Stop the National Carry Permit!

[Bean Counter]

http://dailycaller.com/2016/12/14/korwin-stop-the-national-handgun-carry-permit/

"...Too many gun owners, including some leaders of the gun-rights movement, sincere but totally misinformed and misdirected, are salivating for our permit-carrying president elect to issue some sort of national carry plan. It cannot, must not, better not be a national permit in any way shape or form...

[Constitutional Carry]...State after state has enacted this – freedom to carry with no government interference whatsoever. You can carry a gun pretty much like you can carry a book. It’s called rights.

And everyone knows books are dangerous. Just look at deaths caused by the Quoran, or the Commie Manifesto..."

[huntingbaldguy]

I agree.  If every state passed constitutional carry then there's zero need for a national permit and it won't give the government more info that they don't need.

[Special T]

I think it sets a dangerous precedent. Every state should have constitutional carry, I would be much happier if states entered into reciprocity agreements with each other, and the General rules of the Road were condensed and explained online for each state.

[Fl0und3rz]

The devil is always in the details, and the enemy of the perfect is not always the good.

Recognition

One small step in the right direction is a recognition bill. This would require states to recognize the permits already issued by the states. True, it would further entrench the existing sidearm permit system, but we have to face the fact that it is already in place, and it’s likely a good first step. It advances the freedom of millions of Americans, puts more honest armed citizens out in public, and we know this deters and prevents crime. It also softens the antis arguments.

For example, the National Right-to-Carry Reciprocity Act of 2011 proposed recognition as alluded to above.

It will not in any way prevent further efforts of citizens of the several states from pushing their states toward constitutional carry, while advancing the rights and liberties of millions of gun owners.

So while I agree that a National Permit system is DOA, lets not hold out for nothing but constitutional carry across the land.

[Special T]

So if your from a constitutional carry state like ID or Vermont do you have to have a pice of paper in another state?

[Fl0und3rz]

That's how that reciprocity bill reads.  Simple fix in response to such a requirement would be for CC states to issue a state certificate of eligibility for CC to everyone eligible.

Or even easier, allow people to print their own.

[Special T]

That's how that reciprocity bill reads.  Simple fix in response to such a requirement would be for CC states to issue a state certificate of eligibility for CC to everyone eligible.

Or even easier, allow people to print their own.

Printing your own would fry the brains of most anti gunners! I love it!

[Fl0und3rz]

http://www.guns.com/2016/12/06/nationwide-reciprocity-bill-ready-to-introduce-in-2017/

[csaaphill]

Personally I don't like needing a state permit either, our second amendment should be our permit. Didn't Idaho just pass that you don't need a state issued permit to carry concealed?
All states should be that way and then be allow nationally but not as a permit.
Since that's not they way, while I don't think the Federal Govt is the way to go I do think you should be able to carry nation wide with what ever state permit you have, or don't have if your state allows.
I know a long shot, but what are the odds that Washington could pass a law like Idaho just did?

[Fl0und3rz]

60/40 against, if past elections are any guide.

[Stein]

60/40 against, if past elections are any guide.

At least that bad, maybe even worse.

Holding out for the perfect solution often leads to having to live with a 10% solution.  Sometimes the 80% solution is the way to go. 

If you are for concealed carry, I can't understand why you would be against something that moves the ball in the direction you want.  Virtually nothing in this country happens all at once, you take what you can get when you can get it and move mountains over time.

[Bean Counter]

For those of us who have paid the pearl of great price, this brings very little benefit and a whole lot of downside. I already have an 80%+ solution where I live now. I can already carry a gun in my state without a permission slip from the government, why would I want to risk setting the precedent that some day your federal legislators may outnumber my federal legislators and reverse that paradise just because you want to borrow a state effect from my state legislators that yours would not do for you? 

For one reason or the next, millions of guns owners chose to live in Seattle (People's Repugnant of), Portlandia, and the Urine Colored State. That is a choice, and along with the infringements that come with the arrangement. Don't like it? Pack up and move. 

[Fl0und3rz]

As noted in the other thread:

For such a big fan of the Constitution, you are not much of a fan of individual rights.  Rather than overly focusing on states rights, vis a vis the federal government (the trees), why not instead focus on the individual rights protected directly by the Constitution (the forest) and as already recognized by the courts.

http://www.nationalreview.com/article/443143/gun-rights-reciprocity-constitution-may-require-it

In our system of Constitutional governance, regarding the hierarchy of individual and states' rights and federal powers, you seemingly miss the boat by ignoring the individual's preeminent rights. 

Reciprocity would merely entail restating such Constitutional principles, while fully protecting the rights to free interstate travel (without having to give up Constitutionally protected right to self-defense), without creating the federal regulatory scheme associated with a federal CCW permit regime.

A national carry permit is not on the table.  Reciprocity is.  Don't be confused.

[Oh Mah]

Opposing this seems to be the same as opposing the I-591 because we shouldn't need to because of the 2nd.,Well that didn't work out to well did it?I think maybe we should all get together behind the people trying to strengthen our 2nd. which needs our help more these days than ever. 

[Special T]

For those of us who have paid the pearl of great price, this brings very little benefit and a whole lot of downside. I already have an 80%+ solution where I live now. I can already carry a gun in my state without a permission slip from the government, why would I want to risk setting the precedent that some day your federal legislators may outnumber my federal legislators and reverse that paradise just because you want to borrow a state effect from my state legislators that yours would not do for you? 

For one reason or the next, millions of guns owners chose to live in Seattle (People's Repugnant of), Portlandia, and the Urine Colored State. That is a choice, and along with the infringements that come with the arrangement. Don't like it? Pack up and move. 

I have to agree with BC on this one... we need to reinforce states rights.

If this is just a reciprocity agreement I could be OK with it but I'm not sure how it's much different than what is currently available. There are some state that would not accept A Constitutional carry in thier state. CALI OREGON, NEW YORK etc. I'm not sure that is worth fighting for.

I much prefer treating the states like incubators for freedom.