Bass and Walleye Rule change on the Columbia and tributaries-CRAZY

[Sniper101]

This rule proposal is ridiculous.  I fish for salmon, steelhead, bass, and walleye.  We've seem record/near record runs recently in the upper Columbia on salmon and steelhead.  There are millions and millions of dollars each year spend on protecting these runs.  These runs are doing just fine, so why create a negative impact on these other fisheries by making them limitless.   F#&*%g stupid, at best.

so true.

[WSU]

More smoke and mirrors from the state. If they really wanted to save the salmon and steelhead they would outlaw ALL Nets in Wa State waters.

Talk to your state legislators.  Commercial seasons are requried by state law.

[WSU]

What really needs to happen is 4 of the Snake River dams should be breached.

agreed

I think that is a terrible idea.  Do you know the mess that would cause over here.  For the last 4-5 years excluding this year we have seen record steelhead returns and salmon runs reviving. So how does this support removing the dams. I wasn't here before they put them in but I was here in mid 90's when they did the drawdown.  And it was a huge mess with millions of dollars of damage to the roads and other infrastructure.  We have 40 years of silt behind these dams and it would probably kill all the salmon and steelhead runs if the were removed all at once.  It would take BILLIONS of dollars to this and maybe Tens of BILLIONS of dollars.  Most of the people I talk to didn't want the dams in the first place but almost all don't want them removed.  So you can keep you dam removal ideas on your side of the mountains a leave us alone.
[/quote]

Actually, the studies show that dam removal wouldn't be as expensive as you allege, and that the cost of maintaing the 4 dams (which exist almost solely for barge transportation) would offset the cost of removal in the not too distant future.

[Sniper101]

The comercial seasons arn't the problem...and people will yell at me for hrowing out a race...but its the Tribal nets. Spendinding almost every day in the summer fishing for bass in the columbia I've seen the drastic effects these nets have on salmon, steelhead, and sturgeon...and hey blame it on he bass?! I understand we took the indians land and freedom but can't there be more fair ways to let them catch salmon, ways that don't have such a drastic effect???  

[Special T]

I no longer fish, but this issue illistrates a VERY important point. TURMOIL and the false complexicty of the problem gives cover for MANY groups to do unpopular things. The more individual issues that can be brought up for salmon (or any other ESA related animal) prolongs the useful life of the endangered animal in the debate. Lets just list a few of the groups with big $ that are affected by endangered fish. Farmers, Ranchers, ALL power companies, Timber companies, and landowners... The net has been cast fairly wide to catch as many people as possible, and thier $. Who are some of the groups that benift? Tribes, Gov agenceis, Non profits, Miigation companies ect.   

I think the reason why the simple solutions are not normally adressed is because it keeps everthing in a state of turmoil benifiting many parties.
To me this move is an action in the right direction. I just wish they would take a look at many other species that have gone unmanged and do something about it. 

[HUNTINCOUPLE]

Snipper, you talkin about the dip nets of off the fish platforms or gill nets?

[WSU]

Well, if native steelhead runs are ever going to be viable, damn removal should happen sooner than later.  From what I've read, it can be done responsibly. 

If not damn breaching, then at least sealion removal from the Columbia along with the gillnet ban.  That would be much more helpful than the band-aid approach of removing a limit on bass and walleye.

You have been reading the liberal/hippie press haven't you.  Almost all of the fisherman on the snake/clearwater have been catching 3 to 1  unclipped (or native) to every hatchery fish.  There is no difference in DNA between a wild fish over and hatchery fish.  If you took a 100 hatchery DNA's and 100 wild fish DNA's and mixed them up no bio in world could tell the difference.

Here is a quote from WDFW's webpage concerning Grand Ronde steelhead:

Stock Genetic Analysis Description: Microsatellite DNA analysis suggests the presence of multiple stocks within the Grande Ronde system and has shown that the naturally spawning fish are distinct from Wallowa hatchery summer steelhead (Shaklee and Young 2000b).

Apparently, they are genetically different than the summer runs released at Cottonwood and in Oregon.  You can read the full report on the web page if you are interested.

[Sniper101]

Snipper, you talkin about the dip nets of off the fish platforms or gill nets?

gill nets, the platform nets are much more realistic as far as harvest numbers go.

[WSU]

Also, I'm glad that we won't be paying game wardens and biologists to deal with these fisheries.  Hopefully their extra time is put to good use.

[Sniper101]

The comercial seasons arn't the problem...and people will yell at me for hrowing out a race...but its the Tribal nets. Spendinding almost every day in the summer fishing for bass in the columbia I've seen the drastic effects these nets have on salmon, steelhead, and sturgeon...and hey blame it on he bass?! I understand we took the indians land and freedom but can't there be more fair ways to let them catch salmon, ways that don't have such a drastic effect???  

Bass are predatory invasive fish, as are walleye. I'm not saying you're incorrect about the tribal netting. It's just not part of your thread. Bass and walleye are. They don't belong here and, respectfully speaking Sniper, if you don't think they're preying on other fish, you don't know much about bass and walleye.

I know alot about bass and walleye actually. I know walleye do eat a large portion of salmonoids when they are in the river, however reserch in the upper columbia shows that at most, salmonoids are only 20% of a basses diet when salmonoids are even present. Don't throw assumptions. I do try to imitate salmonoids with my bass baits when they are present, so yes I know bass eat them but the effects arn't that extreme. Not enough to legalize the slaughtering of plus sized bass and ruin the quality of bass in the columbia basin. 

[WSU]

The comercial seasons arn't the problem...and people will yell at me for hrowing out a race...but its the Tribal nets. Spendinding almost every day in the summer fishing for bass in the columbia I've seen the drastic effects these nets have on salmon, steelhead, and sturgeon...and hey blame it on he bass?! I understand we took the indians land and freedom but can't there be more fair ways to let them catch salmon, ways that don't have such a drastic effect???  

Bass are predatory invasive fish, as are walleye. I'm not saying you're incorrect about the tribal netting. It's just not part of your thread. Bass and walleye are. They don't belong here and, respectfully speaking Sniper, if you don't think they're preying on other fish, you don't know much about bass and walleye.

I know alot about bass and walleye actually. I know walleye do eat a large portion of salmonoids when they are in the river, however reserch in the upper columbia shows that at most, salmonoids are only 20% of a basses diet when salmonoids are even present. Don't throw assumptions. I do try to imitate salmonoids with my bass baits when they are present, so yes I know bass eat them but the effects arn't that extreme. Not enough to legalize the slaughtering of plus sized bass and ruin the quality of bass in the columbia basin. 

How many smolts can the million or so bass eat if smolts comprise 20% of their diet? 

[B.G.hunter]

Well, if native steelhead runs are ever going to be viable, damn removal should happen sooner than later.  From what I've read, it can be done responsibly. 

If not damn breaching, then at least sealion removal from the Columbia along with the gillnet ban.  That would be much more helpful than the band-aid approach of removing a limit on bass and walleye.

You have been reading the liberal/hippie press haven't you.  Almost all of the fisherman on the snake/clearwater have been catching 3 to 1  unclipped (or native) to every hatchery fish.  There is no difference in DNA between a wild fish over and hatchery fish.  If you took a 100 hatchery DNA's and 100 wild fish DNA's and mixed them up no bio in world could tell the difference.

Here is a quote from WDFW's webpage concerning Grand Ronde steelhead:

Stock Genetic Analysis Description: Microsatellite DNA analysis suggests the presence of multiple stocks within the Grande Ronde system and has shown that the naturally spawning fish are distinct from Wallowa hatchery summer steelhead (Shaklee and Young 2000b).

Apparently, they are genetically different than the summer runs released at Cottonwood and in Oregon.  You can read the full report on the web page if you are interested.

I don't know about the Grande Ronde fish but the Clearwater hatchery fish are the same because they were started out of the same fish 50 years ago.  The bios can see no difference between wild and hatchery.  I think those some hatchery fish on the Grande Ronde were transplants from another river system.

[Sniper101]

but they can be here as well. I do understand they need to be controlled, but with restrictions. And Im bring up tribal nets because why take it out on bass when there is so many other, much worse culprits?? The bass have been here way to many years to still be considering them "invasive species" guys so grow up. Everybody loves bass, theirs nothing wrong with them, yes they eat a few salmon smolt and deserved to be managed scientifically for whats best but completly uncontrolled harvest of the quality fish, which are the breeding fish and the fish that will be effected the worst is such a miserable fail by our fish and game department. Their job is to manage ALL populations of game fish and bass should be included in this. Its their job to find a healthy median between controlling the bass population and helping the salmon and steelhead populations as well. I'm as much a avid bass fisherman as I am an avid steelhead and salmon fisherman. I catch my share of both and it's my life. I want the best for both areas of species and this just is not it. Not to mention the sqawfish population, bass and walleye eat his species as well, keep that in mind.

[HUNTINCOUPLE]

Cant wait to float the lower Yak for smallmouth and catfish! Gonna bring lots of coolers with ice and fill the freezer! This is the best rule change in along time!

[Sniper101]

Cant wait to float the lower Yak for smallmouth and catfish! Gonna bring lots of coolers with ice and fill the freezer! This is the best rule change in along time!

and there goes all thee big 3-4 pound hens tha go up the Yak to SPAWN. The big fish bass fisherman strive to catch, and are so easily caught when they are spawning because they are protecting their young! The big fish don't even taste good, thats somthing people dont undersand. Sometimes I take my family along and will keep 10 or 12 small, 12 inch fish for he frying pan and thats fun every now and then. But now everyone is going to slaughter those large hens that don't even taste good. Catch and Release the big ones, thats all I ask.