Mute Swan

[jbeaumont21]

I know this topic has been on here before but I still don't have any real evidence that it is legal to shoot one in WA state?    Can anyone confirm?  Had one land in my spread today and had to watch it fly away. 

[Tbar]

https://hunting-washington.com/smf/index.php?topic=61434.0

https://apps.leg.wa.gov/wac/default.aspx?cite=220-640-200
Looks like you notify the department.

[Special T]

Cant shoot swans in the Pacific Flyway... Got to go to the central flyway to do so.

[Stein]

Cant shoot swans in the Pacific Flyway... Got to go to the central flyway to do so.

What's the reference for that?

WDFW has them in the unclassified category which I believe allows hunting all year with a big or small game license - similar to coyotes.

[Night goat]

um aint they federally protected and subject to federal law which is basically unspoken compared to state law?

gotta taste good if theyre protected.....

[Stein]

Feds declared them non-native unprotected in 2005.

[Tbar]

Feds declared them non-native unprotected in 2005.

Are they still protected by WAC?

( 8 ) Escaped animals:

(a) Escaped deleterious exotic wildlife, including Fallow deer (Dama dama) and reindeer (all members of the genus Rangifer, except Rangifer tarandus caribou) will be considered a public nuisance. The department or any peace officer may seize, capture, or destroy deleterious exotic wildlife that have escaped the possessor's control. The former possessor shall be responsible for costs incurred by the department in recovering, maintaining, or disposing of such animals, as well as any damage to the state's wildlife or habitat.

(b) Escapes of deleterious exotic wildlife must be reported immediately to the department.

(c) The recapture or death of escaped deleterious exotic wildlife must be reported immediately to the department.

[Stein]

That's if you are keeping them as pets.  If they escape you need to notify WDFW so the can address it as they are considered a nuisance and compete with native birds.

[Night goat]

um aint they federally protected and subject to federal law which is basically unspoken compared to state law?

gotta taste good if theyre protected.....

Ok quoting myself here.... For me this thread is an ornithology lesson.... I knew about the trumpeter and tundra swans but wasnt aware of the 3rd genus.... So I retract my prior statements

[Special T]

Cant shoot swans in the Pacific Flyway... Got to go to the central flyway to do so.

What's the reference for that?

WDFW has them in the unclassified category which I believe allows hunting all year with a big or small game license - similar to coyotes.

I thought you were at the Washington Waterfowl Association  NW chapter Meeting when Kyle Spragens Waterfowl section MGR talked about this?

They are worried about "accidental harvest" not unlike the the Dusky situation in the SW part of the state... but one of the swans "cant remember which one" is endangered and the accidental killing of those cannot be risked.

[wadu1]

um aint they federally protected and subject to federal law which is basically unspoken compared to state law?

gotta taste good if theyre protected.....

I've had trumpeter swan from Utah a few years ago, it was fantastic. The meat was very pale, like cougar. A friend applied for a permit and drew one of the few that year. I think they still have a hunt for them?

[Stein]

Cant shoot swans in the Pacific Flyway... Got to go to the central flyway to do so.

What's the reference for that?

WDFW has them in the unclassified category which I believe allows hunting all year with a big or small game license - similar to coyotes.

I thought you were at the Washington Waterfowl Association  NW chapter Meeting when Kyle Spragens Waterfowl section MGR talked about this?

They are worried about "accidental harvest" not unlike the the Dusky situation in the SW part of the state... but one of the swans "cant remember which one" is endangered and the accidental killing of those cannot be risked.

No, must have missed that one but it does make sense.  I couldn’t find it in the regs or wacs, could be another phantom dept rule.


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[Stein]

um aint they federally protected and subject to federal law which is basically unspoken compared to state law?

gotta taste good if theyre protected.....

I've had trumpeter swan from Utah a few years ago, it was fantastic. The meat was very pale, like cougar. A friend applied for a permit and drew one of the few that year. I think they still have a hunt for them?

You probably had tundra swan?


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[Special T]

um aint they federally protected and subject to federal law which is basically unspoken compared to state law?

gotta taste good if theyre protected.....

I've had trumpeter swan from Utah a few years ago, it was fantastic. The meat was very pale, like cougar. A friend applied for a permit and drew one of the few that year. I think they still have a hunt for them?

You probably had tundra swan?


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At that meeting we were told it was more likely we would get a swan season than a second bag limit for Mergansers... (both were low so he said)

[callturner]

In a nutshell it says they are not federally protected but you need permission from wdfw

[BD1]

Don't shoot it...just my 

[Stein]

um aint they federally protected and subject to federal law which is basically unspoken compared to state law?

gotta taste good if theyre protected.....

I've had trumpeter swan from Utah a few years ago, it was fantastic. The meat was very pale, like cougar. A friend applied for a permit and drew one of the few that year. I think they still have a hunt for them?

You probably had tundra swan?


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At that meeting we were told it was more likely we would get a swan season than a second bag limit for Mergansers... (both were low so he said)

Yeah, swans won't happen as they are way to difficult to tell apart and there are obviously a ton of trumpeters in WA.  Someday if they are delisted and other states open seasons, maybe, but certainly not before then.  I wouldn't be comfortable trying to tell them apart, but would like to go to a state that has tundra but not trumpeter and hunt them on a guided trip, along with sandhills.

[callturner]

Seasons open for both in Montana.

[callturner]

Swans too!

[callturner]

More

[callturner]

Sandhill

[callturner]

Walter

[Night goat]

That sandhill looks kike something straight out of Jurassic Park

[callturner]

Their really cool watching them dancing .

[pianoman9701]

Swans Are Protected by federal and state laws and are closed to harvest
Swan, Tundra or Trumpeter
(White adult, gray juvenile, Protected Species)

This is from the regs.

[storyteller]

Three Westerns states — Montana, Utah and Nevada — allow tundra swan hunting, and Idaho is considering a hunt in its Panhandle counties.Dec 29, 2019

[jbeaumont21]

https://www.federalregister.gov/documents/2005/01/04/05-55/draft-list-of-bird-species-to-which-the-migratory-bird-treaty-act-does-not-apply

https://portal.ct.gov/DEEP/Wildlife/Fact-Sheets/Mute-Swan#:~:text=Because%20the%20mute%20swan%20is,range%20to%20actively%20manage%20populations.

Because the mute swan is an exotic species, it is not protected under the federal Migratory Bird Treaty Act of 1916, making it possible for states throughout this bird's North American range to actively manage populations.

There is nothing in the WA regs specifically about mute swans

[Special T]

https://www.federalregister.gov/documents/2005/01/04/05-55/draft-list-of-bird-species-to-which-the-migratory-bird-treaty-act-does-not-apply

https://portal.ct.gov/DEEP/Wildlife/Fact-Sheets/Mute-Swan#:~:text=Because%20the%20mute%20swan%20is,range%20to%20actively%20manage%20populations.

Because the mute swan is an exotic species, it is not protected under the federal Migratory Bird Treaty Act of 1916, making it possible for states throughout this bird's North American range to actively manage populations.

There is nothing in the WA regs specifically about mute swans

Ok so lead the way, go shoot one and post up some pics... 

All i can do is relay what the waterfowl section MGR told us at a Washington Waterfowl Association NW chapter meeting.

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[Stein]

Depending on the warden, you could get a ticket citing the WAC referencing violation of a department rule then ironically it is up to you to prove no such rule exists.


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[BD1]

I was taught at a very young age what to shoot if it was white (snow geese) anything else was just to enjoy their flight and sounds. Not going to weigh in on if it is legal or not...I was simply taught that it wasn't, simple as that. The fight you would face probably isn't worth the meal or mount. I would like to travel somewhere where it is cut and dry and harvest a big white someday though 

[callturner]

Judging from the federal invasion map the mute swan is not very wide spread . Just treat it like you would any other swan and go find a place to shoot a legal one. 

[jbeaumont21]

I'm not going to shoot one. The risk is not worth the reward.  Just would be nice to know one way or the other.  I see many other states make it pretty clear cut one way or the other and even allow shooting of them.  I guess one could consider the WA regs that reads Swans - closed state wide to be pretty straightforward though...  Oh well

[Caseyd]

.

[Fastass350]

We had a couple dozen coming into our setups the last couple days, cool to see coming in within range and just watching them go. They set in the field a hundred yards out or so, actually think it helped bring the geese in maybe.

[Stein]

.

Looks like a trumpeter?

[Guzman]

The species “mute swan” is invasive and should be legal to shoot. I would say it probably isn’t worth tha hastle but would seem legal to me.

Washington not having an actual swan season is a complete joke to me. More politics than science in my mind.

[Skyvalhunter]

Love to see the brief foot pursuit and squabble on video

[Stein]

The species “mute swan” is invasive and should be legal to shoot. I would say it probably isn’t worth tha hastle but would seem legal to me.

Washington not having an actual swan season is a complete joke to me. More politics than science in my mind.

Way too many trumpeter and way too few tundras.  States that have swan seasons usually have the other situation, tons of tundras and few if any trumpeters.  It would be too difficult to tell the difference.

With mutes, yeah, if it has an orange beak it should be legal to shoot.  I think the WDFW release above is incorrect, I don't think there are federal laws against shooting mutes, only state law.

[KP-Skagit]

More and more and more swans than there every used to be. Unfortunately I do not ever see a season in this state.

When I was a kid I used to jump shoot a lot in some fields near our house. One year we heard there was a whooper swan around. The next morning I get up and head out with the dog and by the time I reach the first ditch there was about 200 cars lined up on a nearby the road looking at a group of swans in the field.

Obviously I never used to shoot at the swans but they would jump when I shot. I figured there was NO way I was going to deal with that scrutiny and potential reports of someone "shooting swans". I turned around and went back home.

I did see the whooper out there. Lots of yellow on the bill.

[ASHQUACK]

I drew a tag in Mt this year and was moderately successful. 

[callturner]

Nice bird. Freezout?

[ASHQUACK]

Nice bird. Freezout?

Yes, 1st one ever.

[Stein]

How was the meat?

[ASHQUACK]

Pretty dang good. Almost a cross between goose and elk.

[huntindoc]

You get that swan without a guide?

[ASHQUACK]

Yes, total freelance hunt.

You get that swan without a guide?