Federal and State Wildlife Agencies Destroying our Elk

[humanure]

I don't hate anyone. I disagree with some people, but i don't hate. Hate is for bigots and homophobes. My best friend is an avid long-bowman and hunter. I don't hate him. Plus I hunt as well. So to break it down(again), I love hunting, I love the skill that it brings. However, I disagree with alot of methods and attributes that some other hunters hold.

As for the NPS, it's because people, like Leopold, saw how things were being handled in a strict 'for-profit' sense, and knew that if our forests were not protected or at least restricted from logging companies and certain 'game' organizations, our wildlife, natural landscape and resources would have fallen in the wake of so-called progress. The government and the departments in charge of wildlife only looked at the landscape as a means to make money, without caring for the eco/biology and how we were going to effect it. So many out in the field, like Leopold, who had an understanding of wildlife and The Sanitation Effect saw what was to come and acted before it was too late. My reference is The Sand County Almanac.

[Bob33]

I don't hate anyone. I disagree with some people, but i don't hate. Hae is for bigots and homophobes. My best friend is an avid long-bowman and hunter. I don't hate him. Plus I hunt as well. So to break it down(again), I love hunting, I love the skill that it brings. However, I disagree with alot of methods and attributes that some other hunters hold.

As for the NPS, it's because people, like Leopold, saw how things were being handled in a strict 'for-profit' sense, and knew that if our forests were not protected or at least restricted from logging companies and certain 'game' organizations, our wildlife, natural landscape and resources would have fallen in the wake of so-called progress. The government and the departments in charge of wildlife only looked at the landscape as a means to make money, without caring for the eco/biology and how we were going to effect it. So many out in the field, like Leopold, who had an understanding of wildlife and The Sanitation Effect saw what was to come and acted before it was too late.

You didn't answer the question.  What is your reference for claiming that national parks were developed as protection against logging? 

[humanure]

I re-edited and said "The Sand County Almanac". I'll add various Leopold biographies and books of how the NPS and wildlife conservation was started. The logging companies had to be held back from having all of out forests in their death-grip's.

[humanure]

I'm not naive and hate the logging industry. To live, we need that resource. But I am aware that they base their motives on money.

[Bob33]

I re-edited and said "The Sand County Almanac". I'll add various Leopold biographies and books of how the NPS and wildlife conservation was started. The logging companies had to be held back from having all of out forests in their death-grip's.

Interesting.  Sand County Almanac was published in 1949, right before the first national park was established as protection against logging.

Thanks for the history lesson. 

[humanure]

Yes, of course! Thats where I get my reference of how things were going leading up to the decision to create something like the NPS.

[humanure]

The other Leopold biographies and books on US conservation painted a broader stroke of what went on before and after. But it's Sand County where you get the story leading up to it by one of the guys who was part of it all, who was there.

[Humptulips]

In a way, yes. It's the savior for a vast amount of things related to wildlife and the land we live in. I'm telling you, had it not been for the NPS.... *shudders* holy *censored* we would be so fuking eef'd. It would be worse than England/Ireland. I had friends from Ireland over a couple years ago, and before coming to my house, none of them had ever held a rifle in their lives. In fact, they got super freaked out because it's ILLEGAL to own firearms back in their home, and they thought they were about to be in trouble. That's what America would have been like without the NPS.

You really do need to look at a map especially an old one from say the 60s. There are large parts of the US where there were no NPs in the 60s and that is mostly true today if you throw out all the developed Monuments.
Hunting seemed to thrive in those places in spite of this lack of NPs.
Tell me more about how the NPS defends our Second Amendment rights.

[GrainfedMuley]

The other Leopold biographies and books on US conservation painted a broader stroke of what went on before and after. But it's Sand County where you get the story leading up to it by one of the guys who was part of it all, who was there.

Blah, Blah, Blah...............................

[bearpaw]

I'm not naive and hate the logging industry. To live, we need that resource. But I am aware that they base their motives on money.

What kind of ******** are you. The reason any business exists is to make money. The reason anyone even works is to make money, that includes any agency, WDFW, NPS, USFS, or any other agency, people are there to make money, take away the money they would leave the agency. The reason the US has existed as a strong nation is because people want to make money and succeed. Nearly everyone in my family has worked in the logging industry and there is more game in NE Washington because of logging. You will have a hard time proving otherwise since the NE has the best hunting in the state for many big and small game species.

Your lack of intelligence is simply astounding.....

[Special T]

Funny how some people don't realize that clear cuts and selective logging is GOOD because ti provied grasses and other forage for deer and elk.  COVER is important, but FOOD is more important.... 

[WAcoyotehunter]

I agree that food is important and logging provides plenty of that, but thermal cover and escape cover are also critical.  Balance is the key to robust and sustainable populations.

Funny how some people don't realize that clear cuts and selective logging is GOOD because ti provied grasses and other forage for deer and elk.  COVER is important, but FOOD is more important.... 

[Special T]

The best kind of cover is EDGE  habitat... Logging can be a great tool to create lots of  artifical medows or food.  Lots of the thick stands of doghair, or lodgepole pine on the hillsides great great "thermal" cover due to its ability to protect and ddropp wind. 

[bearpaw]

For years I heard loggers getting a bad rap about clearcuts. Most of the loggers and landowners I know prefer selective cutting to get maximum growth. You can log every ten years when done properly and this keeps cover and encourages forage growth while at the same time getting maximum growth of forests.

The large clearcuts that gave logging a black eye were the product of the USFS prefferred techniques and big logging companies.

Modern clear cuts are often done on small acreages and much logging is selective cut with no clear cutting. Modern mozaic patterns of logging provides everything that most animals need.

[asl20bball]

Lack of logging = lack of forest managment which indirectly is a lack of game management as the sun light allows vegitation to grow for animals. When logging is done properly it benefits so many things. To say otherwise is simply a lack of education and understanding.