Washington’s wolf experience unlike rest of the West

[bobcat]

Wolves weren't "brought on." They're a native species and the population just happens to be increasing right now. There was no plan for how to manage wolves because there were none, or so few that it didn't matter. It's going to take time for all of this to balance out, but it will, eventually. Give it some time, miracles won't happen overnight.

[Curly]

I'm not as optimistic as you. I don't see how things can balance out without a way to reduce the population of wolves. Short of the wolves contracting parvo or something like that, they will grow in numbers and we will get restricted on hunting deer and elk to try to leave game for wolves.

The state wolf plan should have included methods of reducing wolf numbers when the time comes. It should have included hunting them as a game animal and trapping them, but then that would have gone against the beliefs of HSUS and dow.

[mfswallace]

Wolves weren't "brought on." They're a native species and the population just happens to be increasing right now. There was no plan for how to manage wolves because there were none, or so few that it didn't matter. It's going to take time for all of this to balance out, but it will, eventually. Give it some time, miracles won't happen overnight.

Oh no, you slipped up

[pianoman9701]

Wolves weren't "brought on." They're a native species and the population just happens to be increasing right now. There was no plan for how to manage wolves because there were none, or so few that it didn't matter. It's going to take time for all of this to balance out, but it will, eventually. Give it some time, miracles won't happen overnight.

You're arguing semantics, which is ludicrous. They were exterminated from WA and 60 years later, other wolves were transplanted into neighboring states and allowed to populate WA. These are no more native to WA than I. Just because there were people in WA before doesn't mean that when I moved here in '89 I was a native. Like the wolves, I'm a transplant.

[bobcat]

Actually there were some wolves in this state in the late 80's and early 90's that did not come from the Idaho transplants.

[Bob33]

Like the wolves, I'm a transplant.

Should we blame WDFW for you too?

[AspenBud]

If cougar were managed better wolf predation wouldn't be so additive to current cougar predation. 1 cougar and 1 wolf eat about the same amount. Currently WA has roughly 4,000 cougar, that is double the cougar numbers that we had a few decades ago. Studies have shown that 1 cougar eats 25 to 50 deer per year, so 4,000 cougar are eating 100,000+ deer, elk, moose,

What happens to cougars when wolves move into an area they have normally been in? There's a lot of talk about skinny and dying cats in those areas.

[pianoman9701]

Actually there were some wolves in this state in the late 80's and early 90's that did not come from the Idaho transplants.

Yes, those were native wolves. I wonder how they're doing???

[pianoman9701]

Like the wolves, I'm a transplant.

Should we blame WDFW for you too?

I bet the WDFW would like to cast some blame somewhere for it! 

[bobcat]

Here's where the "balance" will come in: 

When wolves outnumber deer and elk, we will switch over to wolf hunting every year and deer/elk hunting will possibly be a once in a lifetime tag.

And the wolves will be forced to eat domestic livestock more often than wild game.

No worries, there will always be something to hunt in this state. 

[mfswallace]

Here's where the "balance" will come in: 

When wolves outnumber deer and elk, we will switch over to wolf hunting every year and deer/elk hunting will possibly be a once in a lifetime tag.

And the wolves will be forced to eat domestic livestock more often than wild game.

No worries, there will always be something to hunt in this state. 

[pianoman9701]

We mostly agree, Bobcat, except that I don't think there will be a wolf season. That's why I was a little surprised with your semantic deviation from the real topic. 

[JimmyHoffa]

Does anyone really expect that legal wolf hunting will ever be allowed in this state? No way will it happen. The voter initiative process will be used to prevent wolf hunting just like it ended hounds and bear baiting  (if wdfw would even allow hunting of wolves).

Gotta figure out how much the tribes will want to keep the wolves under control.  Some of the members that use hounds for cougs get goodies like meals, auto work, rifles and ammo for keeping cat numbers down and deer up in a couple areas.  Imagine that if an initiative prevents state hunters, the tribes could work out deals with hunters/ranchers to do the management.  Sucky way to have to go about it, but do what you can to keep your way of life.

[pianoman9701]

Does anyone really expect that legal wolf hunting will ever be allowed in this state? No way will it happen. The voter initiative process will be used to prevent wolf hunting just like it ended hounds and bear baiting  (if wdfw would even allow hunting of wolves).

Gotta figure out how much the tribes will want to keep the wolves under control.  Some of the members that use hounds for cougs get goodies like meals, auto work, rifles and ammo for keeping cat numbers down and deer up in a couple areas.  Imagine that if an initiative prevents state hunters, the tribes could work out deals with hunters/ranchers to do the management.  Sucky way to have to go about it, but do what you can to keep your way of life.

The tribes will kill them on their tribal lands; already are I believe. That doesn't help the rest of the state very much. The wolves will learn to make themselves scarce there and go where they aren't hunted.

[Bob33]

We mostly agree, Bobcat, except that I don't think there will be a wolf season. That's why I was a little surprised with your semantic deviation from the real topic. 

I think there probably will be legalized hunting at some point, but it will be strictly limited and controlled. After all, there's money in them thar critters: "Quality wolf", "antlerless wolf", "wolf with disabilities", "master hunter wolf", ....