Shoot or No Shot - Episode 6

[WapitiTalk1]

Nothing like getting back home from a hiking trip in this heat to have phantom throw a shoot or no shoot scenario out there

I'm tired.....I'm really hot..... Ummmmm il hold my draw till he is 100% looking at me....then maybe put it where phantom said... If not il see what else he gives me   

Ha!  Sorry kentrek, hope your hike went well. Why are you going to wait until he's looking at you to skewer him? 

[WapitiTalk1]

Phantom, I tried not to be judgmental in that question; apparently, I didn't succeed.  I've been compelled to take shots that I thought better of after the moment.  Fading light, end of the season, adrenaline, I can't believe he's getting away from me this time, basically, the "if I don't shoot now, I won't get a better or another chance" situations. 

None of those ended in wounded elk, luckily, but I have shot arrows into elk that I have not recovered.  I hated those situations and they made me sick all over, but they were good shooting situations at close range and darn frustrating to figure out why I couldn't find the dying elk and/or why I didn't have a double-lung shot. 

Those have all helped lead me to "aggressive hunting, conservative shooting."

You weren't judgmental, I thought it was a very good point sir.  "Had to shoot" is really a term for video games with no follow on repercussions, or, like I mentioned perhaps back in the day when it was life or death for you and your family if you didn't bring some game home.  I enjoy your posts, keep em coming.  RJ   

[kentrek]

Well the elk isn't about to spook because of my presence yet...if he was looking dead at me with those ears, nose &eyes (triple threat/maximum attention) I would think it easy to conclude the jigs up an he will bolt at any given second ...since west side hunting its prolly doubt full if you stop him he will be in another shooting lane (at least where I hunt)...now you mentioned the slip system ?? Elk butt or camo ?? Elk butt is going to get spotted right away an after he stares at it long enough he will figure out its a fake an get sketchy...best thing to do (assuming no 2nd chance of shot) is to shoot him while he trying to figure out what the heck is wrong with that brush/elk butt...the longer you wait on the shot the more likely hes gone burst (this is once hes seen ya)....at that distance im sure he could jump the string abit but hopefully he isnt that spooked yet

Hope that makes sense lol basically once he spotted ya it really cuts down the odds of another shot oppertunity so il take what i can get

[elkmtngear]

Since I shoot fingers/bare bow...29 yds is a little too far for me to take that shot.  20 yds would be probably my max for the frontal...but it is a deadly shot when executed correctly. 

Of course, it's situational.  If the bull was on edge or appeared high strung...no way.  If he was relaxed and I was at full draw under 20 yds...I'd take him.

[kckrawler]

As a fairly inexperienced archery elk hunter, I'd like to know why some of you wouldn't take the shot. Anatomy of the elk? Worried about hitting the front leg bone and deflecting? Trying to punch through the brisket?

I'd take the shot at 29 yards...but maybe I shouldn't 

[pianoman9701]

Some never take a frontal shot in archery because of the relatively small area you have for a vital hit. The sternum and legs crowd the shot. In the opinion of some, a flat broadside or slightly quartering away shot are the most ethical. This is an ongoing discussion on this forum.

[WapitiTalk1]

pianoman9701 summed it up pretty well.  The frontal or quartering towards you shot can be and is deadly, but, the sight window is much smaller than a quartering away or broadside shot.  I've posted this before but here is an Outdoor Life article by Aron Snyder that is well worth reading.  Make sure you advance the page to the actual "shot placement" photos.  kckrawler, I think you just hit the shoulder bone    Think "shirt pocket".   

http://www.outdoorlife.com/blogs/live-hunt/2011/07/bowhunting-tips-when-take-frontal-shot

[h20hunter]

Kc....

In regards to your spot.....and please feel free to correct me as this is a learning thread, not a bashing....

I'd push the shot to the right a bit. I would be trying for the heart or just above the heart to hit the section of connecting vessels. A bit back there was a post about a kid that front hit an elk and it bled out like a faucet and fell right on its face. I think your shot choice could result in hitting bone and glancing left and taking out some meat and only wounding the animal.

[D-Rock425]

D-Rock, BLRman, and Phantom, you all discuss the "have to shoot" scenario. What conditions make you have to shoot?

I guess have to shoot was the wrong choice of words.  If I had to pick a spot I think that would be your best option. The only thing that would make this a have to shoot is if that elk already had an arrow in it and this was a follow up shot.

[Rainier10]

D-Rock, BLRman, and Phantom, you all discuss the "have to shoot" scenario. What conditions make you have to shoot?

I guess have to shoot was the wrong choice of words.  If I had to pick a spot I think that would be your best option. The only thing that would make this a have to shoot is if that elk already had an arrow in it and this was a follow up shot.

No shot for me unless like D-Rock says it is already hit and standing in front of me then I get another one in it any way possible.

By your description of the situation my guess is soon he turns back to his left and walks away giving you a better shot. Maybe he turns right to check out whatever has his curiosity but either way there is a better shot to be had.

If you take this shot and wound him you will be sick to your stomach for not waiting on a better shot.

[kckrawler]

I think your shot choice could result in hitting bone and glancing left and taking out some meat and only wounding the animal.

Yeah, I agree that this shot could end up hitting a leg bone and deflecting causing an ugly gut shot. May be too sketchy of a shot to take it...wait for him to turn a bit.

[Shawn Ryan]

D-Rock, BLRman, and Phantom, you all discuss the "have to shoot" scenario. What conditions make you have to shoot?

I guess have to shoot was the wrong choice of words.  If I had to pick a spot I think that would be your best option. The only thing that would make this a have to shoot is if that elk already had an arrow in it and this was a follow up shot.

   Perfect answer.  Thank you for replying.  That situation could definitely call for the frontal shot and is a good reason to know at which spot to aim.

This exchange of knowledge is great for making me think. And great for reiterating, in a practical and a virtual experience way, what to do and not to do.  Phantom, karma is real; you should be expecting to notch your tag in September and tie it to a nice 350 bull.

[elkmtngear]

Here's another link to my own blog site...some pretty good diagrams and a reference video inlcuded:

http://elkmtngear.com/blog/the-frontal-shot-bad-mistake-or-great-opportunity.html