The Green Scam of “Endangered Species”

[AspenBud]

I don't buy the "tax rolls" argument that people use when the gov buys ground for US to hunt.  Farmers/ranchers pay damm near nothing for undeveloped ground, timber companies probably pay less....

Wow,  You are really misinformed.  Land sales are open to anybody.  The rancher pays the same for undeveloped land as you.  It's on the market to sell and if you want it, just write a check like anybody else.  The rancher has no inside track when buying land.

I'm pretty sure he was talking about the amount of property tax they pay, not how much they pay for land that they purchasse.

Exactly.  The article specifically mentions property taxes.

Open public land is good for the PUBLIC... and for hunters and others that enjoy using the land.

What will happen to the land once there is nothing left to hunt?

Ah yes, here we go again. How do you feel about changing grazing practices or disallowing it in some areas for sage grouse Wolfbait?

[JLS]

I don't buy the "tax rolls" argument that people use when the gov buys ground for US to hunt.  Farmers/ranchers pay damm near nothing for undeveloped ground, timber companies probably pay less....

Wow,  You are really misinformed.  Land sales are open to anybody.  The rancher pays the same for undeveloped land as you.  It's on the market to sell and if you want it, just write a check like anybody else.  The rancher has no inside track when buying land.

I'm pretty sure he was talking about the amount of property tax they pay, not how much they pay for land that they purchasse.

Exactly.  The article specifically mentions property taxes.

Open public land is good for the PUBLIC... and for hunters and others that enjoy using the land.

What will happen to the land once there is nothing left to hunt?

How long are we going to keep hanging on to and perpetuating this myth that there will be "nothing left"?  If you want to support hunting of wolves I'm right there with you.  To do so under the auspices that there will be nothing left if you don't is asinine.

[AspenBud]

I don't buy the "tax rolls" argument that people use when the gov buys ground for US to hunt.  Farmers/ranchers pay damm near nothing for undeveloped ground, timber companies probably pay less....

Wow,  You are really misinformed.  Land sales are open to anybody.  The rancher pays the same for undeveloped land as you.  It's on the market to sell and if you want it, just write a check like anybody else.  The rancher has no inside track when buying land.

I'm pretty sure he was talking about the amount of property tax they pay, not how much they pay for land that they purchasse.

Exactly.  The article specifically mentions property taxes.

Open public land is good for the PUBLIC... and for hunters and others that enjoy using the land.

What will happen to the land once there is nothing left to hunt?

How long are we going to keep hanging on to and perpetuating this myth that there will be "nothing left"?  If you want to support hunting of wolves I'm right there with you.  To do so under the auspices that there will be nothing left if you don't is asinine.

 

[wolfbait]

Bobcat do you think WA has more ungulates then say Montana or Idaho did/does? Do you believe that WA is less populated with people then these two states? Both MT and Idaho hunt cougars and bears with hounds, With 18 BPs needed before delisting can begin, and not allowing cougars or bears to be hunted with hounds how long will WA ungulates survive? Do you think WDFW and the environmentalists are buying up all the land they can for fish and bird habitat?

I don't know the answers to all these questions. If you want answers, ask the WDFW. I did a quick google search and found a good summary that shows why the property was purchased. I hope this helps to answer some of your questions:

http://wdfw.wa.gov/lands/acquisitions/2014_proposals/mountain_view_2014.pdf

You want me to ask WDFW, the same outfit that refuses to confirm livestock killed by wolves unless they are forced to do so, refuse to confirm wolf packs unless they have no other choice, refuse to acknowledge the impact wolves are/and will have on WA ungulates. Do you think they would be honest enough to tell me what they have planned for all the land they have and are buying when there is nothing left to hunt?

http://wdfw.wa.gov/lands/acquisitions/

[AspenBud]

Bobcat do you think WA has more ungulates then say Montana or Idaho did/does? Do you believe that WA is less populated with people then these two states? Both MT and Idaho hunt cougars and bears with hounds, With 18 BPs needed before delisting can begin, and not allowing cougars or bears to be hunted with hounds how long will WA ungulates survive? Do you think WDFW and the environmentalists are buying up all the land they can for fish and bird habitat?

I don't know the answers to all these questions. If you want answers, ask the WDFW. I did a quick google search and found a good summary that shows why the property was purchased. I hope this helps to answer some of your questions:

http://wdfw.wa.gov/lands/acquisitions/2014_proposals/mountain_view_2014.pdf

You want me to ask WDFW, the same outfit that refuses to confirm livestock killed by wolves unless they are forced to do so, refuse to confirm wolf packs unless they have no other choice, refuse to acknowledge the impact wolves are/and will have on WA ungulates. Do you think they would be honest enough to tell me what they have planned for all the land they have and are buying when there is nothing left to hunt?

http://wdfw.wa.gov/lands/acquisitions/

I'll say this for you, you're good at staying on message.

[bobcat]

Wildlife habitat is wildlife habitat. I don't care if the intent was to buy it for wolves or if it was bought for an endangered frog. If there are deer, elk, and game birds available to hunt and it's open to the public, then it benefits me and I'm certainly not going to argue against it.


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[JLS]

Bobcat do you think WA has more ungulates then say Montana or Idaho did/does? Do you believe that WA is less populated with people then these two states? Both MT and Idaho hunt cougars and bears with hounds, With 18 BPs needed before delisting can begin, and not allowing cougars or bears to be hunted with hounds how long will WA ungulates survive? Do you think WDFW and the environmentalists are buying up all the land they can for fish and bird habitat?

I don't know the answers to all these questions. If you want answers, ask the WDFW. I did a quick google search and found a good summary that shows why the property was purchased. I hope this helps to answer some of your questions:

http://wdfw.wa.gov/lands/acquisitions/2014_proposals/mountain_view_2014.pdf

You want me to ask WDFW, the same outfit that refuses to confirm livestock killed by wolves unless they are forced to do so, refuse to confirm wolf packs unless they have no other choice, refuse to acknowledge the impact wolves are/and will have on WA ungulates. Do you think they would be honest enough to tell me what they have planned for all the land they have and are buying when there is nothing left to hunt?

http://wdfw.wa.gov/lands/acquisitions/

Well, the 4-O does have some really good chukar hunting 

[bobcat]

Well, the 4-O does have some really good chukar hunting 

Yes but will there be any left or will the wolves eat them all?

[JLS]

Well, the 4-O does have some really good chukar hunting 

Yes but will there be any left or will the wolves eat them all?

Dazzam, I didn't think of that 

[wolfbait]

Interesting read!

http://wdfw.wa.gov/publications/00727/cwcs_executive_summary.pdf

[timberfaller]

After being involved with one "land acquisition" by the WDFW,  all I can say is, They need to sell off ALL they've purchased, They can't take care of what they have and they always claim they are broke!!

Here is the "crutch" or code word as to WHY they are constantly BUYING land!!

"legislative mandate"

The one "purchase" I was involved with cost the WA taxpayers millions and millions of $$$$$$$$ :bash:needlessly!!! and didn't benefit "wildlife" one bit, if anything it did "Harm"

[bobcat]

Timberfaller, really...what is there to "take care of?" Just the fact that the land is no longer able to be turned into housing subdivisions is enough for me. And it's open for public use. I'm sure the wildlife will take care of itself.


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[timberfaller]

Yep REALLY,  they didn't take the "winter habitat" with the sale(was in original acres) THAT was turned into "housing development". 

Only a small percentage(less then 25%) of purchase is "open" to hunters now.   But then when I was the Foreman NO one was allowed to hunt on it.

You'll know it as the "Big Valley Ranch" if you travel Hwy 20 to Winthrop.   It had turned into a big weed farm after I left.

Gee I wonder WHO paid for the nice pivots that are on it now??  After the taxpayers shoveled out millions to save the irrigation ditch during the Hwy re-construction!!

[idahohuntr]

After being involved with one "land acquisition" by the WDFW,  all I can say is, They need to sell off ALL they've purchased, They can't take care of what they have and they always claim they are broke!!

I can't fathom how or why a hunter would support selling off public land    Coming up with ways to manage more efficiently and at lower cost...sure...but to want to get rid of public land...WOW!

[snowpack]

After being involved with one "land acquisition" by the WDFW,  all I can say is, They need to sell off ALL they've purchased, They can't take care of what they have and they always claim they are broke!!

I can't fathom how or why a hunter would support selling off public land    Coming up with ways to manage more efficiently and at lower cost...sure...but to want to get rid of public land...WOW!

You make the assumption that all the land they buy would allow hunting.  They have been buying land in developed areas that probably won't allow any hunting, might eventually allow some fishing.  The rules from other agencies about doing much near fish bearing rivers are strict enough that the fish are pretty safe if a private buyer purchased it.  So, what you have is a park for the neighborhood and birdwatchers.  Now any future development will be outside the developed boundaries--sprawl.  For the hunting side, I'd prefer they purchased somewhere outside of towns to allow for all types of hunting.