collapse

Advertisement


Poll

Lion hunting reg poll

I have sent emails to wdfw requesting increased lion hunting opportunity
50 (72.5%)
I have no intention of sending emails, i really dont care
19 (27.5%)

Total Members Voted: 69

Author Topic: Official notice that lion changes are on the table for 2020  (Read 13811 times)

Offline KFhunter

  • Global Moderator
  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Legend
  • *****
  • Join Date: Jan 2011
  • Posts: 20927
  • Location: The Wedge
  • My posts do not reflect an official opinion of HW
Re: Official notice that lion changes are on the table for 2020
« Reply #150 on: January 24, 2020, 06:17:54 PM »
 :yeah:

I'll be writing in (again) thanks for keeping up with this bango  :tup:

Offline Special T

  • Truth the new Hate Speech.
  • Washington For Wildlife
  • Trade Count: (+13)
  • Legend
  • ******
  • Join Date: Aug 2009
  • Posts: 20689
  • Location: Skagit Valley
  • Make it Rain!
    • Silver Arrow Bowmen
    • Silver Arrow Bowmen
Re: Official notice that lion changes are on the table for 2020
« Reply #151 on: January 24, 2020, 07:42:58 PM »
If you read the proposed changes the harvest level increase is not the goal.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930A using Tapatalk

In archery we have something like the way of the superior man. When the archer misses the center of the target, he turns round and seeks for the cause of his failure in himself. 

Confucius

Offline Bango skank

  • Trade Count: (+7)
  • Frontiersman
  • *****
  • Join Date: May 2014
  • Posts: 4020
  • Location: colville
Re: Official notice that lion changes are on the table for 2020
« Reply #152 on: January 24, 2020, 07:46:26 PM »
If you read the proposed changes the harvest level increase is not the goal.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930A using Tapatalk

Which is why we need to raise hell.

Offline hunter399

  • Political Topics
  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Sourdough
  • *****
  • Join Date: Feb 2014
  • Posts: 2012
  • Location: In your hunting spot
  • Groups: NRA RMEF
Re: Official notice that lion changes are on the table for 2020
« Reply #153 on: January 24, 2020, 07:49:06 PM »
If you read the proposed changes the harvest level increase is not the goal.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930A using Tapatalk
You are correct ,It's not the goal at all.
I would have to read the proposal again but pretty much all three suck.If you look at havest level.
Two birds in the Bush is always better than one in the hand-that way you can always go to the Bush and hunt another day .conservation=Better hunting.
Wrote by hunter399

Offline Nwgunner

  • Non-Hunting Topics
  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Tracker
  • **
  • Join Date: Aug 2017
  • Posts: 67
  • Location: Pasco
  • Groups: RMEF Sportsmans Alliance
Re: Official notice that lion changes are on the table for 2020
« Reply #154 on: January 24, 2020, 08:08:48 PM »
MINOR changes. I hate to be Debbie downer but no matter what comments we make the dates and numbers rarely change from the adopted 3 year period. The comment period is just a formality. :twocents:

I dont have high hopes either, but if we dont speak up our voices definitely wont be heard.  I for one am not ready to lay back and take it with a grin.  Look what we did with fall bear.  Everybody was naysaying that too, telling me i was blowin smoke up their asses.  The change got made outside of the normal season setting timeline, because people made a stink about it.  We need to make an even bigger stink about our lion problem.

Offline hunter399

  • Political Topics
  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Sourdough
  • *****
  • Join Date: Feb 2014
  • Posts: 2012
  • Location: In your hunting spot
  • Groups: NRA RMEF
Re: Official notice that lion changes are on the table for 2020
« Reply #155 on: January 24, 2020, 08:19:23 PM »
The Biggest problem with cougar management is the cougar populations.When the WDFW say we only have 2000 cougars statewide there not gonna give us a huge season and two tags.And there is no other scientific data on our end to prove this wrong .
With predator mangement everybody won when the two bear tags where given out early season opener for bear.Bear has a population that can support that ,added extra tag which is revenue.
I would like to see people push the APR min for whitetail VS cougar management we are all barking up the wrong tree .
We have been barking and the three options they gave suck.
The cougar management issues are taking away from other issues that could be making hunting better for future hunters.Just remember every time you bark about cougar management there is only 2000 cougars in the state .So it might be time to get over it and move on to other mangement strategies for deer and elk. :dunno:

Two birds in the Bush is always better than one in the hand-that way you can always go to the Bush and hunt another day .conservation=Better hunting.
Wrote by hunter399

Offline sandman76

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Pilgrim
  • *
  • Join Date: Oct 2012
  • Posts: 12
  • Location: n.e.king county
Re: Official notice that lion changes are on the table for 2020
« Reply #156 on: January 25, 2020, 02:39:57 PM »
Cats dont care about apr, they eat everything, and what they don't eat the wolves and coyotes n bears will!

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk


Offline buckfvr

  • Washington For Wildlife
  • Trade Count: (+4)
  • Frontiersman
  • *****
  • Join Date: Jun 2010
  • Posts: 3041
  • Location: PREDATOR PIT UNIT 121
Re: Official notice that lion changes are on the table for 2020
« Reply #157 on: January 25, 2020, 03:01:58 PM »
Its just going to wind up being a manipulation of words that dont have much if any affect on harvest.  They really really dont want hunters killing more cats.

Offline bigmacc

  • Non-Hunting Topics
  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Sourdough
  • *****
  • Join Date: Oct 2012
  • Posts: 1613
  • Location: the woods
Re: Official notice that lion changes are on the table for 2020
« Reply #158 on: January 25, 2020, 08:31:19 PM »
Its just going to wind up being a manipulation of words that dont have much if any affect on harvest.  They really really dont want hunters killing more cats.

Unfortunately you are probably right. Predators, and the expansion and growing populations of them are a tool to ever so slowly erode our hunting and in time all but eliminate it as far as some species go. This states government and its voters have and will continue to chip away, growing and nurturing predators is a great resource and tool to achieve the goal. I see it in the Methow already, its just a decade or so away from going draw only because that herd has been flata$$ed decimated by cougars, bears and now wolves, more and more deer are being killed every year by the growing numbers of all 3, the once largest migrating mule deer herd in the country that numbered 35,000 to 40,000 head has been sadly (and in not that long of time) reduced down to around 15,000 head, many(including myself) feel that estimate is about 5,000 head to high. As more and more folks move into that valley, the more and more don't want to see folks in orange walking around the hills, and as more new folks use it for recreation, a large percentage of them are anti hunting, fall in love with the valley and vote accordingly. Our game management is run by politics and voters in this state and until the politics change there will never be enough wolves, bear populations are just right, deer populations are doing great and cougar populations will ALWAYS be at about 2000 animals.... :twocents:

And no, I'm not giving up, they will still hear from me every chance I get.
I hope things change but until some new folks with different political views are voted in I,m afraid this stuff aint gonna change. Everyone needs to exercise their voting rights, it really is the only chance we have as far as the future of hunting in this state goes.
« Last Edit: January 25, 2020, 08:42:13 PM by bigmacc »

Offline O. Nerka

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Pilgrim
  • *
  • Join Date: Nov 2018
  • Posts: 11
  • Location: Winthrop, WA
Re: Official notice that lion changes are on the table for 2020
« Reply #159 on: January 25, 2020, 09:09:55 PM »
This is my first year keeping an eye on cougar seasons.  Looking at the Methow I see that 242 is closed already but the other GMUs are still open.  When is the usual time that Methow GMUs get closed?

Offline avidnwoutdoorsman

  • Forum Sponsor
  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Hunter
  • *****
  • Join Date: Feb 2019
  • Posts: 158
  • Location: Northwest
  • Groups: NWTF, PF, TU, DU, BCWF, NRA, BCH&A
Re: Official notice that lion changes are on the table for 2020
« Reply #160 on: February 06, 2020, 10:58:50 AM »
Proposed Rule Changes that need commented on....

https://wdfw.wa.gov/sites/default/files/2020-02/wsr_20-04-091.pdf

"WAC 220-415-100 2018-2019 and 2019-2020 Cougar.
The proposed changes are designed to give the Commission four options to choose from relating to recreational cougar
harvest guidelines. The non-status quo options are intended to extend seasons in areas where harvest has been historically
high, and where cougar human conflict is also high. The intended result of the longer season is to shift a proportion of the
cougar removal, currently carried out by agency personnel, to hunters:
The first option is status quo with one caveat, the density we used to set the guideline is the median of five research
projects that were conducted in Washington. The median is a better measure because it is not affected by outliers in
the data. In the past we used the mean.
Page 4 of 8
The second option also uses a median density that is calculated using only adult cougars that are 24 months or
older. This option reduces the guideline slightly, but sub-adult cougars harvested under this option would not count
toward the guideline for season closure.
The third option adjusts the guideline upward for units that exceeded the guideline by December 31 at least once in
the past five years. The new guideline is based on the highest harvest in the past five years. In this option there is the
assumption that density is higher in these areas. In two PMUs, the guidelines in this option were adjusted, so they did
not exceed an assumed density 4.15 cougars per 100 square kilometers. This was intended to keep the density
within an acceptable range based on research conducted in the western United States. This guideline includes adults
and sub-adults.
The fourth option is like option three, but only uses a density based on adult cougars and only counts adult cougars
towards the guideline."

If I read this correct we want to support the forth option? Younger cougars shot as "opportunity" don't count, and the population density or quota is set based off the best harvest year in the last 5 years so the units would stay open longer because of a higher quota... I am reading this correct?
Keep Calm Gobble On

Offline Bango skank

  • Trade Count: (+7)
  • Frontiersman
  • *****
  • Join Date: May 2014
  • Posts: 4020
  • Location: colville
Re: Official notice that lion changes are on the table for 2020
« Reply #161 on: February 06, 2020, 12:28:20 PM »
"The third option adjusts the guideline upward for units that exceeded the guideline by December 31 at least once in
the past five years. The new guideline is based on the highest harvest in the past five years."

Sooo... then gmu 121 would have a harvest guideline of 16???  Sounds good to me.  Not as good as NO guideline, but a big improvement. 

Offline Special T

  • Truth the new Hate Speech.
  • Washington For Wildlife
  • Trade Count: (+13)
  • Legend
  • ******
  • Join Date: Aug 2009
  • Posts: 20689
  • Location: Skagit Valley
  • Make it Rain!
    • Silver Arrow Bowmen
    • Silver Arrow Bowmen
In archery we have something like the way of the superior man. When the archer misses the center of the target, he turns round and seeks for the cause of his failure in himself. 

Confucius

Offline avidnwoutdoorsman

  • Forum Sponsor
  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Hunter
  • *****
  • Join Date: Feb 2019
  • Posts: 158
  • Location: Northwest
  • Groups: NWTF, PF, TU, DU, BCWF, NRA, BCH&A
Re: Official notice that lion changes are on the table for 2020
« Reply #163 on: February 06, 2020, 12:53:28 PM »
"The third option adjusts the guideline upward for units that exceeded the guideline by December 31 at least once in
the past five years. The new guideline is based on the highest harvest in the past five years."

Sooo... then gmu 121 would have a harvest guideline of 16???  Sounds good to me.  Not as good as NO guideline, but a big improvement.

Yes... but option four does option 3 plus it doesn't count sub-adult Cougars. So it would be 16 cougars that are 24 months or older.
Keep Calm Gobble On

Offline avidnwoutdoorsman

  • Forum Sponsor
  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Hunter
  • *****
  • Join Date: Feb 2019
  • Posts: 158
  • Location: Northwest
  • Groups: NWTF, PF, TU, DU, BCWF, NRA, BCH&A
Re: Official notice that lion changes are on the table for 2020
« Reply #164 on: February 06, 2020, 01:09:31 PM »
Here is the final draft that I read.

https://wdfw.wa.gov/sites/default/files/2019-12/draft__alternatives_for_cougar_management_final_draft.pdf


When you read F, you gotta wonder or it more confirms, WDFW really will set seasons based on feelings...
"Harvest Guideline calculations can vary by social needs within designated geographic portions of
the state. We would establish guidelines that do not always consider maintaining stable cougar
populations based on territoriality or cougar densities."

In one hand, in this instance, I'm almost ok with it, because they are possibly saying if the NE doesn't want cougars they can over harvest, but at the same time they are suggesting other areas could under harvest depending on social needs (feelings).... fundamentally wrong as far as wildlife management goes, so I can't get on board.
Keep Calm Gobble On

 


* Advertisement

* Recent Topics

Is Eastern Washington Elk Hunting dying? by huntnnw
[Today at 02:43:46 PM]


WDFW Commision considers ban on huntign competitions by Sitka_Blacktail
[Today at 02:43:02 PM]


Rbros "Basecamp Rifle Package" by h20hunter
[Today at 02:36:47 PM]


Oak creek elk feeding. by Karl Blanchard
[Today at 02:35:26 PM]


Baiting question. by Pegasus
[Today at 02:32:29 PM]


Utah 2020 Draw by grundy53
[Today at 02:18:56 PM]


Truck Racks by Skillet
[Today at 01:45:33 PM]


Adding used engine oil to the diesel tank by Skillet
[Today at 01:43:57 PM]


Wolf vs Peterbilt by nwwanderer
[Today at 01:40:03 PM]


No curiosity?! by JimmieD
[Today at 01:06:16 PM]


idaho non resident tag decrease, fee increase by idaho guy
[Today at 12:42:32 PM]


Traditions muzzleloader by ThurstonCokid
[Today at 12:33:04 PM]


Christensen arms stock takeoff semi custom by jakeweb
[Today at 12:17:53 PM]


Impulse buy! by jackelope
[Today at 12:10:14 PM]


Trumps EPA says NO to Pebble Mine by Skillet
[Today at 11:38:29 AM]


what do you make of this? by ghosthunter
[Today at 11:18:37 AM]


NWTF National Convention by Russ McDonald
[Today at 11:00:24 AM]


2015 Chevy window leak? by Crunchy
[Today at 10:51:19 AM]


What States Have You Hunted Turkeys? by northwesthunter84
[Today at 10:40:42 AM]


WTB Magpul American Hunter Stock by r5neum
[Today at 10:04:55 AM]