Bighorn vs. Disc Extreme

[Wacenturion]

That's interesting.  Thanks for posting the photos.   I do however have a hard time believing Knight who designed the Bighorn primarily as a 209 gun with breech changeability to make it legal out west, and not not the reverse, would keep selling the majority of them back east if that were a problem. 

The Wolverine is the same gun as the Bighorn except got barrel length stock etc., but everything interchanges between the two.  I have not heard of any problems with them either.

But then again I haven't shot the 209 system in mine, so I really don't know.

[moosedrool]

Mike, what would I need to shoot 209's out of my DISC Extreme? I currently have the western kit.

[Angus]

I did alot of reading on various sites before buying my Bighorn and never heard anyone mention any shrapnel issue when using 209's in their BH's, not that I plan on using 209's.
As for the 150 grain issue, I have no plans of shooting that kind of load but a guy I work with has been for years with his Bighorn and never had an issue.
Really don't think $100 more will make the deer/elk I hunt any deader.

[Sabotloader]

That's interesting.  Thanks for posting the photos.   I do however have a hard time believing Knight who designed the Bighorn primarily as a 209 gun with breech changeability to make it legal out west, and not not the reverse, would keep selling the majority of them back east if that were a problem. 

All plunger guns started life as a 'cap' gun, the only reason that MK-LK-and Big Horn have the option of 209 primers is because the public demanded it since they believed it was necessary.  I believe they are aware of a small possible safety problem shooting 209's and really do push shooting caps in the open breech style plunger guns.  In fact Knight would much rather sell Extremes than the Big Horn, but again the public believes they need the Big Horn, especially the PAC Northwest folks and they, Knight, needs a rifle to compete with the foreign imports in price in the other markets.

The Wolverine is the same gun as the Bighorn except got barrel length stock etc., but everything interchanges between the two.  I have not heard of any problems with them either.

But then again I haven't shot the 209 system in mine, so I really don't know.

Correct on the Wolverine... and if you shoot lighter bullets and reduced loads of T7 the blow back pressure is not as significant.  If you are shooting real BP (except Swiss) or the Pyro's the problem is not as prevelant either.

I personally now only shoot #11 mag caps from my MK - Wolverine - or Big Horn - as you have said that is really all you need and it is much safer.

I must also admit i was one of those folks that believed you you had to shoot 209's to be a real shooter... and I wanted the 209 conversion for that series of rifles - but today - older/wiser...

[Sabotloader]

Mike, what would I need to shoot 209's out of my DISC Extreme? I currently have the western kit.

You will need to order from Knight another bolt housing and either a FPJ (full plastic jacket) breech plug or a NFPJ (non full plastic jacket - bare primer) breech plug.

If you talk to Robin @ Knight she will know exactly what you need...

[Sabotloader]

I did alot of reading on various sites before buying my Bighorn and never heard anyone mention any shrapnel issue when using 209's in their BH's, not that I plan on using 209's.
As for the 150 grain issue, I have no plans of shooting that kind of load but a guy I work with has been for years with his Bighorn and never had an issue.
Really don't think $100 more will make the deer/elk I hunt any deader.

Shooting lighter bullets and reduced powder loads - you will not see the problem created by heavy loads and heavy projectile...

Guess I would not consider a 150 grain load of anything other than real BP or Pyro - but even then i do not think it is needed.

[Tim in Wa.]

Does the Bighorn have the same action as the old MK 85 ?I saw one of the MK85 s on a used gun rack yesterday. It looks like a well built gun but I was struck  by how difficult it looked to remove the nipple. It looked like you needed an Alen wrench
Tim

[Sabotloader]

Does the Bighorn have the same action as the old MK 85 ?I saw one of the MK85 s on a used gun rack yesterday. It looks like a well built gun but I was struck  by how difficult it looked to remove the nipple. It looked like you needed an Alen wrench
Tim

My biased opinion only... I really like the MK reciever better... the Big Horn reviever is open on both sides and is better suited for the left hand shooter than is the MK.  Both work great.

They are really simple to take apart or remove nipple and breech plug.  The plunger just screws out and a wrench is insterted with to remove either the nipple or the BP or both..

[gutsnthegrass]

Thanks everyone for the info, i'm new to the muzzeloader thing.  This has all been great info, a couple more questions though, are they using the same barrels for the bighorn and the disc extreme?  I am still trying to justify the extra $100.  Have any of you noticed a difference in accuracy between the 2 guns?  Thanks.

[Wacenturion]

Thanks everyone for the info, i'm new to the muzzeloader thing.  This has all been great info, a couple more questions though, are they using the same barrels for the bighorn and the disc extreme?  I am still trying to justify the extra $100.  Have any of you noticed a difference in accuracy between the 2 guns?  Thanks.

Same barrel on Bighorn and Disc Extreme....26" hand crafted barrel, 416 Stainless Steel, 1:26 twist on 50 caliber.  Look at it this way....if you owned a company and wanted to maximize profits without sacrificing quality, then you would copy what Knight has done.  Essentially their muzzle loaders appear to me anyway to be all the same basic design with modifications. 

The Bighorn and Wolverine are essentially the same gun with the exception of barrel length and ignition system, however everything interchanges between those guns.  I know as I have a couple of both.  If I were hunting Blacktails I would opt for the Wolverine with it's shorter barrel.  Whitetail or more so Mule deer I would use my Bighorn.  Both however will work for any of those animals.  It's knowing your weapon and it's limitations and shot placement at correct distances.

I don't know, but it would not surprise me if the Bighorn and Disc Extreme are somewhat equally similar.  The following photos are from Knight's website.  Obviously the picture is the same and verified by the serial number.  Funny thery use the same photo for both models.  Hmmmmm

Disc Extreme......from Knight's website




Bighorn...........from Knight's web site




There is a difference in the guns however....bolt type on the disc vs. plunger type on the Bighorn/Wolverine.  Just wonder if that assembly can be swapped if you have both in hand.  Probably not as the stocks appear different, primarily to accept bolt turn down.  In conclusion.....it appears with the exception of that feature, guns are the same.

Disc Extreme




Bighorn




 

[Sabotloader]

Thanks everyone for the info, i'm new to the muzzeloader thing.  This has all been great info, a couple more questions though, are they using the same barrels for the bighorn and the disc extreme?  I am still trying to justify the extra $100.  Have any of you noticed a difference in accuracy between the 2 guns?  Thanks.

In a Knight the barrels ands reciever are not separate.  The barreld action is all one piece. 

The metal used and the machinery used to produce one barreled action are the same other then the program that dictates how the reciever of each is built.

The real difference in the two is the Reciever.  One is a large open breech reciever the other is more closed and less exposed.


Wacenturion last post has a couple of small errors... the twist rate on a 50 cal Knight is 1-28 not 1-26, althought the Knight 52 cal is 1-26.

Also the picture he posted of the Big Horn reciever area from the Knight web site is incorrect.  Both of those pictures are the DISC Extreme.  The picture on the web site is incorrect - not his fault.

This is the reciever-breeh area of an extreme with a Western Kit BP and musket nipple installed.



Here is a picture with the bolt installed and a #11 cap on the nipple...



I just do not have a good picture of the reciever opening of a Big Horn, you might be able to tell something from this...

 

or this Big Horn but it is a bad angle...



Well Shoot! Wacenturion last picture shows the Big Horn breech area real well.  Just remember that picture shows the plunger (hammer) closed! while hunting you are likely to have the plunger pulled back and then the entire breech area is exposed to the weather elements + mother natures dropping needles, leaves, and etc.  I hate dropping larch needles they fill everything... but maybe you do not have larch/tamarack where you hunt.

But, back to your basic question... There would be very little difference in accuracy between the two.  The real difference is the amount of exposure to the elements while hunting if that is a concern... Here in Idaho it is a big concern for me - our weather is lousy a lot of the times.

[Wacenturion]

Thanks for correcting that.  It was a typo.  I meant to put 1:28.  You are also correct in that the barrel and action are one piece.  Guess I was in my mind reverting back to my T/C .54 Renegade, where the barrel with nipple is separate from the side plate and hammer.  My bad....lol.

One last comment.  I prefer and use the German musket caps, and have never had a problem with ignition on my T/C Renegade or my Knight Bighorns or Wolverines.  They fit tight keeping moisture out of the nipple, are hotter than most other caps and always deliver.

Can't go wrong with either gun.  Is it worth the extra cost.  Perhaps based on looks, functionality, resale, etc.  Not that the Bighorn is less of a gun, it's just if the extra cost is that big a deal or not.  If it's not and you like the features and looks of the Disc Extreme better, then by all means, go for it. 

[Sabotloader]

Thanks for correcting that.  It was a typo.  I meant to put 1:28.  You are also correct in that the barrel and action are one piece.  Guess I was in my mind reverting back to my T/C .54 Renegade, where the barrel with nipple is separate from the side plate and hammer.  My bad....lol.

One last comment.  I prefer and use the German musket caps, and have never had a problem with ignition on my T/C Renegade or my Knight Bighorns or Wolverines.  They fit tight keeping moisture out of the nipple, are hotter than most other caps and always deliver.

Can't go wrong with either gun.  Is it worth the extra cost.  Perhaps based on looks, functionality, resale, etc.  Not that the Bighorn is less of a gun, it's just if the extra cost is that big a deal or not.  If it's not and you like the features and looks of the Disc Extreme better, then by all means, go for it.

That is really the key point...

[BiggLuke]

All I know is... My Knight Bighorn has never failed me. And is slightly lighter than the disc.

I vote Bighorn.

[Bearhunter]

Hey Sabotloader, what do you think about the Traditions Northwest Ultralight?  Held one today it seemed like a well built gun and super light with a 28" barrel.  I dont like all the plastic trigger guards, but I guess plastic is much more shock or drop resistant.  Whats you opinion on this gun?  Thanks in advance!