Has WDFW revealed serious fault with Resource Allocation?

[huntnphool]

 

[Elkaholic daWg]

Bobcat if our low success rates are being caused by our low number of animals, and WDFW is not to blame for the decreased number of animals - who is to blame?

Or are you saynig there isn't a problem at all?

. Oh, and here's another one to blame- blame the voters for voting to ban hound hunting and bear baiting. How is that the WDFW's fault?

 Sorry (not really) to pick and choose.....But what was WDFW's official position on those ballot issues?

[CedarPants]

Bobcat if our low success rates are being caused by our low number of animals, and WDFW is not to blame for the decreased number of animals - who is to blame?

Or are you saynig there isn't a problem at all?

. Oh, and here's another one to blame- blame the voters for voting to ban hound hunting and bear baiting. How is that the WDFW's fault?

 Sorry (not really) to pick and choose.....But what was WDFW's official position on those ballot issues?

I would think if a ballot issue arises (let's say environmentalists gather enough signatures to get an initiative on the ballot banning ALL bear and cougar hunting) that the WDFW views as detrimental to their "goals" of successful wildlife management, they could step in and squash it.  I could be wrong, but it seems realistic that as the agency in charge of our wildlife they could disallow such an initiative to even make it to the ballot if it was deemed to contradict their management objectives.

And if that is the case, dang good question Elkaholic.

[Elkaholic daWg]

If I remember right..It was neutral at BEST

[Dave Workman]

If I remember right..It was neutral at BEST

You remember correctly. Possibly the best source on this would be Bearpaw.

But I recall this fiasco and at the time I talked to a guy in WDFW who I knew, and he simply said the agency "had to keep quiet" because it was a political issue. Which is bushwa. Idaho and Oregon and Michigan agencies weighed in when the same horse dung kind of initiatives were tried in those states.

The WDFW "greened" out because of political correctness.  It was at that juncture I lost any respect for them as a management agency, not that I had much before that, since the Gardner days and "secret agreements."

[Elkaholic daWg]

 


 As they were programming hunters to be good cash cows and accept"less is more"

[Glockster]

Regarding the 'herds are unhealthy' observations; I am not convinced many of our herds are really all that 'unhealthy". 

1) Methow & Chelan muledeer herds: seem pretty healthy to me....tons of beautiful 4pt/5pt bucks on winter range pics posted all over the photog page of this site.  I don't see very many late season permit holders posting "unhealthy" spindly 3pt pics. 

2) SE Muledeer: I counted 50-75 deer /day on my two weekends of Almota unit hunting.

3) Yakima elk:  Not many shot this year but i consider that the byproduct of shortened crappy season timing.  Not many shot last year either and then near record #'s showed up at the feed stations.  Oak Creek will look like a mini version of Jackson Hole elk refuge most years.  Seems like a pretty healthy herd to me.

Unhealthy:

Yakima deer herd....down at least 70%.....yet Berni and company claim to not have the $'s or mandate to do an accurate survey to find the extent of the problem.  (Kind of like the near extinction of Puget Sound true cod and pollack in the early 80's...the Dept kind of just walked away from this disaster).  Only those of us who were fortunate to hunt these units back in the 60's-80's know what a true disaster this is. 

Cascade foothill blacktail deer...(with exceptions of private timber lands where cutting still occurs)....certainly unhealthy in terms of raw #'s of deer available to hunters.  No food , no deer.

Like everything, the truth lies between the extremes. 

[Rainstorm Hunter]

If we want to get back to the good ole days of hunting in western washington we need to increase logging (with environmental laws never gonna happen)  We need to start trapping and hunting predators with hounds again.  And we need to get timber companies to stop spraying herbicides and let some more forage grow.  That is what needs to happen to spike the blacktail and roosevelt populations.  I cant really speak for the eastern half of the state since I have never hunted over there and dont really know the cicumstances of the game there.

[Dave Workman]

If we want to get back to the good ole days of hunting in western washington we need to increase logging (with environmental laws never gonna happen)  We need to start trapping and hunting predators with hounds again.  And we need to get timber companies to stop spraying herbicides and let some more forage grow.  That is what needs to happen to spike the blacktail and roosevelt populations.  I cant really speak for the eastern half of the state since I have never hunted over there and dont really know the cicumstances of the game there.

 

[bobcat]

If we want to get back to the good ole days of hunting in western washington we need to increase logging (with environmental laws never gonna happen)  We need to start trapping and hunting predators with hounds again.  And we need to get timber companies to stop spraying herbicides and let some more forage grow.  That is what needs to happen to spike the blacktail and roosevelt populations.  I cant really speak for the eastern half of the state since I have never hunted over there and dont really know the cicumstances of the game there.

I agree with all of that, and the WDFW has absolutely no influence on any of those things.

[sebek556]

uh Bobcat hunting predators and trapping is their area, so how the hell do they not have influance on it? if they want hound hunting then they could inform of the benefits then have a revote. 

[bobcat]

Don't you know there are now laws that ban trapping and hound hunting? The WDFW can't change that. I wish they could but they can't.

[JimmyHoffa]

They may not be able to bring back hounds, baiting for bears, and legholds; but they could be a bit more aggressive in predator management--offer a second cougar tag or not require tags/no bag limit, more tags/no limit for bears, increased season length, night hunting, etc.  Instead they gave weapons restrictions for cougars, and I no longer see second bear tags as being available. 

[CedarPants]

Bobcat what is your thought on the WDFW's ability to have been more involved when those bans were voted on? (If you already answered this and I missed it, I apologize).  I made a statement earlier that I believe the WDFW has the ability to squash initiatives if they disagree with them due to management objectives - would you agree with that or would you say I am off base there?  Basically - as the agency in charge of managing wildlife, do you think the WDFW has no say in hunting initiatives that come up for a vote?  If an initiative came up for a vote next year to ban all hunting, would the WDFW just sit back and watch because it is out of their hands?

[sebek556]

yes there are laws but guess what, if they would educate the population then have a revote it would fall. but instead of doing that they hide with their tails between their legs and do what they are told by the uninformed masses. A true department of fish and wildlife would educate people before there was a vote, or squash it entirely. not do what they are told like a good little puppy. Controling predator populations is their job, they can lobby to have laws changed. Stop drinking the they do what the can kool-aid and wake up. They do what they are told not what they can, cause they have the power to do a hell of alot more than then what they do.