally Quigly calls me on the radio, "I found his bed but there's no blood and the ground is too hard, there's no tracks!"   

I replied "Stay right there, I'm coming up to help." I finally reach Quigly gasping for air and see the dillemma myself, NO BLOOD! 

I look around and could see where an animal had passed through some grass that was turned, finally found a track and had Quigly move up to the track. Pretty soon I find a couple more spots of disturbed soil and I have Quigly move forward with each new find. I told him to look around at each location for any blood, finally after 50-60 yards Quigly spotted a tiny drop of blood, (we are on the right trail). I made it another 20-30 yards and couldn't find another sign of any type. I am now feeling the full effects of bad judgement, "We should have shot that bull again before we headed up the ridge." I am now having visions of looking the rest of the afternoon and never finding the bull. I can imagine us watching for ravens over the next few days as the bull was hit hard enough he could barely get up and couldn't run fast at all, he is bound to die somewhere.     

The brush is thick and there's too much grass on the ground, I seemed to have lost his trail as there are no visible signs of passage by any recent animal. So I moved downhill about 30-40 yards and was poking around in the maple brush when the bull jumps up 10-15 yards away, I can see his antler tops as he plows his way through the brush and out of sight, "THANK HEAVEN" at least we haven't lost him yet. I called down to Anthony and told him to "Reposition farther up the road because the bull was headed down through the thickest brush.", then I said "Try to get a shot but holler at us before you shoot so we can hit the ground." 

I told Quigly to move around the ridge to where he could see down to the road so the bull didn't escape around the sidehill without us knowing. I am still worried about no blood trail and the hard ground not leaving tracks. I move to where the bull was hiding and I find another bed and some ruffled leaves in the direction he headed downhill, but still no blood. 

I am feeling much better now and thinking we are going to kill this bull somehow. I stumble around trying to find footprints or disturbed leaves, I'm making my way slowly through the brush when suddenly the bull jumps up again and heads downhill, "He's up again and headed straight downhill!" I hollered. Then the bull stepped into some shorter back high brush and stopped, I moved to within about 8 yards and the bull refused to move any further, he just stood there popping his teeth at me, I hit him with a rock, still no movement, I hollered down, "He won't move any farther, you are going to have to come up the hill and shoot him."

I think I more or less eluded before, Myron has some severe leg problems that limits his mobility in rough country, but he started working his way up the mountain through the thick maple brush. The bull and I stared at each other for what seemed like an eternity, I was afraid to get any closer since the bull was on his feet and capable of moving fast when he wanted, and he was obviously very mad at me.

Finally Anthony hollered up the hill, "We can see him well enough to shoot!" so I backed off 20 yards and Myron hammered the bull in the shoulder again. He dropped like a sack of potatoes but continued to thrash around. I waited for Myron to battle his way up, and I asked "What kind of bullets are you shooting?" Myron replies "Ballistic Tips, everyone says they are deadly!" I explained quickly that they blow up too fast and don't penetrate big game that well, let's put another one into his ribs up close to try and get into the lungs. Myron shot the bull again with the barrel 3 feet from the ribs and we still had to wait 5 minutes for the bull to expire. We all felt terrible for the bull and Myron felt especially bad apologizing for his shooting. I said "Myron it's not your fault, you hit the bull in the shoulder twice, people talk these bullets up for big game and as you can see they may work on deer but ballistic tips are not suited for big game like elk and bear, it's not your fault, don't blame yourself."

The bull finally expired and we set him up as well as we could on the steep hillside and thick brush for pictures. We all admired the bulls headgear and then began the task of piecing the bull up and packing him out. We got the wheelers loaded and headed back to the truck. At the truck we drank water like horses and swallowed our lunch like heathens. We loaded everything up and headed to Myron's friend's house, we got the quarters hung up, then I caped the head for Myron's long trip back home.

I logged my laptop onto the B&C website and we entered all the horn measurements. The bull lost a lot with his very short right G-5 and had only 37 inches inside spread, but with 51 1/2 and 50 inch main beams, 19 1/2 and 21 inch G-4's, and circumferences all above 7 inches, the bull grossed 348 even. The bases were awesome too, 12 and 12 1/4. Finally done late that night we tried to get a motel in the nearest town so we could all shower, they weren't open, we ended up pulling camp and driving an hour to the next town where we got our badly needed showers and warm beds, and slept until 10 the next morning.   

I didn't get to call this bull and can claim no amazing guiding skills by any of us resulted in this bull, all I can say is that sometimes it's better to be lucky than good, we were persistent and darn lucky. 

(I would have sent in a short message when we made the kill, but I forgot to charge my phone and it was dead.)

[RadSav]

Great story.  Like taking a step back in time when I was guiding.  I remember those phone calls from clients asking, "What bullet and cartridge should I use?"  And, after an hour long phone conversation they would show up with something the kid at Larry's Sports Center who had taken his first deer and only big game animal the year before told him was the best thing for Bear hunting since the development of smokeless powder.  Still sounds like the kill was more humane than being eaten by a wolf in the dead of winter.  Your hunter should be thrilled.

Sounds like Quigly got a bargain in his schooling.  Might go another 10 years and not get a chance to learn that kind of old school tracking.  Bet he never forgets the day Bearpaw pulled a rabbit out of his hat and turned it into a 348 bull!  Love it when those cocky youngsters are stopped in their tracks with that stunned look of "How in the F*&% did he do that?"  Pure skill and maturity young man

Thank you for sharing.  I really enjoyed it.

[BOWHUNTER45]

Awesome Dale...thanks for a good story and I am glad you explained the BALLISTIC TIP Thing....But I must say one thing ... there are different types of ballistic tip bullets some are hollow points with a polytip and a hornaday SST is a solid base bullet with a polytip which will drop some sheet !!! Just thought I would mention that so people understand before buying them ,, Awesome Bull !!!!

[bearpaw]

He said they were Ballistic Tips, I didn't know there was more than one type, so I didn't ask about that.

I will offer a few more details about the bulllet performance. He was shooting a 300 Win Mag, so it was plenty of gun. But not a single bullet made it more than halfway through the animal. The shoulder shots had broken the shoulder, but did not penetrate the chest cavity. One shot had broken a back leg about 4 inches above the knee. The last shot when he poked the barrel 3 feet from the bulls ribs had disintegrated by the time it got to the first lung, did not appear to touch the second (farther) lung and not a single bullet touched the other opposite side of the rib cage. I was shocked and I am certain that Myron will never buy Ballistics for bigger game again.

I will say, I bet they would cut a coyote in half.... 

[norsepeak]

Great job, way to stay calm and sort out that trail.  As a guide there is a lot of pressure when it's time to track a wounded bull and there is not much sign.  Good job, and nice bull.

[bobcat]

Good story Bearpaw. I wish you'd write up a story on every hunt you do, that was an enjoyable read.
 
Bowhunter45, Ballistic Tips are made by Nosler. The Hornady's may be similar, or look similar, but they're not Ballistic Tips. I use them but would never use them for elk or bears. I shot an antelope with my 270 and 150 grain Nosler ballistic tips a few years back. The distance was 315 yards, so it's not like the bullet's velocity was excessively high, the antelope was broadside and the bullet went in right behind the shoulder. It dropped him in his tracks, so that was good, but I was surprised to see that not even one bullet fragment made it to the rib cage on the far side. The bullet hit one rib going in and apparently disintegrated. I never did find the bullet or even a piece of it. It made a mess of the lungs but I surely would not trust that same bullet for anything bigger than a deer.
 
 

[bearpaw]

When I skinned and studied the damaged areas, I came to the same conclusion bobcat, nothing bigger than deer. I bought some v-Maxes for coyote hunting, but I may buy some ballistic tips for coyotes, it seems they would terminate a coyote if hit anywhere in the main body. 

[bobcat]

Yes, I have lots of Ballistic Tips loaded up for my 270, and that's probably about all I'll use them for. I like them for the fact that I haven't found a more accurate bullet in my 270. I have read that there are a few of the ballistic tips made with a heavier jacket so they'll hold together better, but I'm not sure how a guy is supposed to know which ones. I know it's one of the heavier 30 caliber BT's. But there's really no reason to use a Ballistic Tip for elk when Nosler now has the Accubonds.

I do think they can't be beat for an antelope bullet. Or, as you said, coyotes.   

[Michelle_Nelson]

Are you guys talking about the  Hornady's Superformance SST's?   
 
BTW BearPaw I should still have a box of those under the seat in the truck we used on my Bear Hunt this spring. 

[mulehunter]

I knew it.  Great story....

Mulehunter.   

[bearpaw]

Here's a story about our first week of bear season in September a few weeks ago.

I had two hunters, Kelly had brought his wife antelope hunting with me in 2009, we had a fun and exciting hunt and she killed a nice buck in Montana so Kelly booked a bear hunt for 2010. At the last minute Kelly's schedule got messed up so he had to reshedule his hunt for this year. My other hunter Bob had hunted whitetail with us before and seems to be at his best on stand as he has been retired for several years and can't get around too well any more. They both arrived on Aug 31 to start bear hunting Sept 1.

Day 1 and 2
On the first morning I had Bob on a stand in the middle of a tremendous amount of bear sign. Within a couple hours another hunter killed a bear within 100 yards of Bob, that was a bit of a bummer, but that's hunting. We had decided to hunt public land that day instead of one of my private leases. So that was just the way it goes. 
Later on the first day Mike (now nicknamed Quigly) missed a nice bear. Then a little later Scott shot and wounded a big bear at 220 yards, Brian and Scott were tracking it and suddenly a bear appears in front of Luke about 1/4 of a mile away, so Luke hammered that bear, as it turns out it was the wounded bear that Scott had wounded, anyway Luke killed it so he tagged it, that bear squared 6'-4".

Kelly, Bob, and I hunted several days seeing plenty of good tracks and other sign, but no bear. 

I would put Bob on the best stand I could find and then take Kelly with me to try other hunts. Most of my other guides and their hunters were seeing bear and even though Kelly, Bob and I were getting along great, it was beginning to seem like Kelly and Bob had the wrong guide for the bear killing part of the hunt. I have some really talented younger guides working for me and I have to admit, we all have a lot of friendly competition going on between us and they were doing much better than I was, so I was starting to feel the pressure of the younger guides finding more bear and making the older guide not look so good.    

We covered a lot of ground trying to find bigger bear, we watched feeding areas, we watched waterholes, we still hunted, we roadhunted, I checked apple trees, we hiked around mountains, we checked swampy areas, I pulled just about every rabbit out of my hat and not a one of them would turn into a bear.    I have no idea why Bob and Kelly still had any faith in me. 

A few other bear were seen by the other hunters but nobody else killed any other bear the first two days.

Day 3
Bill was the only person to shoot at a bear on the 3rd day and unfortunately he thought he missed as he couldn't find any sign of a hit.

Day 4
In the morning I sent Ray with Bill as he is my best tracker, on the way in they spot a huge brown bear but can't shoot because they don't know for sure if Bill already had a dead bear or not, so they let it go. Ray found where the bear was standing the evening before when Bill shot and found the bullet in the ground, with no blood or meat on the bullet and figuring shooting angles, Bill had obviously shot too high completely missing the bear. Bill hunted that area the rest of the day seeing only a sow and cubs.

Kelly, Bob, and I had seen coyotes, whitetail, muledeer, moose, elk, but still no bear. This morning I posted Bob in an area that Anthony had seen two bear the day before and Kelly and I hiked into an old favorite spot I used to hunt years ago, there was quite a bit of sign so we just kept still hunting farther and farther. By 10 am we had seen two bear but had no shot opportunities, we were probably a couple miles from the vehicle and around a very steep mountainside and through some heavy cover. We sat down and was watching some good brush, I asked Kelly why he booked a Washington hunt instead of an Idaho hunt where he lives, he said "All I could find in Idaho are bait or hound hunts and I wanted to do a spot and stalk style bear hunt, he said the harder I work for a bear the more I will like it, plus I had a good time on my wife's antelope hunt in Montana!", so that's why he booked the bear hunt with us in Washington.

It was now after 10 am and we normally all meet for lunch somewhere, I needed to pick up Bob by noon, the lunch for everyone was in my vehicle, and nobody else knew where I was parked, so I asked Kelly if he wanted to stay and watch this area and I would hike back in with his lunch later, or if he would rather hike out with me for lunch. Kelly opted to stay put and watch for bear, I told him I would try to be back by 3 pm with food and more water. This was another time I had not planned on staying on the mountain all day and neither of us had packed enough water or food for the whole day in the heat and it was nearly hot enough to fry eggs on the rocks, anyway I left Kelly and headed out to the vehicle to go get Bob. 

At lunch we all discussed various plans for the afternoon hunt and after lunch I posted Bob in a little different location and then I drove back to my parking spot, loaded my pack with food and drinks for Kelly, and headed back up the mountain. I was late getting back to Kelly and he told me he had shot at a bear two or three hours earlier, but thought he had missed. I made my way down to where he said the bear was, I found bear tracks of a 200ish bear, but no blood and no dead bear anywhere in the brush. While I was looking for the bear Kelly saw another bear, but it was too far to shoot and so he passed. We started hiking out a little before dark, but found ourselves getting out long after dark. Thankfully the other guys had picked up Bob for me so he didn't have to wait for Kelly and I. When we got back to the house half the guys were already in bed.    I learned that Anthony was on a good bear for 30 minutes but they could never get a good shot. Nick and John also spotted a big bear, again they couldn't get a shot and ended the day with no bear. Talk about bad luck, we were feeling the wrath. 

Day 5
The next morning I posted Bob in a new location hoping for some action, then Kelly and I loaded our packs for the day and headed up the mountain to the same area as we hunted the day before. On the way in I spotted bear tracks over the top of our footprints from the day before. We got to a good vantage point and for two or three hours, off and on, we watched a 2 1/2 year old black bear working berries, Kelly was going to shoot him as he wanted good meat as much as anything, but every time Kelly was about to pull the trigger the bear would move and then he wouldn't have a good shot. I told him not to shoot unless he was sure it was a good shot. We also saw another bear but it was out of range and just too far to be shooting at a bear. Finally about 11:30 Kelly thought he heard something close to us in the brush, we both listened closely, sure enough "snap-crack", it was definitely a bear working the brush, suddenly we get a quick look at a nice sized brown bear moving through the brush at 50 yards, but not enough time to get on him and shoot. 

I told Kelly the bear had to be well over 200 pounds, that was probably the wrong thing to say, I could tell I only excited him with that remark, then suddenly we saw the bushes moving again at 100 yards, Kelly got on the bushes with his scope but we couldn't see the bear, the bushes quit moving and now nothing again. 

Pretty soon the bear stepped into an opening and broadside at about 200ish yards and Kelly took aim using my shooting sticks for a rest, "BOOM" the bear drops but immediately is back up and heading downhill as fast as he can go with only his front legs pulling him and dragging his hind end. I told Kelly "You spined him, he can't get away, let's just see if we give him a few minutes to lay if he will die, I hate to rush over there and push him farther down the mountain." I called the other guys and asked them to get Bob for lunch and told them we had shot a good bear. So we sat and watched for 20 minutes, finally I couldn't take it any longer, "Let's go find him!" I said as I stood up and we both headed over to where the bear was last seen.

Kelly searched about 50 yards north of me and I searched where I thought the bear was at, I couldn't find any blood (bear often do not bleed if fat blocks the bullet hole), but I did find bent over grass blades and some disturbed soil so I thought I was on the right trail, in about 5 minutes I saw the bear's outline in the brush and it appeared he was dead, "Kelly, I found him, he's over here". I moved in closer and poked him with a stick, yep he's dead, but OH MY GOODNESS, this is the worst case ever of myself miss judging a bear. This bear isn't well over 200, he is well over 300 and maybe close to 400 pounds, he's a pig of a brute... oh no, it's 2 miles to the vehicle... 

I called again for some help packing the bear out and then began skinning and boning. The fat on the bear's back was 3 to 4 inches thick, he was a fat bugger. By the time the other guys reached me I had the bear skinned and pretty much pieced out and ready to pack out. They had him off the mountain well before dark, but we all had sore feet that night from the steep mountainside. 

We measured the hide and the bear squared 6'9", he didn't make 7 feet, but he was still a dandy. The head was big with inscissors worn off smooth with his gums and his canines worn off about 1/4"-1/2", he definitely was an old bruiser. I told Kelly I wasn't too sure how he would eat but Kelly has since emailed me that the bear was good eating and he and his wife are enjoying it. I look forward to my next hunt with Kelly, he said he'll be back.

In the morning Bill had gone back to his hunting spot to watch for the bear he had missed or for the big bear he had to pass. He wasn't there for long and he spotted his bear on the hillside, "BOOM, bear down!' Bill gets over to his bear and discovers that he shot the wrong bear, he had a yearling, anyway he tagged it and took it to the house. Bill is down here in Idaho archery elk hunting right now and he was just telling me at lunch today he wishes he wouldn't have screwed up on the yearling, but like I told him, that big bear is good enough reason to look forward to next year. You may remember Bill from last year's Bearpaw thread, he killed a nice bear last year, but not as big as the one he saw this year.

Our bear success was not as good as usual this year and I didn't have other hunters coming in right away so I invited the guys with unfilled tags to stay extra days. Scott was able to stay longer and he killed a real nice bear a couple days later. I was glad to see him get another crack at one after losing a wounded bear to Luke. So that all worked out well in the end. Bob couldn't stay but I invited him back later for a doe hunt since he's well over 65 and can take a doe here.

Photos of Kelly's Bear

[firefighter4607]

Great Stories!!! Nice looking Bear and elk congrats to the hunters!!