HB 2579 "Give Fish a Chance Act" New Mineral/Prospecting Permit Created

[lokidog]

Lets hope it doesnt even get a hearing. I have done a little panning with a small shovel and a pan just taking my kid out to the creek. I can tell you that if i have to purchase a permit i won't be going. Istill think that hand methods should be excempt from a $ permit... So far i only have acouple of flakes for my  several trips out with the kids.

 

[Jingles]

Being a dredger myself I am very pleased to see the poll results that came up here just hope the same results come up in the legislature if this gets a hearing. There are already way more restrictions on dredging than are needed let me site examples.
1:  IN water work times.. Yes dredgers are restricted as to when we can even work in the water and the times are not favorable to dredging. Lets take Slate Creek on the back side of Harts Pass which I am sure quite a few of you are familiar with. Dredging can only be done there from October 1 through February 28th. Anyone even tried to get down to the creek in Late Oct Nov, Dec Jan or Feb?  Even if you can get to the creek the damned thing is frozen over, under 6 feet of snow or the temps are so cold there is no way a person could be in the water to operate a dredge. OR we can take Peshastin Creek on Blewett Pass work times there are  a little more lenient because we can work there from 1 Aug to 28 Feb but Peshastin creek the water drops so low you can't float a dredge and again NOV through Feb. it is under so much snow and the temps are so unbearably cold even if you hit the mother load you couldn't work in the water.
If a dredger is dredging and see fish in the area where he/she is working we have to cease operations and move. I can tell you from experience that fish will find a dredger and stay around because we are moving the substrate and exposing various insects that the fish feed on dart in grab the insect and swim off then come back for seconds and more.
What upsets me is we, Anyone even panning for gold can't be in the water except during the work times because of possibly endangering a reds bed, yet fishermen, rafters, kyakers, tubers, swimmer and any john Q Public can be in the water anytime with supposedly no threat to the reds.
The WDFW uses Studies to say that dredging is supposedly detrimental to fish yet there are more studies that prove Dredging is actually beneficial to fish but they don't acknowledge those studies just the ones that support their way of thinking.
As a dredger May I request that you contact your state legislator and ask this not even be brought to committee or if it is ask them to vote no on it as there are already enough restrictions on protecting the fish.
Thanks for reading this and if you need more info please feel free to contact me and I can provide reams of info.

[Special T]

Of course its BS Jingles. In BC they use riverbeds as ROADS during large portions of the year!

[blackdog]

It doesn't look like this is scheduled in the House committee.

[bigtex]

In BC they use riverbeds as ROADS during large portions of the year!

BC also heavily pollutes the Columbia River so much that there is a health/pollution warning for fish on the upper part of Lake Roosevelt   

[Special T]

I know some guys that run Unimogs on rivers for hunting camp and a guy that uses his baha rig on them as i remeber there arre like 3-4 months out of the year that they can't use them.

True BigTex but that polution is from a smelter.
http://news.ca.msn.com/local/britishcolumbia/bc-mining-giant-admits-polluting-us-waters-1

There is a HUGE difference between large scale mining and using a small dredge or hand methods. There are lots of scary stories about mines going bankrups and the delapitated sites going unmanaged. MOST of those are much older sites and large commercial ventures, not joe 6 pack playing in the creek with his kids and dog.

[Elkaholic daWg]

I know some guys that run Unimogs on rivers for hunting camp and a guy that uses his baha rig on them as i remeber there arre like 3-4 months out of the year that they can't use them.

True BigTex but that polution is from a smelter.
http://news.ca.msn.com/local/britishcolumbia/bc-mining-giant-admits-polluting-us-waters-1

There is a HUGE difference between large scale mining and using a small dredge or hand methods. There are lots of scary stories about mines going bankrups and the delapitated sites going unmanaged. MOST of those are much older sites and large commercial ventures, not joe 6 pack playing in the creek with his kids and dog.

  But government loves to pick on the little guy "T".

[Special T]

I think Gov just lacks common sense, and/or likes ot pick winner/losers based on something other that logic. 

[Special T]

http://www.klamathbasincrisis.org/miners/greene/140203_hres_0130PM-Meeting-Joint.mp4

I saw this video a couple of days ago and felt the need to share this. I DO NOT use a dredge but have taken a pan and small sluce out a couple of times. I hope people like Jingle save this for next year when we have ot fight these idiots again.

[bearpaw]

In BC they use riverbeds as ROADS during large portions of the year!

BC also heavily pollutes the Columbia River so much that there is a health/pollution warning for fish on the upper part of Lake Roosevelt   

That is primarily due to Cominco Corp (mining and fertilizer) in Trail, BC which puts tons of contaminants in the river just north of the border. Also some Canadian cities have overflow sewage problems at times and it all flows down stream. As stated by others, it's not the recreational prospector with his kids and dog causing the problem. 

[blackdog]

This bill is dead!

[KFhunter]

In BC they use riverbeds as ROADS during large portions of the year!

BC also heavily pollutes the Columbia River so much that there is a health/pollution warning for fish on the upper part of Lake Roosevelt   

That is primarily due to Cominco Corp (mining and fertilizer) in Trail, BC which puts tons of contaminants in the river just north of the border. Also some Canadian cities have overflow sewage problems at times and it all flows down stream. As stated by others, it's not the recreational prospector with his kids and dog causing the problem. 

no kidding!  add the pulp mill to that list too,  and add the lumber mill still floating logs in the river.

try fishing in the spring on the upper Columbia and the pulp floating down (looks like wet toilet paper) is so thick it'll gum up your hooks/line and sinker weights on each cast.
It's so thick it's almost impossible to fish, gets on your line and creates so much drag on the line it goes down stream not that any fish would bite your bait anyways it's so loaded with white gunk.

Can't imagine what 24/7 exposure to that crap does to the fish gill plates.  I bet their constantly trying to keep them clean 

[bonaro]

I thought I would weigh in on this thread since I have a direct perspective from the mining side.
I Have been gold mining for over 30 years and have dredged from Wyoming to Cali to Alaska and all points in between. I have seen the march of the liberal environmentalist zealot and it is very sad and impressive to witness what they can accomplish.

This all began in California which is by no coincidence the most liberal state in the west. The environmentalists partnered with the tribes and began putting emotional and political pressure on the state in the name of fish protection. Public opinion swayed in their favor because they efficiently played the plight of the tribes along with guilt over not saving the planet... This was supported by a blizzard of supporting documents from scientific report factories. Any pro-mining report that was presented was loudly shouted down and discredited. Dredging was completely shut down in the state that was founded by mining and remains so today.

They took this victory and playbook to Idaho and Oregon and now dredging is severely curtailed in those areas as well. It is now beginning in Washington and if you take a look at the names involved you will see it is being pushed by the same people. They have gained allies in the fishermen by convincing them the dredgers kill fish. They have gained allies in the rafters by saying dredges present hazards to them. They have yet to figure our a way to hook the hunters but they are working on it.

After the win in Cali they took the flawed science and called it peer reviewed and settled fact. Things like the sediment from a dredge is harmful but the hundreds of miles of raging chocolate milk which is most rivers during runoff, is good. Ideas like dredging contaminates the stream with mercury that is already in the stream...such things don't any sense to someone who considers them without a emotional sway. This is because they are manufactured to instill an emotional response and simply untrue. I can address these or other issues in far greater detail if anyone is interested.

I belong to the Resources Coalition which is a non-profit that fights to preserve the right to use our land...public land...for all user groups
http://resourcescoalition.org/   If every one of you do not belong to this or some similar org, you are risking the loss of our public land. It will be taken away one small bite at a time until all we can do is hike through it and take pictures.  If you think this only a problem for the miners that is also a mistake, the other user groups are next.

I am a gold miner, hunter, fisherman and pretty much love anything in the outdoors. I also run a Gold Prospecting Outfitter business, like a hunting or fishing guide for gold miners. I provide a lot of instruction on proper and legal mining methods and everything I do is with the protection of the environment in mind. I love the outdoors, why would I want to harm it?  There is no reason why dredging cannot co-exist with all the other user groups.

[bearpaw]

  I have been saying the same thing to sportsmen for years.

Americans are systematically advocating, legislating, and voting away each others rights. Support all user groups and quit losing opportunity.

[Elkaholic daWg]

I have been saying the same thing to sportsmen for years.

Americans are systematically advocating, legislating, and voting away each others rights. Support all user groups and quit losing opportunity.

Read that CAREFULLY fellow hunters!!!  Some do need to wake up!