Looks like there is officially a new pack in the Methow

[Sitka_Blacktail]

One technique that might help identify individual wolves and packs is something that was recently used on the Kenai Peninsula in Alaska for brown and black bears. They put out fur traps which bears were attracted to with bait and collected hair samples which were genetically tested to identify individual bears. As a result, the estimated bear population of the Kenai Peninsula more than doubled.  Good information is gold.

http://www.fws.gov/refuge/Kenai/what_we_do/science/brown_bear_estimate.html

[Sitka_Blacktail]

Here's a more in depth look at the study conducted on the Kenai.

http://www.adfg.alaska.gov/static/regulations/regprocess/gameboard/pdfs/2012-2013/Southcentral_3-15-13/rcs/rc005_fws_usfs_kenai_brown_bear_population_estimate_2012.pdf

[KenPCPilot]

Are you kidding me.   I saw a ton of wolf *censored* 2 years ago.  Time to trap and relocate to the westside I am thinking Redmond.  Plenty of designer dogs and cats to feed on.  It will be a real boon to the pet industry.  Just think purchasing 2 to 4 new pets per year per property owner on Mercer Island alone might be the economic stimulus Washingtonians are looking for.  Plus getting to see the majestic wolf in action ripping a Persian cat Mr. Suggles head off brings those who truly appreciate nature a front row seat to predator prey life cycle.  oops must not type after drinking caramel rich and rare.  Enjoy.  I honestly feel very sorry for the Methow valley folks.  Nice people who have enjoyed the beauty of this corner of Washington.  Only to see it fffed up by people with a personal agenda.  I have some of my most cherished memories beginning up the Twisp River road.   

[Special T]

One technique that might help identify individual wolves and packs is something that was recently used on the Kenai Peninsula in Alaska for brown and black bears. They put out fur traps which bears were attracted to with bait and collected hair samples which were genetically tested to identify individual bears. As a result, the estimated bear population of the Kenai Peninsula more than doubled.  Good information is gold.

http://www.fws.gov/refuge/Kenai/what_we_do/science/brown_bear_estimate.html

So if they had a good program like that some of us here would be a lot less skeptical

[Sitka_Blacktail]

One technique that might help identify individual wolves and packs is something that was recently used on the Kenai Peninsula in Alaska for brown and black bears. They put out fur traps which bears were attracted to with bait and collected hair samples which were genetically tested to identify individual bears. As a result, the estimated bear population of the Kenai Peninsula more than doubled.  Good information is gold.

http://www.fws.gov/refuge/Kenai/what_we_do/science/brown_bear_estimate.html

So if they had a good program like that some of us here would be a lot less skeptical

The real question is would they spend the money to do a survey like this?

[mfswallace]

One technique that might help identify individual wolves and packs is something that was recently used on the Kenai Peninsula in Alaska for brown and black bears. They put out fur traps which bears were attracted to with bait and collected hair samples which were genetically tested to identify individual bears. As a result, the estimated bear population of the Kenai Peninsula more than doubled.  Good information is gold.

http://www.fws.gov/refuge/Kenai/what_we_do/science/brown_bear_estimate.html

So if they had a good program like that some of us here would be a lot less skeptical

The real question is would they spend the money to do a survey like this?

They wasted $850,000 on a love guru so NO they wouldn't want science to get in the way of the feel good emotional movement 

[idahohuntr]

In the early 90's there were signs posted at trailheads in the north Cascades asking people to report any wolf sightings. So, the presence of wolves surely was not unknown.

The lookout pack was KNOWN in the late 80s.  It was studied and hunting season was even halted in the Alta for three years because of it.   Distrust began there.  It becomes extremely hard to take them serious with all of the politics and games.   If they had been honest from day one, then this might not be such a laughable manner.  How many of you non local people knew of the Libby Creek pack?  That's what we all called it including government officials.  Then decades later "it was discovered".   They had been studying it for some time.  Its gets very tiring explaining this to every neophyte that picks up a paper and reads about the methow valley.  So yes, a little local knowledge goes a long ways, or in this case a lot of local knowledge.   As I have stated before, Ill never forget when the biologist called my Dad when I was there visiting.  We were watching several wolves out the front window of his house.   The biologist had never seen them and he had been studying them for two years.  Kind of hard to have a firm grasp on what you are studying if you never have even seen the animal. LOL    As for wolf sightings, well there have been wolves in the Methow for decades if not centuries.  Many just passing through.  There is a big difference between passing through and setting up shop.   Transient rat or all out infestation.  In the last few years, multiple packs have been working the Methow.  Many reports have been filed, and they all were dismissed or categorized as the lookout pack.   It wouldnt take much time for any woodsman worth his salt, to figure out there are several packs working the valley and even roughly what their boundaries are.   

not according to Bobcat(wetside) and idhunter((newly indoctrinated Bio) they know better than those that live with wolves on the daily 

If it wouldn't take much time to figure out packs/boundaries perhaps you guys could provide them, along with supporting evidence like locations/photos of all these different wolves that are apparently everywhere and very easy to find.  Post all of this easy to obtain information in a comprehensive document so WDFW can't easily ignore it...kind of like what UC is doing to expose corruption and incompetence with the enforcement branch.   

[mfswallace]

In the early 90's there were signs posted at trailheads in the north Cascades asking people to report any wolf sightings. So, the presence of wolves surely was not unknown.

The lookout pack was KNOWN in the late 80s.  It was studied and hunting season was even halted in the Alta for three years because of it.   Distrust began there.  It becomes extremely hard to take them serious with all of the politics and games.   If they had been honest from day one, then this might not be such a laughable manner.  How many of you non local people knew of the Libby Creek pack?  That's what we all called it including government officials.  Then decades later "it was discovered".   They had been studying it for some time.  Its gets very tiring explaining this to every neophyte that picks up a paper and reads about the methow valley.  So yes, a little local knowledge goes a long ways, or in this case a lot of local knowledge.   As I have stated before, Ill never forget when the biologist called my Dad when I was there visiting.  We were watching several wolves out the front window of his house.   The biologist had never seen them and he had been studying them for two years.  Kind of hard to have a firm grasp on what you are studying if you never have even seen the animal. LOL    As for wolf sightings, well there have been wolves in the Methow for decades if not centuries.  Many just passing through.  There is a big difference between passing through and setting up shop.   Transient rat or all out infestation.  In the last few years, multiple packs have been working the Methow.  Many reports have been filed, and they all were dismissed or categorized as the lookout pack.   It wouldnt take much time for any woodsman worth his salt, to figure out there are several packs working the valley and even roughly what their boundaries are.   

not according to Bobcat(wetside) and idhunter((newly indoctrinated Bio) they know better than those that live with wolves on the daily 

If it wouldn't take much time to figure out packs/boundaries perhaps you guys could provide them, along with supporting evidence like locations/photos of all these different wolves that are apparently everywhere and very easy to find.  Post all of this easy to obtain information in a comprehensive document so WDFW can't easily ignore it...kind of like what UC is doing to expose corruption and incompetence with the enforcement branch.

Wait wait wait, your talking about an organization that has ignored information on wolves for how long now
And using UC's Great efforts and info to make your point is unfortunately laughable  cause after 3-4 months they are Ignoring it!!

Why would it be different after 25+ years of denial and ignoring the folks living with wolves

[Special T]

How about we just line them up in a row so that the wdfw could determine sex age weight and relations? It would look something like this!



Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I547 using Tapatalk

[villageidiot]

Quote from: bobcat on November 28, 2015, 07:32:25 PM
In the early 90's there were signs posted at trailheads in the north Cascades asking people to report any wolf sightings. So, the presence of wolves surely was not unknown.

The lookout pack was KNOWN in the late 80s.  It was studied and hunting season was even halted in the Alta for three years because of it.   Distrust began there.  It becomes extremely hard to take them serious with all of the politics and games.   If they had been honest from day one, then this might not be such a laughable manner.  How many of you non local people knew of the Libby Creek pack?  That's what we all called it including government officials.  Then decades later "it was discovered".   They had been studying it for some time.  Its gets very tiring explaining this to every neophyte that picks up a paper and reads about the methow valley.  So yes, a little local knowledge goes a long ways, or in this case a lot of local knowledge.   As I have stated before, Ill never forget when the biologist called my Dad when I was there visiting.  We were watching several wolves out the front window of his house.   The biologist had never seen them and he had been studying them for two years.  Kind of hard to have a firm grasp on what you are studying if you never have even seen the animal. LOL    As for wolf sightings, well there have been wolves in the Methow for decades if not centuries.  Many just passing through.  There is a big difference between passing through and setting up shop.   Transient rat or all out infestation.  In the last few years, multiple packs have been working the Methow.  Many reports have been filed, and they all were dismissed or categorized as the lookout pack.   It wouldnt take much time for any woodsman worth his salt, to figure out there are several packs working the valley and even roughly what their boundaries are.   

not according to Bobcat(wetside) and idhunter((newly indoctrinated Bio) they know better than those that live with wolves on the daily   
If it wouldn't take much time to figure out packs/boundaries perhaps you guys could provide them, along with supporting evidence like locations/photos of all these different wolves that are apparently everywhere and very easy to find.  Post all of this easy to obtain information in a comprehensive document so WDFW can't easily ignore it...kind of like what UC is doing to expose corruption and incompetence with the enforcement branch.   

We must have forgotten about the rancher in Twisp that reported to two different forest service bios about wolves on his place.  Don't forget that one even told him " I will put that in my file with my Bigfoot sightings" . Both told him he was mistaken so after loseing a dog and a calf and then the wolves started crossing his sons driveway a mile long that the three grandkids walked to the school bus every day they declared war on the wolves.  This was all spelled out clearly in a letter he wrote to the judge and prosecuting attorney right before the trial.  The newspapers kept this silent but nearly every rancher has heard about this in Okanogan county by now.  Why would any of them waste their time reporting a wolf pack or problems when in the end they have to deal with it themselves.

[wolfbait]

Quote from: bobcat on November 28, 2015, 07:32:25 PM
In the early 90's there were signs posted at trailheads in the north Cascades asking people to report any wolf sightings. So, the presence of wolves surely was not unknown.

The lookout pack was KNOWN in the late 80s.  It was studied and hunting season was even halted in the Alta for three years because of it.   Distrust began there.  It becomes extremely hard to take them serious with all of the politics and games.   If they had been honest from day one, then this might not be such a laughable manner.  How many of you non local people knew of the Libby Creek pack?  That's what we all called it including government officials.  Then decades later "it was discovered".   They had been studying it for some time.  Its gets very tiring explaining this to every neophyte that picks up a paper and reads about the methow valley.  So yes, a little local knowledge goes a long ways, or in this case a lot of local knowledge.   As I have stated before, Ill never forget when the biologist called my Dad when I was there visiting.  We were watching several wolves out the front window of his house.   The biologist had never seen them and he had been studying them for two years.  Kind of hard to have a firm grasp on what you are studying if you never have even seen the animal. LOL    As for wolf sightings, well there have been wolves in the Methow for decades if not centuries.  Many just passing through.  There is a big difference between passing through and setting up shop.   Transient rat or all out infestation.  In the last few years, multiple packs have been working the Methow.  Many reports have been filed, and they all were dismissed or categorized as the lookout pack.   It wouldnt take much time for any woodsman worth his salt, to figure out there are several packs working the valley and even roughly what their boundaries are.   

not according to Bobcat(wetside) and idhunter((newly indoctrinated Bio) they know better than those that live with wolves on the daily   
If it wouldn't take much time to figure out packs/boundaries perhaps you guys could provide them, along with supporting evidence like locations/photos of all these different wolves that are apparently everywhere and very easy to find.  Post all of this easy to obtain information in a comprehensive document so WDFW can't easily ignore it...kind of like what UC is doing to expose corruption and incompetence with the enforcement branch.   

We must have forgotten about the rancher in Twisp that reported to two different forest service bios about wolves on his place.  Don't forget that one even told him " I will put that in my file with my Bigfoot sightings" . Both told him he was mistaken so after loseing a dog and a calf and then the wolves started crossing his sons driveway a mile long that the three grandkids walked to the school bus every day they declared war on the wolves.  This was all spelled out clearly in a letter he wrote to the judge and prosecuting attorney right before the trial.  The newspapers kept this silent but nearly every rancher has heard about this in Okanogan county by now.  Why would any of them waste their time reporting a wolf pack or problems when in the end they have to deal with it themselves.

"Why would any of them waste their time reporting a wolf pack or problems when in the end they have to deal with it themselves"

A short story

Wolves and silence

WDFW and their partners would like silence for their wolves, meaning it you don't like the wolves shut-up. People can report as many wolves as they wish and WDFW will remain silent. Wolves can slaughter livestock and the ungulates herds etc. and WDFW will remain silent, if they can.

Do to all the silence, recipes evolved.

For information on wolf recipes contact the people of ID, MT, WY etc.

The End

[GameHunter1959]

In the early 90's there were signs posted at trailheads in the north Cascades asking people to report any wolf sightings. So, the presence of wolves surely was not unknown.

The lookout pack was KNOWN in the late 80s.  It was studied and hunting season was even halted in the Alta for three years because of it.   Distrust began there.  It becomes extremely hard to take them serious with all of the politics and games.   If they had been honest from day one, then this might not be such a laughable manner.  How many of you non local people knew of the Libby Creek pack?  That's what we all called it including government officials.  Then decades later "it was discovered".   They had been studying it for some time.  Its gets very tiring explaining this to every neophyte that picks up a paper and reads about the methow valley.  So yes, a little local knowledge goes a long ways, or in this case a lot of local knowledge.   As I have stated before, Ill never forget when the biologist called my Dad when I was there visiting.  We were watching several wolves out the front window of his house.   The biologist had never seen them and he had been studying them for two years.  Kind of hard to have a firm grasp on what you are studying if you never have even seen the animal. LOL    As for wolf sightings, well there have been wolves in the Methow for decades if not centuries.  Many just passing through.  There is a big difference between passing through and setting up shop.   Transient rat or all out infestation.  In the last few years, multiple packs have been working the Methow.  Many reports have been filed, and they all were dismissed or categorized as the lookout pack.   It wouldnt take much time for any woodsman worth his salt, to figure out there are several packs working the valley and even roughly what their boundaries are.   

not according to Bobcat(wetside) and idhunter((newly indoctrinated Bio) they know better than those that live with wolves on the daily 

If it wouldn't take much time to figure out packs/boundaries perhaps you guys could provide them, along with supporting evidence like locations/photos of all these different wolves that are apparently everywhere and very easy to find.  Post all of this easy to obtain information in a comprehensive document so WDFW can't easily ignore it...kind of like what UC is doing to expose corruption and incompetence with the enforcement branch.

That is what I'm saying. Post all the easy to obtain pictures, locations, etc.

Wolfbait- I have followed your wolf posts on here, for around 5 years or so. You post all these articles, anti WSDFW opinions, conspiracy theories, etc. You claim you see wolves all the time and they are taking over the Methow and the rest of Washington State. I have never seen you post any "hard evidence" on a regular basis to sway anyone on Hunt Wa to believe in all your posts.

I'm not saying you are wrong; nor do I support wolves. Yes I know wolves are growing in numbers. But go back 3-5 years and read your posts. Based off your theories the majority of WA State residents should be seeing wolves regularly.

I have mentioned your name to several Hunt WA members offline. The first thing they say is "Ohhh that guy!" followed by a "laugh" and a comical opinion about you and your conspiracy theories. Most think you are full of shhhhhhh.

Do you honestly think people take your posts seriously?

I think you post some great information, which is taken seriously by some. But I also think 90% of your posts get laughed at, as you have never posted a trail cam picture, videos, etc. of the mass amounts of wolves around your house and the Methow.

Post some stuff up and people will begin to get behind you and take you more seriously.

[MtnMuley]

Wow, gamehunter, I can't believe you're the one calling somebody out on here as laughable. Hmmm......seems you were on the end of a few laughable comments before to us locals.......

[wolfbait]

In the early 90's there were signs posted at trailheads in the north Cascades asking people to report any wolf sightings. So, the presence of wolves surely was not unknown.

The lookout pack was KNOWN in the late 80s.  It was studied and hunting season was even halted in the Alta for three years because of it.   Distrust began there.  It becomes extremely hard to take them serious with all of the politics and games.   If they had been honest from day one, then this might not be such a laughable manner.  How many of you non local people knew of the Libby Creek pack?  That's what we all called it including government officials.  Then decades later "it was discovered".   They had been studying it for some time.  Its gets very tiring explaining this to every neophyte that picks up a paper and reads about the methow valley.  So yes, a little local knowledge goes a long ways, or in this case a lot of local knowledge.   As I have stated before, Ill never forget when the biologist called my Dad when I was there visiting.  We were watching several wolves out the front window of his house.   The biologist had never seen them and he had been studying them for two years.  Kind of hard to have a firm grasp on what you are studying if you never have even seen the animal. LOL    As for wolf sightings, well there have been wolves in the Methow for decades if not centuries.  Many just passing through.  There is a big difference between passing through and setting up shop.   Transient rat or all out infestation.  In the last few years, multiple packs have been working the Methow.  Many reports have been filed, and they all were dismissed or categorized as the lookout pack.   It wouldnt take much time for any woodsman worth his salt, to figure out there are several packs working the valley and even roughly what their boundaries are.   

not according to Bobcat(wetside) and idhunter((newly indoctrinated Bio) they know better than those that live with wolves on the daily 

If it wouldn't take much time to figure out packs/boundaries perhaps you guys could provide them, along with supporting evidence like locations/photos of all these different wolves that are apparently everywhere and very easy to find.  Post all of this easy to obtain information in a comprehensive document so WDFW can't easily ignore it...kind of like what UC is doing to expose corruption and incompetence with the enforcement branch.

That is what I'm saying. Post all the easy to obtain pictures, locations, etc.

Wolfbait- I have followed your wolf posts on here, for around 5 years or so. You post all these articles, anti WSDFW opinions, conspiracy theories, etc. You claim you see wolves all the time and they are taking over the Methow and the rest of Washington State. I have never seen you post any "hard evidence" on a regular basis to sway anyone on Hunt Wa to believe in all your posts.

I'm not saying you are wrong; nor do I support wolves. Yes I know wolves are growing in numbers. But go back 3-5 years and read your posts. Based off your theories the majority of WA State residents should be seeing wolves regularly.

I have mentioned your name to several Hunt WA members offline. The first thing they say is "Ohhh that guy!" followed by a "laugh" and a comical opinion about you and your conspiracy theories. Most think you are full of shhhhhhh.

Do you honestly think people take your posts seriously?

I think you post some great information, which is taken seriously by some. But I also think 90% of your posts get laughed at, as you have never posted a trail cam picture, videos, etc. of the mass amounts of wolves around your house and the Methow.

Post some stuff up and people will begin to get behind you and take you more seriously.

  Oh great one………...

[mountainman]

Growing up in the Methow, I remember seeing wolves several times a year. Residents or transients, don't know. Didn't study them or track them. Hear the howls every couple years up the Loop every couple years for the last 25 or so years. Does seem off they are just now being confirmed. Bone, you said it best. Wolfbait, yea, never will convince others...