Another pen raised trophy kill trying to get attention as new world record...

[Bullkllr]

Why is market hunting illegal? Some people I'm sure would like to do it.

[bobcat]

So then, you think that ranches/game farms that raise elk for meat should be abolished then? Bison? What about game birds?

Yes I do. I hate seeing elk and whitetail deer being raised like livestock. Bison are different since they are not considered to be wildlife- they ARE livestock.

I don't know of native game birds that are raised and then harvested for the meat or put out for paying hunters by a private organization or individual. Do you? If so, yes I'd be against that as well. Can you imagine a ruffed grouse farm?   

Thankfully, all of those things are illegal in THIS state.

[snowpack]

So then, you think that ranches/game farms that raise elk for meat should be abolished then? Bison? What about game birds?

Yes I do. I hate seeing elk and whitetail deer being raised like livestock. Bison are different since they are not considered to be wildlife- they ARE livestock.

I don't know of native game birds that are raised and then harvested for the meat or put out for paying hunters by a private organization or individual. Do you? If so, yes I'd be against that as well. Can you imagine a ruffed grouse farm?   

Thankfully, all of those things are illegal in THIS state.

the pheasant release program for the WDFW.  Other places quail/chukar are popular.

[seth30]

If they ever open up a pen raised wolf farm I would be the first in line to shoot one

[Bullkllr]

So then, you think that ranches/game farms that raise elk for meat should be abolished then? Bison? What about game birds?

Yes I do. I hate seeing elk and whitetail deer being raised like livestock. Bison are different since they are not considered to be wildlife- they ARE livestock.

I don't know of native game birds that are raised and then harvested for the meat or put out for paying hunters by a private organization or individual. Do you? If so, yes I'd be against that as well. Can you imagine a ruffed grouse farm?   

Thankfully, all of those things are illegal in THIS state.

the pheasant release program for the WDFW.  Other places quail/chukar are popular.

All pheasants are native to Asia. Chukars too. Not sure what quail they use, but according to state law I don't believe they can be "native".

[Taco280AI]

To me public land, DIY hunts are the best and hold the most weight for a trophy, even if they don't score the highest

[ELKBURGER]

I think high fence hunts have their place. They're not for me, but then again, I live in WA where I can drive about an hour to great hunting. I get time off to hunt. I'm not disabled yet. Having said that, I don't have a problem with it. It's kind of like taking the kids to a trout pond our out salmon fishing (most of them are pen-raised now, right?). I don't think that raised critters should be qualified for the record books but that's only my opinion.

I can see where the CEO of a big corporation only gets a weekend here and there to do anything might choose one weekend to do one of these hunts. He gets to satisfy the millions of years old hunting urge inside and be a manly man, if only for a short while. I can see where a disabled person might benefit from this. Maybe someone taking their kid to one if they don't have a lot of time but want to bond in an outdoor atmosphere. To each their own. 

A slight Exageration....

[Blue Mountain Adventures]

So some of you guys are ok with pen raised 500" bulls and 250" mule deer and released into "fair chase" hunting for a select high paying client and allowed to be entered into the existing B&C P&Y record books?

[REHJWA]

The problem at hand is when people want recognition or in some cases profit for killing an animal.
A trophy is in the eye of the hunter not this or any other forum. I am proud of every hunt successful or not because I know what I put into it. 

[snowpack]

So some of you guys are ok with pen raised 500" bulls and 250" mule deer and released into "fair chase" hunting for a select high paying client and allowed to be entered into the existing B&C P&Y record books?

As long as they are released on private land, yes.

[REHJWA]

So some of you guys are ok with pen raised 500" bulls and 250" mule deer and released into "fair chase" hunting for a select high paying client and allowed to be entered into the existing B&C P&Y record books?

As long as they are released on private land, yes.

A pen raised and released trout, pheasant, buck or bull is no where near the "trophy" of a native animal. If the animal has endured the trials of life to reach maturity then it deserves a place of honor, a stocked animal deserves a place in the freezer. 

[Kazekurt]

I think we are missing the greater issue here.  I have zero problem with lawful business conducted on private land.  Its a slippery slope to start regulating private  land ownership and commerce just because we don't approve of the practices or business conducted there.  Some people don't like liqueur stores, strip clubs, certain religions, or gasp...even hunting but there is a market and demand for all of those things and clearly there is also a market for "canned hunts" or these places would t be in business.  Not my cup of tea, but I'm not going to tell others who to spend or make money.  The real issue is the fame and commercialization of trophies.  People  now recognize that talking a monster can not only bring notoriety but also bring lots of  oppertunities for wealth! ( appearance fees, sponsorships, promoting products, reproductions, etc) and in cases were a person has money already it can bring fame and validation to stoke ones ego. 
  Almost every diehard hunter dreams of breaking a world record but for most of us that's NOT why we hunt.  We hunt because we love the  outdoors, the commrodery, the wildlife, and simply escaping the "real world" every now and then.  It saddens me that there are people out there willing to lie and cheat their way to a record.  Personally, if I can't look my friends in the eye and speak honestly about how my trophies were taken then I'd rather not have that trophy. 
  I don't have a problem with game farms or canned hunts as they have their place for some; but its laughable to see a hunter take an animal in this manner only to puff out there chest and lie or pretend its something its not.  I don't think the taking of the spider bull ( elk non typical WR) was that great of an accomplishment but at least MR. Austed was completely honest  in describing how he was able to take that magnificent animal.  He  used his resources to acquire the tag, hired an outfitter to follow it around, and got his WR but at least he got it legally and was open and honest about the entire process.  Again, not my cup of tea but I respect his honesty and marvel that he'd spend 250k for an experience like that.  As long as their is money to be made we will continue to hear stories of game farm animals that are "WR's taken in wilderness areas" or hard to reach places every year and most will eventually be debunked as someone else has almost always seen these animals and knows the real story.  Often it's not even the hunter that starts the rumor and in some cases he is the one that debunks it.

[Blue Mountain Adventures]

So some of you guys are ok with pen raised 500" bulls and 250" mule deer and released into "fair chase" hunting for a select high paying client and allowed to be entered into the existing B&C P&Y record books?

As long as they are released on private land, yes.

Explain why you believe this please....

[Kazekurt]

To me public land, DIY hunts are the best and hold the most weight for a trophy, even if they don't score the highest

I've always believed this and if everyone was honest it would be far and away the most respected record!

[pianoman9701]

To me public land, DIY hunts are the best and hold the most weight for a trophy, even if they don't score the highest

I've always believed this and if everyone was honest it would be far and away the most respected record!

I agree with that.