Is nation-wide reciprocity for CPL a good idea?

[netcoyote]

http://townhall.com/tipsheet/katiepavlich/2014/01/21/bill-introduced-to-allow-conealed-carry-permits-to-transfer-state-lines-like-drivers-licenses-n1782417

Bill Introduced To Allow Concealed Carry Permits to Transfer Across State Lines Like Drivers Licenses
Katie Pavlich | Jan 21, 2014

 Texas Senator John Cornyn has introduced new legislation that if passed would allow concealed carry holders to travel from state to state without fear of breaking the law. The idea is similar to national reciprocity and concealed carry permits would be recognized as legal just like a drivers license.

San Antonio 1200 WOAI News Radio's Michael Board discussed the legislation with Cornyn yesterday.

    "It would allow people with a concealed handgun license in Texas to travel to other states and maintain their legal status," Cornyn told 1200 WOAI's Michael Board.

Late last year Illinois finally became the 50th state with concealed carry permissions and more people than ever are applying for permits all over the country. Last week at the SHOT Show is Las Vegas it was clear manufacturers are meeting the high demand of concealed carry firearms with new lines of compact, easily concealable pocket pistols.

This story caught my attention since I recently spent a lot of time and money to get non-resident CPL for Idaho, Utah and Oregon to prepare for a road trip I have planned. It's a real hassle. It sure would be a lot easier to have permits treated like a driver's license which are recognized in every state. Of course, in order to do this, the Federal government has to be involved. To me, that is the real risk with passing a nation-wide reciprocity bill like the one being proposed.

You can't have it both ways. If Federalism (states having a certain amount of autonomy) is a good thing, then putting the concealed pistol license in the hands of the Federal government seems like a real risky idea. I think it's generally a bad idea to relinquish the right of individual states to govern their own destiny as much as possible.  Right now, the concealed permit process is a real hodgepodge of concepts from none required at all (Vermont) to easily obtained shall-issue states like WA to some states that reserve total discretion (may-issue) and are hard to obtain. Legally carrying while traveling through a lot of states can be a real test of understanding different laws as well as meeting all the training and/or skills requirements of each state.

What do you guys think? Reciprocity for all states or leave the current state-by-state laws as they exist?

[CAMPMEAT]

You can take a course called: www.MYLEGALHEAT.com and are licensed for 36 states. Most of the states where it's not legal is in the northeast corner of the U.S.

[Special T]

I have mixed feelings on this. The rules are complex enough in Wa that you really should at least acknowledge the differences of how you would be treated in the different counties here. Depending on how far you travel you have those same kinds of issues, plus the idiosyncrasies  of what each state allows.  I have a friend in E OR and from what i've heard the Enforcement is much more lax and forgiving considering thier laws. IF  you are in the central portion Portland south they aren't so forgiving.

[Bean Counter]

Oppose!

How well is federal involvement in wolf regulation working out for ya??

[ghosthunter]

  

I think your cpl should give you the right to carry cc anywhere the American Flag flies. I think you should be able to open carry any where the American Flag Flies unrestricted until you prove yourself unworthy of the right to carry.

But I prefer the management of my cpl to stay with my home state.

[FC]

The rules are complex enough in Wa that you really should at least acknowledge the differences of how you would be treated in the different counties here.

Wa state carry law is Wa state carry law, state preemption prevents any city, county, etc from making or enforcing more restrictive laws than state. It has been tried more than once and failed every time. You may get treated differently for it in different counties but not not for any reason involving law.

[ghosthunter]

The rules are complex enough in Wa that you really should at least acknowledge the differences of how you would be treated in the different counties here.

Wa state carry law is Wa state carry law, state preemption prevents any city, county, etc from making or enforcing more restrictive laws than state. It has been tried more than once and failed every time. You may get treated differently for it in different counties but not not for any reason involving law.

 

I would say you are more apt to be treated different depending on what city you are in. County lawman are well trained. Forest Service LE not so much.

[pianoman9701]

In reality, we should be able to carry anywhere in the country with nothing more than our Constitutional rights required.

Having reciprocity may be a stepping stone to a national database of concealed carry permit holders - as good as a gun list. As it stands now, WA state law gives the county sheriffs the right to oppose federal requests for their CPL lists. In the name of verification, were reciprocity allowed nationwide, I believe the feds would be asking to compile a list of anyone with a CPL, CCW, whatever.

Until our rights are maintained in this legislation by prohibiting the feds specifically from compiling a list, I would oppose this bill.

[ghosthunter]

In reality, we should be able to carry anywhere in the country with nothing more than our Constitutional rights required.

Having reciprocity may be a stepping stone to a national database of concealed carry permit holders - as good as a gun list. As it stands now, WA state law gives the county sheriffs the right to oppose federal requests for their CPL lists. In the name of verification, were reciprocity allowed nationwide, I believe the feds would be asking to compile a list of anyone with a CPL, CCW, whatever.

Until our rights are maintained in this legislation by prohibiting the feds specifically from compiling a list, I would oppose this bill.

 

[Jonathan_S]

In reality, we should be able to carry anywhere in the country with nothing more than our Constitutional rights required.

Having reciprocity may be a stepping stone to a national database of concealed carry permit holders - as good as a gun list. As it stands now, WA state law gives the county sheriffs the right to oppose federal requests for their CPL lists. In the name of verification, were reciprocity allowed nationwide, I believe the feds would be asking to compile a list of anyone with a CPL, CCW, whatever.

Until our rights are maintained in this legislation by prohibiting the feds specifically from compiling a list, I would oppose this bill.

 

x3  this is spot-on in my opinion.  I cringe at the idea of new federalized rules but I would encourage nationwide carry rules based on the Constitution.

[Elkaholic daWg]

In reality, we should be able to carry anywhere in the country with nothing more than our Constitutional rights required.

Having reciprocity may be a stepping stone to a national database of concealed carry permit holders - as good as a gun list. As it stands now, WA state law gives the county sheriffs the right to oppose federal requests for their CPL lists. In the name of verification, were reciprocity allowed nationwide, I believe the feds would be asking to compile a list of anyone with a CPL, CCW, whatever.

Until our rights are maintained in this legislation by prohibiting the feds specifically from compiling a list, I would oppose this bill.

 

Make that X4

[bigtex]

The rules are complex enough in Wa that you really should at least acknowledge the differences of how you would be treated in the different counties here.

Wa state carry law is Wa state carry law, state preemption prevents any city, county, etc from making or enforcing more restrictive laws than state. It has been tried more than once and failed every time. You may get treated differently for it in different counties but not not for any reason involving law.

I would say you are more apt to be treated different depending on what city you are in. County lawman are well trained. Forest Service LE not so much.

Read the stats, federal land management agency LE (they all attend the same training) attend more training hours then WA officers.

[CAMPMEAT]

Our Forest Service LEO went to school in Kalifornia to become a biologist. There were no biologist jobs, so he started looking for a FEDERAL job, found this one in Republic with zero training in law enforcement at all, got hired on. Then his head got so big, it exploded with his power trips. Sure, he got raining AFTER the fact, but he needs more training for people skills. He's a horrible representation of any LEO I know. I know this guy personally too.

He'd even write bigtex a ticket for doing something completely legal..............

[bigtex]

Our Forest Service LEO went to school in Kalifornia to become a biologist. There were no biologist jobs, so he started looking for a FEDERAL job, found this one in Republic with zero training in law enforcement at all, got hired on. Then his head got so big, it exploded with his power trips. Sure, he got raining AFTER the fact, but he needs more training for people skills. He's a horrible representation of any LEO I know. I know this guy personally too.

Doesn't matter where he is from. It is nearly impossible for a federal officer (no matter what agency) to get hired on locally as their first job. It takes some feds their entire career to get back "home." And actually he had to attend the federal land management LE academy before he started working LE and that is a fact.

You actually may be surprised how many WDFW Officers are not WA natives and come from other states as well...

[CAMPMEAT]

bigtex,

The story was told to me from him. I don't care where someone is from. By the way, he leaving for places unknown. He took this job sight unseen and didn't have a clue what this area was like.